This is what Margaret Smith was talking about to Jane Edamson in the last GA segment…this is the tropical “forest” garden that Jane was looking at, in Camberwell, Melbourne, Vic (home of the cottage garden apparently…remind me not to go there any time soon…)

Decomposed Granitic sand…Jane didn’t really let Margaret explain exactly how it was applied…I’m was hoping that they just laid it on, but it looks like they might have dug it in???

Dinetta said:

This is what Margaret Smith was talking about to Jane Edamson in the last GA segment…this is the tropical “forest” garden that Jane was looking at, in Camberwell, Melbourne, Vic (home of the cottage garden apparently…remind me not to go there any time soon…)

Decomposed Granitic sand…Jane didn’t really let Margaret explain exactly how it was applied…I’m was hoping that they just laid it on, but it looks like they might have dug it in???

i have bought and applied basalt dust in my garden – as well as coal gravel. i just spread it thinly when applying other manures. it would take months if not years to be incorporated in the soil. i treat these plus lime, dolomite, rock phosphate as ‘mineral mix and apply them yearly.
the BD enthusiasts also add microfine quartz dust in the belief its reflective properties heat the soil – or summin like that.

We’ve got decomposed granite for the digging, we use it to fill the potholes in the driveway…are you saying I could spread it over the yard and eventually get a more stable clay (as opposed to the cracking that happens when the clay dries)

Sorry, that’s decomposed BASALT…not sure if the same as granite?

http://www.baag.com.au/yard_products.html

++++++++++++++++

this is inneresting…apparently I can use decomposed basalt for under pavers, etc…

a barrowload doesn’t go far…but collecting it (think that slim pile-driver-type tool, about 7 foot long with a screw-driver end) sure uses up the calories…

Dinetta said:

We’ve got decomposed granite for the digging, we use it to fill the potholes in the driveway…are you saying I could spread it over the yard and eventually get a more stable clay (as opposed to the cracking that happens when the clay dries)

no – its a fertiliser – so wouldn’t effect the properties of clay other than in the way sand does.
basalt is young volcanic rock and its said that australia is very old in geological terms and therefore less fertile than recently volcanic areas.
granite is old volcanic rock – more like quartz.

pepe said:

Dinetta said:

We’ve got decomposed granite for the digging, we use it to fill the potholes in the driveway…are you saying I could spread it over the yard and eventually get a more stable clay (as opposed to the cracking that happens when the clay dries)

no – its a fertiliser – so wouldn’t effect the properties of clay other than in the way sand does.
basalt is young volcanic rock and its said that australia is very old in geological terms and therefore less fertile than recently volcanic areas.
granite is old volcanic rock – more like quartz.

The clay here only goes down about 1 metre…no wonder they stopped farming it and turned it into large homesites…farms all around tho’, fuelled by anhydrous ammonia…

pepe said:

Dinetta said:

We’ve got decomposed granite for the digging, we use it to fill the potholes in the driveway…are you saying I could spread it over the yard and eventually get a more stable clay (as opposed to the cracking that happens when the clay dries)

no – its a fertiliser – so wouldn’t effect the properties of clay other than in the way sand does.
basalt is young volcanic rock and its said that australia is very old in geological terms and therefore less fertile than recently volcanic areas.
granite is old volcanic rock – more like quartz.

thanks for that, Pepe…MrD was saying rotted basalt and he generally knows his soil types…I could ask at the DPI if I get a Round Tuit….

Dinetta said:

pepe said:

Dinetta said:

We’ve got decomposed granite for the digging, we use it to fill the potholes in the driveway…are you saying I could spread it over the yard and eventually get a more stable clay (as opposed to the cracking that happens when the clay dries)

no – its a fertiliser – so wouldn’t effect the properties of clay other than in the way sand does.
basalt is young volcanic rock and its said that australia is very old in geological terms and therefore less fertile than recently volcanic areas.
granite is old volcanic rock – more like quartz.

thanks for that, Pepe…MrD was saying rotted basalt and he generally knows his soil types…I could ask at the DPI if I get a Round Tuit….

Oh Dinetta..I used to have a Round Tuit…..but I lost it! I think I threw it out …lol

the properties of rock dust are kinda mystical
there’s no doubt they contain minerals – but some results – such as wa wheat farmers using basalt getting 30% improvement in yields – seem to indicate they can do a lot of good.
i am being guided by others in this – but remember it was josh byrne who used a mysterious ‘mineral mix’ in a few of his segments.

pepe said:

Dinetta said:

We’ve got decomposed granite for the digging, we use it to fill the potholes in the driveway…are you saying I could spread it over the yard and eventually get a more stable clay (as opposed to the cracking that happens when the clay dries)

no – its a fertiliser – so wouldn’t effect the properties of clay other than in the way sand does.
basalt is young volcanic rock and its said that australia is very old in geological terms and therefore less fertile than recently volcanic areas.
granite is old volcanic rock – more like quartz.

Since when did rocks be old or young? :)

Basalt is finer grained due to being thrown out of a volcano and cooling quickly in the air. Granite never exits the volcano and cools as magma under the surface so thus cools slowly and has larger crystals. The other differences are that Basalt is on the surface and erodes on the surface to make fertile soils but granite has to be eroded out or dug out.

Australia is very old yes but it does take a very long time to break down basalt and erode granite up out of the soil. Recent volcanic areas are dead and barren places covered in volcanic ash.. Where nothing can grow for a while. So Australia’s age is not what gives it poor soil. Australia hasn’t seen vulcanism for more than a million years and that’s why some of our most fertile areas such as the Darling downs have dark basalt rich soil.

Australian soils are generally phosphorous deficient. Australian clays are generally the heaviest and most compacted. Otherwise there is nothing wrong with our soils. This is why we dug up most of the island of Nauru. To bring home the guano and make it into superphosphate.

Yes granite and basalt dusts are good for your garden. I find that the finely crushed gravel is great for drainage .. better than sand. This can also be used to make a driveway that will set like cement. Many people call it tennis court gravel.

AnneS said:

Dinetta said:

pepe said:

no – its a fertiliser – so wouldn’t effect the properties of clay other than in the way sand does.
basalt is young volcanic rock and its said that australia is very old in geological terms and therefore less fertile than recently volcanic areas.
granite is old volcanic rock – more like quartz.

thanks for that, Pepe…MrD was saying rotted basalt and he generally knows his soil types…I could ask at the DPI if I get a Round Tuit….

Oh Dinetta..I used to have a Round Tuit…..but I lost it! I think I threw it out …lol

Someone gave me a round tuit.. Said “there you have finally got around tuit”
I promptly forgot where I put it.

Actually the soils I have gardened on have either been heavy saline clay in rice growing country or highly alkaline calcrete.

Since when did rocks be old or young?
——
beforemytime but..

volcanic, alluvial, metamorphised – sedimentary, tertiary – rocks are aged according to how many processes they have been thru’ since being spewed out the volcano.

some parts of the flinders ranges have been – below the oceans, accumulated alluvial eroded material, been uplifted to the height of the himalayers, eroded back down, uplifted and eroded again – so old – they find seashell deposits (dating back to the beginning of life on earth) on top of peaks.

pepe said:

Since when did rocks be old or young?
——
beforemytime but..

volcanic, alluvial, metamorphised – sedimentary, tertiary – rocks are aged according to how many processes they have been thru’ since being spewed out the volcano.

some parts of the flinders ranges have been – below the oceans, accumulated alluvial eroded material, been uplifted to the height of the himalayers, eroded back down, uplifted and eroded again – so old – they find seashell deposits (dating back to the beginning of life on earth) on top of peaks.

Yes rocks can be very old but the distinction I was pointing out was that you said granite was old and basalt was young.. This may well be true in different parts of a volcano but the main difference between granite and basalt is that one cools quickly from lava and the other cools slowly from magma. Magma becomes lava when it leaves the volcano.

a young organic enthusiast sold me coal, saying it was 30,000 y.o. compost.
he was right in a way – compost will eventually turn to oil and coal.
our man pete c. has taken to burying charcoal in the soil as well.
age has got summin to do with it.
blowed if i know all the answers tho’.

roughbarked said:

Since when did rocks be old or young? :)

Otherwise there is nothing wrong with our soils.

Just for discussion, what about the “pug clay” found around Mackay? They grow sugarcane here but it’s apparently a m****ngrl of a soil to work…

pepe said:

a young organic enthusiast sold me coal, saying it was 30,000 y.o. compost.
he was right in a way – compost will eventually turn to oil and coal.
our man pete c. has taken to burying charcoal in the soil as well.
age has got summin to do with it.
blowed if i know all the answers tho’.

Coal is used in many of the bagged potting mixes.. how do you think they get it so black?
Compost never turns into coal or oil. Coal and oil are created by compressing layers of unrotted material that has been trapped under rocks in airless spaces.
Compost turns into friable humus and requires air to be made..

AnneS said:

Oh Dinetta..I used to have a Round Tuit…..but I lost it! I think I threw it out …lol

..and they are so hard to find these days, aren’t they? used to be as common as muck back in the 70’s…a more leisured time, now that I look back…

pepe said:

Since when did rocks be old or young?
——
beforemytime but..

volcanic, alluvial, metamorphised – sedimentary, tertiary – rocks are aged according to how many processes they have been thru’ since being spewed out the volcano.

some parts of the flinders ranges have been – below the oceans, accumulated alluvial eroded material, been uplifted to the height of the himalayers, eroded back down, uplifted and eroded again – so old – they find seashell deposits (dating back to the beginning of life on earth) on top of peaks.

This is fascinating…I just lurve geology and is it paleontology? (study of prehistory through fossils and soil sediments / types)?

pepe said:

a young organic enthusiast sold me coal, saying it was 30,000 y.o. compost.
he was right in a way – compost will eventually turn to oil and coal.
our man pete c. has taken to burying charcoal in the soil as well.
age has got summin to do with it.
blowed if i know all the answers tho’.

I used charcoal in the bottom of my pots, and include it with the fern mixes…when I tip my pots out, I tip them into the compost so the charcoal goes in there as well…

Well I think age would have something to do with it, why else would it be called “rotted basalt”…“rot” indicates a process that has taken time…

Dinetta said:

AnneS said:

Oh Dinetta..I used to have a Round Tuit…..but I lost it! I think I threw it out …lol

..and they are so hard to find these days, aren’t they? used to be as common as muck back in the 70’s…a more leisured time, now that I look back…

guess you will just have to make one….. :D

AnneS said:

Dinetta said:

AnneS said:

Oh Dinetta..I used to have a Round Tuit…..but I lost it! I think I threw it out …lol

..and they are so hard to find these days, aren’t they? used to be as common as muck back in the 70’s…a more leisured time, now that I look back…

guess you will just have to make one….. :D

Do I see a business opportunity here LOLOL!

Dinetta said:

pepe said:

a young organic enthusiast sold me coal, saying it was 30,000 y.o. compost.
he was right in a way – compost will eventually turn to oil and coal.
our man pete c. has taken to burying charcoal in the soil as well.
age has got summin to do with it.
blowed if i know all the answers tho’.

I used charcoal in the bottom of my pots, and include it with the fern mixes…when I tip my pots out, I tip them into the compost so the charcoal goes in there as well…

Well I think age would have something to do with it, why else would it be called “rotted basalt”…“rot” indicates a process that has taken time…

http://jersey.uoregon.edu/~mstrick/AskGeoMan/geoQuerry27.html

Decomopsed granite or basalt is simply weathered and yes it takes a long time. Decomposed granite is just old granite rock that has weathered into samller particles over millions of years. The particles are like very coarse sand or very tiny gravel. These particles are coming into common use in various landscaping applications.

Geologists have more technical names for these materials, but DG is the commonly used term. In California, DG often occurs in places where exposed basoliths have weathered and eroded. Examples in California include parts of the Tahoe basin, Shasta Bolly – Grass Valley Creek watersheds west of Redding, and parts of the mountains to the east of San Diego.

DG derived soils are notoriously unstable and subject to very high erosion rates. It has nothing to do with the process of rottng.. It is so named because it is unstable and unsafe in mining industry or on erodable slopes

Dinetta said:

AnneS said:

Dinetta said:

..and they are so hard to find these days, aren’t they? used to be as common as muck back in the 70’s…a more leisured time, now that I look back…

guess you will just have to make one….. :D

Do I see a business opportunity here LOLOL!

The business is alive and well in Tasmania. Round tuits are a common item in tourist shops of Tasmania’s logging country.

roughbarked said:

Dinetta said:

AnneS said:

guess you will just have to make one….. :D

Do I see a business opportunity here LOLOL!

The business is alive and well in Tasmania. Round tuits are a common item in tourist shops of Tasmania’s logging country.

Darn! Too slow! ;)

roughbarked said:

Dinetta said:

pepe said:

a young organic enthusiast sold me coal, saying it was 30,000 y.o. compost.
he was right in a way – compost will eventually turn to oil and coal.
our man pete c. has taken to burying charcoal in the soil as well.
age has got summin to do with it.
blowed if i know all the answers tho’.

I used charcoal in the bottom of my pots, and include it with the fern mixes…when I tip my pots out, I tip them into the compost so the charcoal goes in there as well…

Well I think age would have something to do with it, why else would it be called “rotted basalt”…“rot” indicates a process that has taken time…

http://jersey.uoregon.edu/~mstrick/AskGeoMan/geoQuerry27.html

Decomopsed granite or basalt is simply weathered and yes it takes a long time. Decomposed granite is just old granite rock that has weathered into samller particles over millions of years. The particles are like very coarse sand or very tiny gravel. These particles are coming into common use in various landscaping applications.

Geologists have more technical names for these materials, but DG is the commonly used term. In California, DG often occurs in places where exposed basoliths have weathered and eroded. Examples in California include parts of the Tahoe basin, Shasta Bolly – Grass Valley Creek watersheds west of Redding, and parts of the mountains to the east of San Diego.

DG derived soils are notoriously unstable and subject to very high erosion rates. It has nothing to do with the process of rottng.. It is so named because it is unstable and unsafe in mining industry or on erodable slopes

RB you are a veritable mine of information! I had forgotten most of that geomorphology stuff.

AnneS said:

roughbarked said:

Dinetta said:

I used charcoal in the bottom of my pots, and include it with the fern mixes…when I tip my pots out, I tip them into the compost so the charcoal goes in there as well…

Well I think age would have something to do with it, why else would it be called “rotted basalt”…“rot” indicates a process that has taken time…

http://jersey.uoregon.edu/~mstrick/AskGeoMan/geoQuerry27.html

Decomopsed granite or basalt is simply weathered and yes it takes a long time. Decomposed granite is just old granite rock that has weathered into samller particles over millions of years. The particles are like very coarse sand or very tiny gravel. These particles are coming into common use in various landscaping applications.

Geologists have more technical names for these materials, but DG is the commonly used term. In California, DG often occurs in places where exposed basoliths have weathered and eroded. Examples in California include parts of the Tahoe basin, Shasta Bolly – Grass Valley Creek watersheds west of Redding, and parts of the mountains to the east of San Diego.

DG derived soils are notoriously unstable and subject to very high erosion rates. It has nothing to do with the process of rottng.. It is so named because it is unstable and unsafe in mining industry or on erodable slopes

RB you are a veritable mine of information! I had forgotten most of that geomorphology stuff.

I make most of it up as I go along ;)

roughbarked said:

AnneS said:

roughbarked said:

http://jersey.uoregon.edu/~mstrick/AskGeoMan/geoQuerry27.html

Decomopsed granite or basalt is simply weathered and yes it takes a long time. Decomposed granite is just old granite rock that has weathered into samller particles over millions of years. The particles are like very coarse sand or very tiny gravel. These particles are coming into common use in various landscaping applications.

Geologists have more technical names for these materials, but DG is the commonly used term. In California, DG often occurs in places where exposed basoliths have weathered and eroded. Examples in California include parts of the Tahoe basin, Shasta Bolly – Grass Valley Creek watersheds west of Redding, and parts of the mountains to the east of San Diego.

DG derived soils are notoriously unstable and subject to very high erosion rates. It has nothing to do with the process of rottng.. It is so named because it is unstable and unsafe in mining industry or on erodable slopes

RB you are a veritable mine of information! I had forgotten most of that geomorphology stuff.

I make most of it up as I go along ;)

:)

Dinetta said:

roughbarked said:

Dinetta said:

Do I see a business opportunity here LOLOL!

The business is alive and well in Tasmania. Round tuits are a common item in tourist shops of Tasmania’s logging country.

Darn! Too slow! ;)

I guess you never got a round tuit!

I bought some granitic sand once. It comprised of fine clay particles through to quite large (5mm) sand/rock particles. Usually used as a base for paths etc. as it becomes quite hard if dampened and tamped down. It was recommended to me for the floor of the galahs aviary but they dig it up and mix it up with the dropped husks so it didn’t remain firm.

Atually I’d prefer crushed granite to decomosed granite .. simply because I want the weathered minerals to go into my soil. If I buy already weathered granite then most of the mineral value has already been lost.

bluegreen said:

Dinetta said:

roughbarked said:

The business is alive and well in Tasmania. Round tuits are a common item in tourist shops of Tasmania’s logging country.

Darn! Too slow! ;)

I guess you never got a round tuit!

:)

I ended up with a lot of deco in one of my beds during renovations. It certainly hasn’t done any good.

Hello Forum…here is something spooky it is I the Marg from camberwell and here is the full story
We aimed for a productive garden and we got a mad array of everything from avocado to zataar…all fruiting..there are over 200 species of fruit and herbals

In the part of camberwell melbourne we are in we have disgusting dry grey hydrophobic sand about 600-800 deep over clay. If the water can get thru the waxy oily surface the soil isn’t too bad, but with such hot and dry weather this is really hard and every drop does count . After years of trying to build it up with organic matter of every sort (for 1 season it would be lovely then back to dust the next) we researched a bit and hit upon a large particle sand with clay fines that was pH neutral and had the volcanic soil attributes talked about in this forum… we tried 4 areas with different solutions 1/. granitic sand or dromana toppings with compost and soil wetter dug in deep 2/ granitic sand dug into the top 150mm layer, 3/ granitic sand and charcoal again dug in. 4/ compost and soil wetter..(really bad)

the winner hands down was the sand and charcoal (or now we use coffee grinds from the local shop) we plant in this and mulch with sugarcane. It is also the cheapest. we find 1 cubic metre will do about 20 odd square metres.
All our fertilising is done by foliar spray with NTS fulvic and triple 10 organics and we add humic acid to the soil. We rarely use chook poo because it gives too much softness to the plant and we like a tough baby that will put up with Melbourne extremes. So potashes are our maintstay.
We can water with sprinklers because we collect about 120,000 litres of water a year and it all goes in now due to the sand and charcoal
the garden we have is only 4 years or less old but parts of it look and grow much faster, bushier than we ever expected.
There is no other way than digging..we just put it on the surface and dig it in.
I hope this both helps and clears up the abridged version of gardening australia
our garden is open too and we were open 14-15th Februrary and the GA segment was filmed 2 days later…this was 1 week after the Black Saturday weather and 2.5 months with NO rain..
cheers Marg

WOW! Thanks for dropping in Marg, and explaining that. The time I bought granitic sand, I found it very cheap.

Hi I am not even sure where I am but it’s fun!

marg said:

Hi I am not even sure where I am but it’s fun!

yeah, it’s friendly here. It’s a little “Secret Garden Forum”. LOL!

You are more than welcome to hang around :)

That is spooky. :)

How did you find us Marg?

Talking about coal, Fairhill swears by this stuff. They use it in all their plantings and told me it’s a coal derivative.

http://www.earthlife.com.au/documents/Garden%20Mate%20Info%20Sheet.pdf

Thanks Marg, your garden is amazing.
We’re in Bentleigh and have the grey dust and sand effect. So I’m hoping to follow your lead with the decomposed g.s.

We’ve an area of about 10 square meters of this soil to cover with mulch – soft enough to walk on (two young children play in the area.) The area will not have any plants – it’s simply a cheaper option than paving – the dust and sand is terrible when it gets walked through the house.
I was thinking of putting down weed mat and then red gum mulch (to match the spotted gum decking we have). Has anyone other suggestions?

frances said:

I was thinking of putting down weed mat and then red gum mulch (to match the spotted gum decking we have). Has anyone other suggestions?

your suggestion of weed mat will produce a mixed response. Although it may slow down weed growth, there are some that will still manage to get through it from underneath. And it will do nothing to stop growth of weed seed that falls on top either from wind, birds or your kids’ shoes and clothes. Seed that germinates on top if given half a chance will anchor their roots in the weed mat and removing them could be difficult. Although if your mulch is nice and deep then initially they will be easy to pull out. Once put down, if you change your mind, it is a bugger to remove again!! Another option would be thick layers of newspaper that will help smother existing weeds but will eventually break down and won’t be a problem in itself.

oh, and welcome to our forum frances :)

bluegreen said:

frances said:

I was thinking of putting down weed mat and then red gum mulch (to match the spotted gum decking we have). Has anyone other suggestions?

your suggestion of weed mat will produce a mixed response. Although it may slow down weed growth, there are some that will still manage to get through it from underneath. And it will do nothing to stop growth of weed seed that falls on top either from wind, birds or your kids’ shoes and clothes. Seed that germinates on top if given half a chance will anchor their roots in the weed mat and removing them could be difficult. Although if your mulch is nice and deep then initially they will be easy to pull out. Once put down, if you change your mind, it is a bugger to remove again!! Another option would be thick layers of newspaper that will help smother existing weeds but will eventually break down and won’t be a problem in itself.

There was weed mat in our front yard when we moved in. It may have cut down the number of weeds, but as BG said you still get weeds and top. There were also some hardy weeds growing THROUGH the matting – and it just made them harder to pull out. We got rid of all the matting and put down woodchip mulch instead.

bon008 said:

bluegreen said:

frances said:

I was thinking of putting down weed mat and then red gum mulch (to match the spotted gum decking we have). Has anyone other suggestions?

your suggestion of weed mat will produce a mixed response. Although it may slow down weed growth, there are some that will still manage to get through it from underneath. And it will do nothing to stop growth of weed seed that falls on top either from wind, birds or your kids’ shoes and clothes. Seed that germinates on top if given half a chance will anchor their roots in the weed mat and removing them could be difficult. Although if your mulch is nice and deep then initially they will be easy to pull out. Once put down, if you change your mind, it is a bugger to remove again!! Another option would be thick layers of newspaper that will help smother existing weeds but will eventually break down and won’t be a problem in itself.

There was weed mat in our front yard when we moved in. It may have cut down the number of weeds, but as BG said you still get weeds and top. There were also some hardy weeds growing THROUGH the matting – and it just made them harder to pull out. We got rid of all the matting and put down woodchip mulch instead.

Oops – I meant to say “you still get weeds on top”. Definitely home time, brain has switched off for the day!

the winner hands down was the sand and charcoal (or now we use coffee grinds from the local shop) we plant in this and mulch with sugarcane. It is also the cheapest. we find 1 cubic metre will do about 20 odd square metres.
All our fertilising is done by foliar spray with NTS fulvic and triple 10 organics and we add humic acid to the soil. We rarely use chook poo because it gives too much softness to the plant and we like a tough baby that will put up with Melbourne extremes. So potashes are our maintstay.
——————————-
g’day marg
spoken like an old timer.
look forward to hearing more and welcome.

frances said:

Thanks Marg, your garden is amazing. We’re in Bentleigh and have the grey dust and sand effect. So I’m hoping to follow your lead with the decomposed g.s. We’ve an area of about 10 square meters of this soil to cover with mulch – soft enough to walk on (two young children play in the area.) The area will not have any plants – it’s simply a cheaper option than paving – the dust and sand is terrible when it gets walked through the house.
I was thinking of putting down weed mat and then red gum mulch (to match the spotted gum decking we have). Has anyone other suggestions?

g’day frances
i’m not fond of weed mat – it turns the soil below sour.
grape marc is available from landscape suppliers and they use it under swings in playgrounds.
and welcome.

There was weed mat in our front yard when we moved in. It may have cut down the number of weeds, but as BG said you still get weeds and top. There were also some hardy weeds growing THROUGH the matting – and it just made them harder to pull out. We got rid of all the matting and put down woodchip mulch instead.
———-
ditto here – pulled up the weed mat and put down mulch.

Oh wow!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Fancy Margaret Smith finding us here!

I’m so glad she did, because she has answered my question and filled in the gaps (so to speak) besides. Hope she finds her way over again…I like her style…

Margaret we are “refugees” from the original Gardening Australia forum… before it became the Message Board format it is now…

Our fault was that we liked to chat about this and that, and one thing and another, as well as gardening “proper”… we found the GA Message Board clunky so cb88 very kindly gave us some web space over here…

I hope you come over often, as you are obviously an energetic and pragmatic gardener…

Dinetta said:

http://www.baag.com.au/yard_products.html

++++++++++++++++

this is inneresting…apparently I can use decomposed basalt for under pavers, etc…

a barrowload doesn’t go far…but collecting it (think that slim pile-driver-type tool, about 7 foot long with a screw-driver end) sure uses up the calories…

It’s a crowbar!!

Finally remembered that today…

(I worry about me…)

Dinetta said:

Dinetta said:

http://www.baag.com.au/yard_products.html

++++++++++++++++

this is inneresting…apparently I can use decomposed basalt for under pavers, etc…

a barrowload doesn’t go far…but collecting it (think that slim pile-driver-type tool, about 7 foot long with a screw-driver end) sure uses up the calories…

It’s a crowbar!!

Finally remembered that today…

(I worry about me…)

lol!

hi Dinetta :)

HI BlueGreen

What are you doing up so late?

I am typing reports for MrD… might have found the originals deeeeep in the terminal server…hope so!

Thanks Pepe. Thanks for the welocome.
I’m wondering if the grape marc will hold residual moulds and become slippery after rain. Already have problems with the kids and allergies.

I found this site today after looking for more information about Marg of Camberwell’s granitic sand hint on the GA episode. And then here she is!!

Thanks for all reponses.

Frances.

OK.. You are looking at the guy that made grape marc change status from being considered a usesless waste product bordering on intractable waste..into a product that makes money for those whom have now invested in carting it around the country.

Originally the major potting mix companies in Australia refused to consider using gape marc for several reasons. PH, being the major one. The CSIRO recommended that it not be used for potting mixes. The local distillers gave it away to anyone that wanted it., in fact they were desperate to find someone that wanted it. Local farmers tried it as a soil improving and weed killing mulch but complained of many faults.. ie; washed away and blocked drains .. blew away in the wind.. killed trees because it was too hot..

I was the only one diligently turning up each week for another few ute loads and ordering semi-trailer loads of it. They asked me how was it that I was the only one singing its praises.
Yes it was me who proved all the above BS about grape marc to be erroneous thinking.. The distillers used to give it to a carter who made his dollars from delivering it but he had only one customer.. me. He went out of the business because I prefer to barter than pay money.

The distillers changed their mind and managed to sell the contract to take it away for a princely sum. Remember that I said they couldn’t give it away beforehand. This new business proprietor actually came to see me. He was seeking what it was that I did to make grape marc work for me while others seemed to be lost on the issue. Of course I told him.. “you have a job for me or a partnership?” He wasn’t interested in employing smart people.

Yes I stored hundreds of tonnes of it on my soil before someone wised up..

marg said:

Hello Forum…here is something spooky it is I the Marg from camberwell and here is the full story
We aimed for a productive garden and we got a mad array of everything from avocado to zataar…all fruiting..there are over 200 species of fruit and herbals

In the part of camberwell melbourne we are in we have disgusting dry grey hydrophobic sand about 600-800 deep over clay. If the water can get thru the waxy oily surface the soil isn’t too bad, but with such hot and dry weather this is really hard and every drop does count . After years of trying to build it up with organic matter of every sort (for 1 season it would be lovely then back to dust the next) we researched a bit and hit upon a large particle sand with clay fines that was pH neutral and had the volcanic soil attributes talked about in this forum… we tried 4 areas with different solutions 1/. granitic sand or dromana toppings with compost and soil wetter dug in deep 2/ granitic sand dug into the top 150mm layer, 3/ granitic sand and charcoal again dug in. 4/ compost and soil wetter..(really bad)

the winner hands down was the sand and charcoal (or now we use coffee grinds from the local shop) we plant in this and mulch with sugarcane. It is also the cheapest. we find 1 cubic metre will do about 20 odd square metres.
All our fertilising is done by foliar spray with NTS fulvic and triple 10 organics and we add humic acid to the soil. We rarely use chook poo because it gives too much softness to the plant and we like a tough baby that will put up with Melbourne extremes. So potashes are our maintstay.
We can water with sprinklers because we collect about 120,000 litres of water a year and it all goes in now due to the sand and charcoal
the garden we have is only 4 years or less old but parts of it look and grow much faster, bushier than we ever expected.
There is no other way than digging..we just put it on the surface and dig it in.
I hope this both helps and clears up the abridged version of gardening australia
our garden is open too and we were open 14-15th Februrary and the GA segment was filmed 2 days later…this was 1 week after the Black Saturday weather and 2.5 months with NO rain..
cheers Marg

There is an alternative to digging.. read the grape marc story above.. and realise that I simply put grape marc on at depths of up to eight inches and gardened in pure grape marc by adding manures and any other organic waste I could find. All as mulch.. absolutely no digging was done other than to plant trees.
I am well versed in what I call fatty soils.. ie: those that do not allow water to enter.. but rather cause it to pool and run away. Pretty much most of the soils in Australia are of this particular nature until they are repaired. The reason soils are like this is due to the fact that they have nil organic matter.. you could say they are as I call them, constipated soils, lacking in fibre. Someone mentioned here in another thread re the ashes from the fire.. Well, if you have a wood heater or a stove.. try to use wood that leaves more charcoal than fine grey ash. I won’t show how to do that to any wood because the neighbours will all be dobbing you in to the EPA.
As Marg says above.. get your potash another way, yes get it from your ashes and your charcoal will remain to help open the soil and hold water. Thanks Marg for dropping in and explaining your particular method.

I stay under the radar.. but I have often heard catch phrases I have written.. come back down the train of the public service elevator as.. the now speak.

marg said:

Hello Forum…here is something spooky it is I the Marg from camberwell and here is the full story
We aimed for a productive garden and we got a mad array of everything from avocado to zataar…all fruiting..there are over 200 species of fruit and herbals

In the part of camberwell melbourne we are in we have disgusting dry grey hydrophobic sand about 600-800 deep over clay. If the water can get thru the waxy oily surface the soil isn’t too bad, but with such hot and dry weather this is really hard and every drop does count . After years of trying to build it up with organic matter of every sort (for 1 season it would be lovely then back to dust the next) we researched a bit and hit upon a large particle sand with clay fines that was pH neutral and had the volcanic soil attributes talked about in this forum… we tried 4 areas with different solutions 1/. granitic sand or dromana toppings with compost and soil wetter dug in deep 2/ granitic sand dug into the top 150mm layer, 3/ granitic sand and charcoal again dug in. 4/ compost and soil wetter..(really bad)

the winner hands down was the sand and charcoal (or now we use coffee grinds from the local shop) we plant in this and mulch with sugarcane. It is also the cheapest. we find 1 cubic metre will do about 20 odd square metres.
All our fertilising is done by foliar spray with NTS fulvic and triple 10 organics and we add humic acid to the soil. We rarely use chook poo because it gives too much softness to the plant and we like a tough baby that will put up with Melbourne extremes. So potashes are our maintstay.
We can water with sprinklers because we collect about 120,000 litres of water a year and it all goes in now due to the sand and charcoal
the garden we have is only 4 years or less old but parts of it look and grow much faster, bushier than we ever expected.
There is no other way than digging..we just put it on the surface and dig it in.
I hope this both helps and clears up the abridged version of gardening australia
our garden is open too and we were open 14-15th Februrary and the GA segment was filmed 2 days later…this was 1 week after the Black Saturday weather and 2.5 months with NO rain..
cheers Marg

There is an alternative to digging.. read the grape marc story above.. and realise that I simply put grape marc on at depths of up to eight inches and gardened in pure grape marc by adding manures and any other organic waste I could find. All as mulch.. absolutely no digging was done other than to plant trees.
I am well versed in what I call fatty soils.. ie: those that do not allow water to enter.. but rather cause it to pool and run away. Pretty much most of the soils in Australia are of this particular nature until they are repaired. The reason soils are like this is due to the fact that they have nil organic matter.. you could say they are as I call them, constipated soils, lacking in fibre. Someone mentioned here in another thread re the ashes from the fire.. Well, if you have a wood heater or a stove.. try to use wood that leaves more charcoal than fine grey ash. I won’t show how to do that to any wood because the neighbours will all be dobbing you in to the EPA.
As Marg says above.. get your potash another way, yes get it from your ashes and your charcoal will remain to help open the soil and hold water. Thanks Marg for dropping in and explaining your particular method.

I stay under the radar.. but I have often heard catch phrases I have written.. come back down the train of the public service elevator as.. the now speak.

I’m wondering if the grape marc will hold residual moulds and become slippery after rain. Already have problems with the kids and allergies.
————-
its acidic and so will probably grow fungi and therefore cause some stress to the allergic.

the use of ground covering for kids play is a vexed question.
smooth river pebbles could be used altho’ you would need a wooden seat really because any surface including playpit sand will get wet with rain and possibly cause colds etc.

my own daughter played in the sweetcorn patch, the chook house with deep litter, the sandpit and the pond.

OK.. You are looking at the guy that made grape marc change status from being considered a usesless waste product bordering on intractable waste
——————
yes but you incorporated it into your alkaline soil.
do you know if it works as a ground cover – or would it simply break down into the soil ?
nice piece of grape marc history. as a society we are recycling all our organic waste now – i think.

pepe said:

OK.. You are looking at the guy that made grape marc change status from being considered a usesless waste product bordering on intractable waste
——————
yes but you incorporated it into your alkaline soil.
do you know if it works as a ground cover – or would it simply break down into the soil ?
nice piece of grape marc history. as a society we are recycling all our organic waste now – i think.

No I simply put it on top of the soil.. and let me dispell a myth..or three
• Grape Marc is acidic yes.. when it is fresh. However during the composting process the Ph of a pile of grape marc will swing back and forth from extremely acid to extremely alkaline until the swings decrease and when the composting is complete the Ph settles at neutral.

• Grape Marc isn’t normally slippery when wet. Though a wet pavement may become slippery if a thin film of almost any type of clay, this doesn’t happen with grape marc.

• Grape Marc is essentially better than most mulches simply due to its water holding capacity, not to mention its capacity to regulate soil temperature. As a ground cover for native plantings it works admirably.. even the merest sprinkle of it makes a benefical change.

It isn’t necessary to dig grape marc into the soil. Some of this will occur as you dig to plant things but the best place for grape marc is on top of the soil.
Worms will do the necessary incorporation. Grape marc basically will basically break down to two components..
• a fine black humus which works down into the soil
•and those seeds which perhaps were on the outside all the time.

Yes, thirty years afterwards.., I can still find grape seeds everywhere. These seeds eventually become incorporated since one does dig to plant things and one also does continue to mulch over the top with whatever organic matter that come to hand. These grape seeds also help to add drainage to the soil that becomes a water storage whenever water is about.

pepe said:

OK.. You are looking at the guy that made grape marc change status from being considered a usesless waste product bordering on intractable waste
——————
yes but you incorporated it into your alkaline soil.
do you know if it works as a ground cover – or would it simply break down into the soil ?
nice piece of grape marc history. as a society we are recycling all our organic waste now – i think.

Can I ask the stupid question… what IS grape marc??? :D

bon008 said:

pepe said:

OK.. You are looking at the guy that made grape marc change status from being considered a usesless waste product bordering on intractable waste
——————
yes but you incorporated it into your alkaline soil.
do you know if it works as a ground cover – or would it simply break down into the soil ?
nice piece of grape marc history. as a society we are recycling all our organic waste now – i think.

Can I ask the stupid question… what IS grape marc??? :D

Sure .. I doubt it is in the common vernacular for many people.

When grapes are harvested for winemaking, they are crushed and the juices and sometimes the skins are extracted to make wine. The remainder is taken to a distillery to have the remaining alcohol extracted by distillation which steam sterilizes all the seeds(or 99.99%). This produces the basic waste known as grape marc which has decomposing skins and stems from bunches plus some grape leaves and a lot of grape seed. It comes looking black and hot… and goes through various changes while composting.. stinks to high heaven and is so hot it will burn you if you are stupid enough to insert your hand into the heap.

roughbarked said:

Sure .. I doubt it is in the common vernacular for many people.

When grapes are harvested for winemaking, they are crushed and the juices and sometimes the skins are extracted to make wine. The remainder is taken to a distillery to have the remaining alcohol extracted by distillation which steam sterilizes all the seeds(or 99.99%). This produces the basic waste known as grape marc which has decomposing skins and stems from bunches plus some grape leaves and a lot of grape seed. It comes looking black and hot… and goes through various changes while composting.. stinks to high heaven and is so hot it will burn you if you are stupid enough to insert your hand into the heap.

Thanks roughbarked :)

Hi Gang, very much interested in joining in..there is just so much to talk about and share. Has anyone been watching around the world in 80 gardens? Terra preta…now there is a goal! is there an alternative to burning however? I am a bucket chemist so I am interested in the activity of the charcoal and microbes and maybe how to achieve this without the charcoal. Has anyone heard of anything or tried something new?
cheers M :-)
Oh where is everyone from? In the Daleys forum (productive plants) the city or region where we are from is displayed.
And I found you just wasting time googling at lunchtime finding an alternative source for decomposed or granitic sand, and I was shocked when I saw my name in the results..and I am really glad there are others interested..I really thought I was the most boring person wanting to talk dirty all the time :-)

marg said:

Hi Gang, very much interested in joining in..there is just so much to talk about and share. Has anyone been watching around the world in 80 gardens? Terra preta…now there is a goal! is there an alternative to burning however? I am a bucket chemist so I am interested in the activity of the charcoal and microbes and maybe how to achieve this without the charcoal. Has anyone heard of anything or tried something new?
cheers M :-)
Oh where is everyone from? In the Daleys forum (productive plants) the city or region where we are from is displayed.
And I found you just wasting time googling at lunchtime finding an alternative source for decomposed or granitic sand, and I was shocked when I saw my name in the results..and I am really glad there are others interested..I really thought I was the most boring person wanting to talk dirty all the time :-)

We are glad you dropped in.. Well from my wafflin about grape marc, it should be fairly obvious that I’m from a wine producing region.. The M.I.A.

Grape marc as with and good compost heap.. also does what one can refer to as burning.. try sticking your hand into a hot compost heap.. is it high temperatures that you are referring to when you speak of burning in charcoal?
and while I’ve got you.. could it be possible to cause a human body to rot away to just bones inside a heap of grape marc?

I ask this because, yesterday.. police were swarming over my front yard after I reported finding the top half of a human femur in my garden.

watching around the world in 80 gardens? Terra preta…now there is a goal! is there an alternative to burning however? I am a bucket chemist so I am interested in the activity of the charcoal and microbes and maybe how to achieve this without the charcoal. Has anyone heard of anything or tried something new?
—————————-
yes – i watch the programme religiously – very good.
i saw that charcoal bit but i don’t understand – although i know it contains potash.
i have got good results growing spuds with the ash and charcoal from my bonfire.
generally speaking i have clay soil which i’m completely changing by adding voluminous amounts of organic matter.
if i find charcoal, granite – or anything else is worthwhile i will adapt my practices to suit.

roughbarked said:

marg said:

Hi Gang, very much interested in joining in..there is just so much to talk about and share. Has anyone been watching around the world in 80 gardens? Terra preta…now there is a goal! is there an alternative to burning however? I am a bucket chemist so I am interested in the activity of the charcoal and microbes and maybe how to achieve this without the charcoal. Has anyone heard of anything or tried something new?
cheers M :-)
Oh where is everyone from? In the Daleys forum (productive plants) the city or region where we are from is displayed.
And I found you just wasting time googling at lunchtime finding an alternative source for decomposed or granitic sand, and I was shocked when I saw my name in the results..and I am really glad there are others interested..I really thought I was the most boring person wanting to talk dirty all the time :-)

We are glad you dropped in.. Well from my wafflin about grape marc, it should be fairly obvious that I’m from a wine producing region.. The M.I.A.

Grape marc as with and good compost heap.. also does what one can refer to as burning.. try sticking your hand into a hot compost heap.. is it high temperatures that you are referring to when you speak of burning in charcoal?
and while I’ve got you.. could it be possible to cause a human body to rot away to just bones inside a heap of grape marc?

I ask this because, yesterday.. police were swarming over my front yard after I reported finding the top half of a human femur in my garden.

OMG! I hope the rest of it isn’t lying around.

marg said:

Hi Gang, very much interested in joining in..there is just so much to talk about and share. Has anyone been watching around the world in 80 gardens? Terra preta…now there is a goal! is there an alternative to burning however? I am a bucket chemist so I am interested in the activity of the charcoal and microbes and maybe how to achieve this without the charcoal. Has anyone heard of anything or tried something new?
cheers M :-)
Oh where is everyone from? In the Daleys forum (productive plants) the city or region where we are from is displayed.
And I found you just wasting time googling at lunchtime finding an alternative source for decomposed or granitic sand, and I was shocked when I saw my name in the results..and I am really glad there are others interested..I really thought I was the most boring person wanting to talk dirty all the time :-)

The beauty of this forum is that you can talk on whatever you fancy within the general guidelines. Nice to have you aboard Marg.

and while I’ve got you.. could it be possible to cause a human body to rot away to just bones inside a heap of grape marc? I ask this because, yesterday.. police were swarming over my front yard after I reported finding the top half of a human femur in my garden.
———-
my compost heap has ‘burnt’ an entire chook – beak, legs and all.
but i don’t know about half a femur – why didn’t that burn ?

anyrate you are now a contender for best hijack of all time LOL.

pomolo said:

roughbarked said:

marg said:

Hi Gang, very much interested in joining in..there is just so much to talk about and share. Has anyone been watching around the world in 80 gardens? Terra preta…now there is a goal! is there an alternative to burning however? I am a bucket chemist so I am interested in the activity of the charcoal and microbes and maybe how to achieve this without the charcoal. Has anyone heard of anything or tried something new?
cheers M :-)
Oh where is everyone from? In the Daleys forum (productive plants) the city or region where we are from is displayed.
And I found you just wasting time googling at lunchtime finding an alternative source for decomposed or granitic sand, and I was shocked when I saw my name in the results..and I am really glad there are others interested..I really thought I was the most boring person wanting to talk dirty all the time :-)

We are glad you dropped in.. Well from my wafflin about grape marc, it should be fairly obvious that I’m from a wine producing region.. The M.I.A.

Grape marc as with and good compost heap.. also does what one can refer to as burning.. try sticking your hand into a hot compost heap.. is it high temperatures that you are referring to when you speak of burning in charcoal?
and while I’ve got you.. could it be possible to cause a human body to rot away to just bones inside a heap of grape marc?

I ask this because, yesterday.. police were swarming over my front yard after I reported finding the top half of a human femur in my garden.

OMG! I hope the rest of it isn’t lying around.

The jury is still out on as to how the bluddy hell it ended up in my yard..

From obvious other evidence I could suggest
• probably ported to my yard by a dog or fox.
• or it came in the red sand from a sand dune half a km away.
• or it was pushed there by a road grader since the road originally ran through what is now my front yard.
• or ported in grape marc .. which could be very suspicious because where I come from is the same place that both Robert Trimbole was born and Don Mackay mysteriously vanished from.. leaving only his car keys and a few splatters of blood next to three spent .22 shells.

pepe said:

and while I’ve got you.. could it be possible to cause a human body to rot away to just bones inside a heap of grape marc? I ask this because, yesterday.. police were swarming over my front yard after I reported finding the top half of a human femur in my garden.
———-
my compost heap has ‘burnt’ an entire chook – beak, legs and all.
but i don’t know about half a femur – why didn’t that burn ?

anyrate you are now a contender for best hijack of all time LOL.

;)

As well known for hijacking threads as I am.. this one takes the cake yeah.. because it has sort of hijacked my life at the moment. As you may imagine.

The high likelyhood is that it is an Aboriginal bone. Which is the scenario I’m hoping is correct..

You may have heard the term manuport.. in relation to why things are found in certain sites.. this means that a man carried it there.

I reckon this is a doguport and that a body is buried somewhere nearby and that since the sand dune has been mined for sand to use all over town in gardens then .. this is also how it could be there.. either it came with sand or a dog found it exposed in sand and brought it here.

I’m trying not to believe that it came with the grape marc as that could be .. a murder case.

marg said:

Hi Gang, very much interested in joining in..there is just so much to talk about and share. Has anyone been watching around the world in 80 gardens? Terra preta…now there is a goal! is there an alternative to burning however? I am a bucket chemist so I am interested in the activity of the charcoal and microbes and maybe how to achieve this without the charcoal. Has anyone heard of anything or tried something new?
cheers M :-)
Oh where is everyone from? In the Daleys forum (productive plants) the city or region where we are from is displayed.
And I found you just wasting time googling at lunchtime finding an alternative source for decomposed or granitic sand, and I was shocked when I saw my name in the results..and I am really glad there are others interested..I really thought I was the most boring person wanting to talk dirty all the time :-)

There’s a forum called Aussies Living Simply. If you join up and ask a member called Bazman, he’s right into the Terra preta.

bubba louie said:

marg said:

Hi Gang, very much interested in joining in..there is just so much to talk about and share. Has anyone been watching around the world in 80 gardens? Terra preta…now there is a goal! is there an alternative to burning however? I am a bucket chemist so I am interested in the activity of the charcoal and microbes and maybe how to achieve this without the charcoal. Has anyone heard of anything or tried something new?
cheers M :-)
Oh where is everyone from? In the Daleys forum (productive plants) the city or region where we are from is displayed.
And I found you just wasting time googling at lunchtime finding an alternative source for decomposed or granitic sand, and I was shocked when I saw my name in the results..and I am really glad there are others interested..I really thought I was the most boring person wanting to talk dirty all the time :-)

There’s a forum called Aussies Living Simply. If you join up and ask a member called Bazman, he’s right into the Terra preta.

Bio Char actualy but I gather they’re connected.

bubba louie said:

bubba louie said:

marg said:

Hi Gang, very much interested in joining in..there is just so much to talk about and share. Has anyone been watching around the world in 80 gardens? Terra preta…now there is a goal! is there an alternative to burning however? I am a bucket chemist so I am interested in the activity of the charcoal and microbes and maybe how to achieve this without the charcoal. Has anyone heard of anything or tried something new?
cheers M :-)
Oh where is everyone from? In the Daleys forum (productive plants) the city or region where we are from is displayed.
And I found you just wasting time googling at lunchtime finding an alternative source for decomposed or granitic sand, and I was shocked when I saw my name in the results..and I am really glad there are others interested..I really thought I was the most boring person wanting to talk dirty all the time :-)

There’s a forum called Aussies Living Simply. If you join up and ask a member called Bazman, he’s right into the Terra preta.

Bio Char actualy but I gather they’re connected.

;) a long ago avid reader of “Simply Living”.., How did I miss this?

roughbarked said:

marg said:

Hi Gang, very much interested in joining in..there is just so much to talk about and share. Has anyone been watching around the world in 80 gardens? Terra preta…now there is a goal! is there an alternative to burning however? I am a bucket chemist so I am interested in the activity of the charcoal and microbes and maybe how to achieve this without the charcoal. Has anyone heard of anything or tried something new?
cheers M :-)
Oh where is everyone from? In the Daleys forum (productive plants) the city or region where we are from is displayed.
And I found you just wasting time googling at lunchtime finding an alternative source for decomposed or granitic sand, and I was shocked when I saw my name in the results..and I am really glad there are others interested..I really thought I was the most boring person wanting to talk dirty all the time :-)

We are glad you dropped in.. Well from my wafflin about grape marc, it should be fairly obvious that I’m from a wine producing region.. The M.I.A.

Grape marc as with and good compost heap.. also does what one can refer to as burning.. try sticking your hand into a hot compost heap.. is it high temperatures that you are referring to when you speak of burning in charcoal?
and while I’ve got you.. could it be possible to cause a human body to rot away to just bones inside a heap of grape marc?

I ask this because, yesterday.. police were swarming over my front yard after I reported finding the top half of a human femur in my garden.

Well! That’s different!!!!!

roughbarked said:

The high likelyhood is that it is an Aboriginal bone. Which is the scenario I’m hoping is correct..

You may have heard the term manuport.. in relation to why things are found in certain sites.. this means that a man carried it there.

I reckon this is a doguport and that a body is buried somewhere nearby and that since the sand dune has been mined for sand to use all over town in gardens then .. this is also how it could be there.. either it came with sand or a dog found it exposed in sand and brought it here.

I’m trying not to believe that it came with the grape marc as that could be .. a murder case.

No need to buy any more thrillers, just log in here.

roughbarked said:

bubba louie said:

bubba louie said:

There’s a forum called Aussies Living Simply. If you join up and ask a member called Bazman, he’s right into the Terra preta.

Bio Char actualy but I gather they’re connected.

;) a long ago avid reader of “Simply Living”.., How did I miss this?

Baz used to be a member of GA long ago too.

pepe said:

There was weed mat in our front yard when we moved in. It may have cut down the number of weeds, but as BG said you still get weeds and top. There were also some hardy weeds growing THROUGH the matting – and it just made them harder to pull out. We got rid of all the matting and put down woodchip mulch instead.
———-
ditto here – pulled up the weed mat and put down mulch.

My son laid weed mat around our fruit trees, but we too had problems with weeds on top as described by others, so we replaced it with newspaper and coir mulch. Probably still to early to determine its success or failure, but we are hopeful.

marg said:

Hi Gang, very much interested in joining in..there is just so much to talk about and share. Has anyone been watching around the world in 80 gardens?

I missed it last night :( :(… had to go to a meeting, but had trouble with the timer on the VCR so couldn’t tape it… :(

AnneS said:

marg said:

Hi Gang, very much interested in joining in..there is just so much to talk about and share. Has anyone been watching around the world in 80 gardens?

I missed it last night :( :(… had to go to a meeting, but had trouble with the timer on the VCR so couldn’t tape it… :(

Someone was growing a rose on a floating pontoon in the Amazon. I can’t even grow them here. :(

roughbarked said:

and while I’ve got you.. could it be possible to cause a human body to rot away to just bones inside a heap of grape marc?

I ask this because, yesterday.. police were swarming over my front yard after I reported finding the top half of a human femur in my garden.

OMG!!!

roughbarked said:

• or ported in grape marc .. which could be very suspicious because where I come from is the same place that both Robert Trimbole was born and Don Mackay mysteriously vanished from.. leaving only his car keys and a few splatters of blood next to three spent .22 shells.

remind me not to drink from that vintage….