Researchers at Southern Cross University have found naturopathic medicine favourable in the treatment of a wide range of chronic conditions after conducting the world’s first systematic scoping study on its clinical benefits.

Published in the February issue of the Journal of Alternative and Complementary Medicine, the scoping study summarises the current state of the research evidence for whole-system, multi-modality naturopathic medicine. Modalities* are clinical techniques.

The research project took a year to complete and scoured the scientific literature for all papers that reported human research which evaluated the effectiveness of naturopathic medicine. Southern Cross’ research team of Professor Stephen P Myers and Vanesaa Vigar included those papers where two or more naturopathic modalities were delivered by naturopathic clinicians to participants.

Naturopathic medicine was found to be beneficial for a wide range of chronic conditions including cardiovascular disorders, musculoskeletal pain, type 2 diabetes, PCOS, depression, anxiety, chronic pain, hepatitis C, menopausal symptoms, bipolar disorder, asthma and in increasing cancer survival time.

“The study clearly shows for the first time the broad range of effectiveness of naturopathic medicine which has been demonstrated by clinical research,” said lead researcher Professor Stephen Myers.

“This study coupled with the large body of literature which demonstrates the effectiveness of individual naturopathic tools of trade (nutritional and herbal supplements and lifestyle interventions) there can no longer be any doubt that naturopathic medicine is an effective approach to chronic disease.”

The World Naturopathic Federation has identified seven core modalities of naturopathic medicine:

• clinical nutrition and diet modification/counselling;
• applied nutrition (use of dietary supplements, traditional medicines, and natural health care products);
• herbal medicine;
• lifestyle counselling;
• hydrotherapy;
• homeopathy, including complex homeopathy;
• and physical modalities (based on the treatment modalities taught and allowed in each jurisdiction, including yoga, naturopathic manipulation, and muscle release techniques).

The researchers identified 33 published studies involving 9,859 participants. The studies came from research conducted across the globe and included 11 USA; 4 Canada; 6 Germany; 7 India; 3 Australia; 1 UK; and 1 Japan (the paper from Japan covered a range of mainly chronic clinical conditions).

The study is open access and available free online from the New York publisher, Mary Ann Libert, Inc at https://www.liebertpub.com/doi/10.1089/acm.2018.0340

 

*Australian naturopaths have nutritional medicine, herbal medicine and tactile therapies as their core modalities.

https://www.scu.edu.au/engage/news/latest-news/2019/world-first-scoping-study-shows-benefits-in-naturopathic-medicine-treatments.php?utm_source=miragenews&utm_medium=miragenews&utm_campaign=news

———————

I notice that homeopathy is mixed in with six other mostly hand-wavey “modalities”.

The lead aurthor Professor Stephen Myers  is a qualified medical doctor as well as a naturopath.

One word, which starts with P and ends with O.

Bubblecar said:

One word, which starts with P and ends with O.

What’s polo got to do with it?

Bubblecar said:

One word, which starts with P and ends with O.

Hang about. I get it now. Placebo.

Bubblecar said:

One word, which starts with P and ends with O.

Prosciutto?

Ian said:

Bubblecar said:

One word, which starts with P and ends with O.

Prosciutto?

Poblano.

Michael V said:

Bubblecar said:

One word, which starts with P and ends with O.

Hang about. I get it now. Placebo.

Oh yes. The placebo effect plays a huge part in the positive results no doubt.

I heard someone promoting this study on ABC local radio a couple of days ago. The reason it has come to light is the changes to the way that natural therapies are covered by private health insurance starting from 1 April. No fooling.

The following natural therapies will be excluded from the definition of private health insurance general treatment and will no longer receive the private health insurance rebate as part of a general treatment policy: Alexander technique, aromatherapy, Bowen therapy, Buteyko, Feldenkrais, Western herbalism, homeopathy, iridology, kinesiology, naturopathy, Pilates, reflexology, Rolfing, shiatsu, tai chi, and yoga.

http://www.health.gov.au/internet/main/publishing.nsf/Content/private-health-insurance-reforms-fact-sheet-removing-coverage-for-some-natural-therapies

Ian said:

I heard someone promoting this study on ABC local radio a couple of days ago. The reason it has come to light is the changes to the way that natural therapies are covered by private health insurance starting from 1 April. No fooling.

The following natural therapies will be excluded from the definition of private health insurance general treatment and will no longer receive the private health insurance rebate as part of a general treatment policy: Alexander technique, aromatherapy, Bowen therapy, Buteyko, Feldenkrais, Western herbalism, homeopathy, iridology, kinesiology, naturopathy, Pilates, reflexology, Rolfing, shiatsu, tai chi, and yoga.

http://www.health.gov.au/internet/main/publishing.nsf/Content/private-health-insurance-reforms-fact-sheet-removing-coverage-for-some-natural-therapies

My younger sister does Pilates for her various aches and pains.

>Rolfing

Would have thought that was well out of fashion these days, whatever it is.

Ian said:

I heard someone promoting this study on ABC local radio a couple of days ago. The reason it has come to light is the changes to the way that natural therapies are covered by private health insurance starting from 1 April. No fooling.

The following natural therapies will be excluded from the definition of private health insurance general treatment and will no longer receive the private health insurance rebate as part of a general treatment policy: Alexander technique, aromatherapy, Bowen therapy, Buteyko, Feldenkrais, Western herbalism, homeopathy, iridology, kinesiology, naturopathy, Pilates, reflexology, Rolfing, shiatsu, tai chi, and yoga.

http://www.health.gov.au/internet/main/publishing.nsf/Content/private-health-insurance-reforms-fact-sheet-removing-coverage-for-some-natural-therapies

You have to ask, “how the fuck did these get defined as a treatment in the first place?”

sibeen said:

Bit small, go to https://xkcd.com/882/

Bubblecar said:

Ian said:

I heard someone promoting this study on ABC local radio a couple of days ago. The reason it has come to light is the changes to the way that natural therapies are covered by private health insurance starting from 1 April. No fooling.

The following natural therapies will be excluded from the definition of private health insurance general treatment and will no longer receive the private health insurance rebate as part of a general treatment policy: Alexander technique, aromatherapy, Bowen therapy, Buteyko, Feldenkrais, Western herbalism, homeopathy, iridology, kinesiology, naturopathy, Pilates, reflexology, Rolfing, shiatsu, tai chi, and yoga.

http://www.health.gov.au/internet/main/publishing.nsf/Content/private-health-insurance-reforms-fact-sheet-removing-coverage-for-some-natural-therapies

My younger sister does Pilates for her various aches and pains.

>Rolfing

Would have thought that was well out of fashion these days, whatever it is.

Rolfing? Goes on a fair bit around here.

Have there been any real studies into Naturopathy?

Some of it might work and some of it might not work, that’s the impression I get.

Naturopaths are not doctors or chemists,. so its difficult to trust them.

Here take this tincture of “whatever plant” and it will make you feel better.

But what does the real science say?

Ian said:

I heard someone promoting this study on ABC local radio a couple of days ago. The reason it has come to light is the changes to the way that natural therapies are covered by private health insurance starting from 1 April. No fooling.

The following natural therapies will be excluded from the definition of private health insurance general treatment and will no longer receive the private health insurance rebate as part of a general treatment policy: Alexander technique, aromatherapy, Bowen therapy, Buteyko, Feldenkrais, Western herbalism, homeopathy, iridology, kinesiology, naturopathy, Pilates, reflexology, Rolfing, shiatsu, tai chi, and yoga.

http://www.health.gov.au/internet/main/publishing.nsf/Content/private-health-insurance-reforms-fact-sheet-removing-coverage-for-some-natural-therapies

Rolfing?
LOL

Peak Warming Man said:

Ian said:

I heard someone promoting this study on ABC local radio a couple of days ago. The reason it has come to light is the changes to the way that natural therapies are covered by private health insurance starting from 1 April. No fooling.

The following natural therapies will be excluded from the definition of private health insurance general treatment and will no longer receive the private health insurance rebate as part of a general treatment policy: Alexander technique, aromatherapy, Bowen therapy, Buteyko, Feldenkrais, Western herbalism, homeopathy, iridology, kinesiology, naturopathy, Pilates, reflexology, Rolfing, shiatsu, tai chi, and yoga.

http://www.health.gov.au/internet/main/publishing.nsf/Content/private-health-insurance-reforms-fact-sheet-removing-coverage-for-some-natural-therapies

Rolfing?
LOL

Apparently it means making didgeridoos out of prison toilet rolls and having them confiscated.

Don’t know what the therapeutic benefits are supposed to be.

Tau.Neutrino said:

Have there been any real studies into Naturopathy?

Some of it might work and some of it might not work, that’s the impression I get.

Naturopaths are not doctors or chemists,. so its difficult to trust them.

Here take this tincture of “whatever plant” and it will make you feel better.

But what does the real science say?

Is the plant willow tree bark?

AwesomeO said:

Tau.Neutrino said:

Have there been any real studies into Naturopathy?

Some of it might work and some of it might not work, that’s the impression I get.

Naturopaths are not doctors or chemists,. so its difficult to trust them.

Here take this tincture of “whatever plant” and it will make you feel better.

But what does the real science say?

Is the plant willow tree bark?

I think it was just ordinary gum tree bark.

“Southern Cross University will establish the National Centre for Naturopathic Medicine in 2019 at our Lismore Campus with a $10 million donation by philanthropist Mr Marcus Blackmore”

Wonder where I’ve seen the name Blackmore before?

Have there been any studies into what percentage of Naturopathy is bullshit?

Tau.Neutrino said:

Have there been any studies into what percentage of Naturopathy is bullshit?

Could it be something like 70 percent bullshit and 30 percent maybe?

poikilotherm said:

“Southern Cross University will establish the National Centre for Naturopathic Medicine in 2019 at our Lismore Campus with a $10 million donation by philanthropist Mr Marcus Blackmore”

Wonder where I’ve seen the name Blackmore before?

I tried to find the National Centre for Naturopathic Medicine or any of its courses by starting at SCU’s home page and searching through their Health Sciences amongst other faculties. Strangely, no luck.

Ian said:

I heard someone promoting this study on ABC local radio a couple of days ago. The reason it has come to light is the changes to the way that natural therapies are covered by private health insurance starting from 1 April. No fooling.

The following natural therapies will be excluded from the definition of private health insurance general treatment and will no longer receive the private health insurance rebate as part of a general treatment policy: Alexander technique, aromatherapy, Bowen therapy, Buteyko, Feldenkrais, Western herbalism, homeopathy, iridology, kinesiology, naturopathy, Pilates, reflexology, Rolfing, shiatsu, tai chi, and yoga.

http://www.health.gov.au/internet/main/publishing.nsf/Content/private-health-insurance-reforms-fact-sheet-removing-coverage-for-some-natural-therapies

>>Alexander technique<<

Hang on…I’m sure I’ve got a book about that somewhere. Isn’t it breathing and posture for actors? I’ll go and look.

Just checked the front of the book…yes indeed it was a technique for getting good voice projection and body awareness on stage. It must have been extended in the last hundred and something years.

buffy said:

Just checked the front of the book…yes indeed it was a technique for getting good voice projection and body awareness on stage. It must have been extended in the last hundred and something years.

LOL

The Alexander Technique, named after its creator Frederick Matthias Alexander, is an educational process that was created to retrain habitual patterns of movement and posture. Alexander believed that poor habits in posture and movement damaged spatial self-awareness as well as health, and that movement efficiency could support overall physical well-being. He saw the technique as a mental training technique as well.:221

Alexander began developing his technique’s principles in the 1890s in an attempt to address voice loss during public speaking.:34–35 He credited his method with allowing him to pursue his passion for reciting in Shakespearean theater.

Some proponents of the Alexander Technique say that it addresses a variety of health conditions related to cumulative physical behaviors but there is little evidence to support these claims. As of 2015 there was evidence suggesting the Alexander Technique may be helpful for long-term back pain, long-term neck pain, and may help people cope with Parkinson’s disease.However, both Aetna and the Australian Department of Health have conducted reviews and concluded that the technique has insufficient evidence to warrant insurance coverage.

—

Can’t hurt. But claims overrated.

Rolfing (/ˈrɔːlfɪŋ, ˈrɒl-/) is a form of alternative medicine originally developed by Ida Rolf (1896–1979) as Structural Integration. It is typically delivered as a series of ten hands-on physical manipulation sessions sometimes called “the recipe”. It is based on Rolf’s ideas about how the human body’s “energy field” can benefit when aligned with the Earth’s gravitational field. Practitioners combine superficial and deep manual therapy with movement prompts. The process is sometimes painful.

The principles of Rolfing contradict established medical knowledge, and there is no good evidence Rolfing is effective for the treatment of any health condition. It is recognized as a pseudoscience and has been characterized as quackery. It is not known whether Rolfing is safe or cost-effective.

—-

No rolfing.

This thread has made me think I might get out my Encyclopedia of Alternative Health Care and read it again. It’s really Quite Interesting to read about all the weird and wacky stuff. It covers acupressure, acupuncture and traditional Chinese medicine, The Alexander technique, aromatherapy, autogenic training and therapy, ayurveda, Bach flower remedies and other flower essences, bioenegetics and body orianted psychotherapies, biofeedback training, chiropractic, osteopathy and other manipulative therapies, colonics or colon hyerotherapy, Feldenkrais method, healers, herbalism, homeopathy, etc etc.

buffy said:

This thread has made me think I might get out my Encyclopedia of Alternative Health Care and read it again. It’s really Quite Interesting to read about all the weird and wacky stuff. It covers acupressure, acupuncture and traditional Chinese medicine, The Alexander technique, aromatherapy, autogenic training and therapy, ayurveda, Bach flower remedies and other flower essences, bioenegetics and body orianted psychotherapies, biofeedback training, chiropractic, osteopathy and other manipulative therapies, colonics or colon hyerotherapy, Feldenkrais method, healers, herbalism, homeopathy, etc etc.

A lot of it is crick bait.

Ian said:

The Alexander Technique, named after its creator Frederick Matthias Alexander, is an educational process that was created to retrain habitual patterns of movement and posture. Alexander believed that poor habits in posture and movement damaged spatial self-awareness as well as health, and that movement efficiency could support overall physical well-being. He saw the technique as a mental training technique as well.:221

Alexander began developing his technique’s principles in the 1890s in an attempt to address voice loss during public speaking.:34–35 He credited his method with allowing him to pursue his passion for reciting in Shakespearean theater.

Some proponents of the Alexander Technique say that it addresses a variety of health conditions related to cumulative physical behaviors but there is little evidence to support these claims. As of 2015 there was evidence suggesting the Alexander Technique may be helpful for long-term back pain, long-term neck pain, and may help people cope with Parkinson’s disease.However, both Aetna and the Australian Department of Health have conducted reviews and concluded that the technique has insufficient evidence to warrant insurance coverage.

—

Can’t hurt. But claims overrated.

Wasn’t he an Aussie?

Ian said:

Rolfing (/ˈrɔːlfɪŋ, ˈrɒl-/) is a form of alternative medicine originally developed by Ida Rolf (1896–1979) as Structural Integration. It is typically delivered as a series of ten hands-on physical manipulation sessions sometimes called “the recipe”. It is based on Rolf’s ideas about how the human body’s “energy field” can benefit when aligned with the Earth’s gravitational field. Practitioners combine superficial and deep manual therapy with movement prompts. The process is sometimes painful.

The principles of Rolfing contradict established medical knowledge, and there is no good evidence Rolfing is effective for the treatment of any health condition. It is recognized as a pseudoscience and has been characterized as quackery. It is not known whether Rolfing is safe or cost-effective.

—-

No rolfing.

I’m not. I’m LOLing.

https://www.abc.net.au/news/2018-11-29/blackmores-pledges-donation-will-not-compromise-scu-research/10567286

The man behind a $10 million donation to Southern Cross University in northern New South Wales says he will not try to influence what is taught in holistic medical courses.

The head of the Blackmores vitamin empire, Marcus Blackmore, and his wife Caroline handed over the money this week to the university at a ceremony in Sydney.

The funds will be used to establish a National Centre for Naturopathic Medicine at the University.

Mr Blackmore said the donation had no strings attached and is to fulfil his father’s dying wish.

“My father, who is regularly referred to as Australia’s pioneering naturopath, said on his death bed that it saddened him not to see naturopathy as a profession in his lifetime,” Mr Blackmore said.

He said the university’s reputation would not be compromised.

“It’s actually more about teaching people about naturopathic medicine as a profession, and giving that the respect it deserves in Australia and overseas.

“I think the world has moved on, and I think those things which a decade ago some people might have felt some discomfort, now they realise they’re mainstream,” he said…

But Emeritus Professor, John Dwyer, from the Friends of Science in Medicine group thinks SCU is being compromised by accepting the personal gift.

“Blackmores is a company that’s made a fortune capitalising on the poor health of Australians and convincing them they need a whole lot of supplements and vitamins they don’t need,” Professor Dwyer said.

“Naturopathic medicine has got a long way to go to get the respect from clinical-based evidence scientists.

“This will only downgrade the level of tertiary academic standards at the university, not improve them,” he said.

“To spend more money on doing research on homeopathy would almost be unconscionable,” Professor Dwyer said.

—-

John Dwyer in the last couple of days has been outspoken in criticising the validity of study in the OP.

Ian said:

https://www.abc.net.au/news/2018-11-29/blackmores-pledges-donation-will-not-compromise-scu-research/10567286

The man behind a $10 million donation to Southern Cross University in northern New South Wales says he will not try to influence what is taught in holistic medical courses.

The head of the Blackmores vitamin empire, Marcus Blackmore, and his wife Caroline handed over the money this week to the university at a ceremony in Sydney.

The funds will be used to establish a National Centre for Naturopathic Medicine at the University.

Mr Blackmore said the donation had no strings attached and is to fulfil his father’s dying wish.

“My father, who is regularly referred to as Australia’s pioneering naturopath, said on his death bed that it saddened him not to see naturopathy as a profession in his lifetime,” Mr Blackmore said.

He said the university’s reputation would not be compromised.

“It’s actually more about teaching people about naturopathic medicine as a profession, and giving that the respect it deserves in Australia and overseas.

“I think the world has moved on, and I think those things which a decade ago some people might have felt some discomfort, now they realise they’re mainstream,” he said…

But Emeritus Professor, John Dwyer, from the Friends of Science in Medicine group thinks SCU is being compromised by accepting the personal gift.

“Blackmores is a company that’s made a fortune capitalising on the poor health of Australians and convincing them they need a whole lot of supplements and vitamins they don’t need,” Professor Dwyer said.

“Naturopathic medicine has got a long way to go to get the respect from clinical-based evidence scientists.

“This will only downgrade the level of tertiary academic standards at the university, not improve them,” he said.

“To spend more money on doing research on homeopathy would almost be unconscionable,” Professor Dwyer said.

—-

John Dwyer in the last couple of days has been outspoken in criticising the validity of study in the OP.

I cannot say much about recent Blackmore’s stuff but in the old days, it was good.
I do think the old man was at least genuine.
The best skin cream for chapped or worse, feet. Discontinued decades past.
Nothing as effective has ever been seen since on any pharmacsist shelves.

roughbarked said:

Ian said:

https://www.abc.net.au/news/2018-11-29/blackmores-pledges-donation-will-not-compromise-scu-research/10567286

The man behind a $10 million donation to Southern Cross University in northern New South Wales says he will not try to influence what is taught in holistic medical courses.

The head of the Blackmores vitamin empire, Marcus Blackmore, and his wife Caroline handed over the money this week to the university at a ceremony in Sydney.

The funds will be used to establish a National Centre for Naturopathic Medicine at the University.

Mr Blackmore said the donation had no strings attached and is to fulfil his father’s dying wish.

“My father, who is regularly referred to as Australia’s pioneering naturopath, said on his death bed that it saddened him not to see naturopathy as a profession in his lifetime,” Mr Blackmore said.

He said the university’s reputation would not be compromised.

“It’s actually more about teaching people about naturopathic medicine as a profession, and giving that the respect it deserves in Australia and overseas.

“I think the world has moved on, and I think those things which a decade ago some people might have felt some discomfort, now they realise they’re mainstream,” he said…

But Emeritus Professor, John Dwyer, from the Friends of Science in Medicine group thinks SCU is being compromised by accepting the personal gift.

“Blackmores is a company that’s made a fortune capitalising on the poor health of Australians and convincing them they need a whole lot of supplements and vitamins they don’t need,” Professor Dwyer said.

“Naturopathic medicine has got a long way to go to get the respect from clinical-based evidence scientists.

“This will only downgrade the level of tertiary academic standards at the university, not improve them,” he said.

“To spend more money on doing research on homeopathy would almost be unconscionable,” Professor Dwyer said.

—-

John Dwyer in the last couple of days has been outspoken in criticising the validity of study in the OP.

I cannot say much about recent Blackmore’s stuff but in the old days, it was good.
I do think the old man was at least genuine.
The best skin cream for chapped or worse, feet. Discontinued decades past.
Nothing as effective has ever been seen since on any pharmacsist shelves.

In a similar vein, I also keep Bach’s rescue remedy and Calendula tincture in my medicine cabinet. Because I know they work and I can still get them.
I don’t care whether it is deemed a placebo or not.
Tread on a nail and pour calendula tincture into it, as long as you have at least had a tetanus shot, your injury should heal very well if it doesn’t kill you the first day.

roughbarked said:

Ian said:

https://www.abc.net.au/news/2018-11-29/blackmores-pledges-donation-will-not-compromise-scu-research/10567286

The man behind a $10 million donation to Southern Cross University in northern New South Wales says he will not try to influence what is taught in holistic medical courses.

The head of the Blackmores vitamin empire, Marcus Blackmore, and his wife Caroline handed over the money this week to the university at a ceremony in Sydney.

The funds will be used to establish a National Centre for Naturopathic Medicine at the University.

Mr Blackmore said the donation had no strings attached and is to fulfil his father’s dying wish.

“My father, who is regularly referred to as Australia’s pioneering naturopath, said on his death bed that it saddened him not to see naturopathy as a profession in his lifetime,” Mr Blackmore said.

He said the university’s reputation would not be compromised.

“It’s actually more about teaching people about naturopathic medicine as a profession, and giving that the respect it deserves in Australia and overseas.

“I think the world has moved on, and I think those things which a decade ago some people might have felt some discomfort, now they realise they’re mainstream,” he said…

But Emeritus Professor, John Dwyer, from the Friends of Science in Medicine group thinks SCU is being compromised by accepting the personal gift.

“Blackmores is a company that’s made a fortune capitalising on the poor health of Australians and convincing them they need a whole lot of supplements and vitamins they don’t need,” Professor Dwyer said.

“Naturopathic medicine has got a long way to go to get the respect from clinical-based evidence scientists.

“This will only downgrade the level of tertiary academic standards at the university, not improve them,” he said.

“To spend more money on doing research on homeopathy would almost be unconscionable,” Professor Dwyer said.

—-

John Dwyer in the last couple of days has been outspoken in criticising the validity of study in the OP.

I cannot say much about recent Blackmore’s stuff but in the old days, it was good.
I do think the old man was at least genuine.
The best skin cream for chapped or worse, feet. Discontinued decades past.
Nothing as effective has ever been seen since on any pharmacsist shelves.

Have you tried all of them? I have an exellent non Blackmores foot balm.

roughbarked said:

roughbarked said:

Ian said:

https://www.abc.net.au/news/2018-11-29/blackmores-pledges-donation-will-not-compromise-scu-research/10567286

The man behind a $10 million donation to Southern Cross University in northern New South Wales says he will not try to influence what is taught in holistic medical courses.

The head of the Blackmores vitamin empire, Marcus Blackmore, and his wife Caroline handed over the money this week to the university at a ceremony in Sydney.

The funds will be used to establish a National Centre for Naturopathic Medicine at the University.

Mr Blackmore said the donation had no strings attached and is to fulfil his father’s dying wish.

“My father, who is regularly referred to as Australia’s pioneering naturopath, said on his death bed that it saddened him not to see naturopathy as a profession in his lifetime,” Mr Blackmore said.

He said the university’s reputation would not be compromised.

“It’s actually more about teaching people about naturopathic medicine as a profession, and giving that the respect it deserves in Australia and overseas.

“I think the world has moved on, and I think those things which a decade ago some people might have felt some discomfort, now they realise they’re mainstream,” he said…

But Emeritus Professor, John Dwyer, from the Friends of Science in Medicine group thinks SCU is being compromised by accepting the personal gift.

“Blackmores is a company that’s made a fortune capitalising on the poor health of Australians and convincing them they need a whole lot of supplements and vitamins they don’t need,” Professor Dwyer said.

“Naturopathic medicine has got a long way to go to get the respect from clinical-based evidence scientists.

“This will only downgrade the level of tertiary academic standards at the university, not improve them,” he said.

“To spend more money on doing research on homeopathy would almost be unconscionable,” Professor Dwyer said.

—-

John Dwyer in the last couple of days has been outspoken in criticising the validity of study in the OP.

I cannot say much about recent Blackmore’s stuff but in the old days, it was good.
I do think the old man was at least genuine.
The best skin cream for chapped or worse, feet. Discontinued decades past.
Nothing as effective has ever been seen since on any pharmacsist shelves.

In a similar vein, I also keep Bach’s rescue remedy and Calendula tincture in my medicine cabinet. Because I know they work and I can still get them.
I don’t care whether it is deemed a placebo or not.
Tread on a nail and pour calendula tincture into it, as long as you have at least had a tetanus shot, your injury should heal very well if it doesn’t kill you the first day.

In the case of rescue remedy, I have put three drops in a shot glass of water and fed it via an eye dropper to birds comatose after hitting my windows. They perk up and sit in my hand for a bit, then fly off. The ones I don’t treat this way, usually don’t fare anywhere near as well. A big part of it is the warmth of my hand I know and the rest is mostly water but please allow me to believe that rescue does help with shock.

Ian said:

roughbarked said:

Ian said:

https://www.abc.net.au/news/2018-11-29/blackmores-pledges-donation-will-not-compromise-scu-research/10567286

The man behind a $10 million donation to Southern Cross University in northern New South Wales says he will not try to influence what is taught in holistic medical courses.

The head of the Blackmores vitamin empire, Marcus Blackmore, and his wife Caroline handed over the money this week to the university at a ceremony in Sydney.

The funds will be used to establish a National Centre for Naturopathic Medicine at the University.

Mr Blackmore said the donation had no strings attached and is to fulfil his father’s dying wish.

“My father, who is regularly referred to as Australia’s pioneering naturopath, said on his death bed that it saddened him not to see naturopathy as a profession in his lifetime,” Mr Blackmore said.

He said the university’s reputation would not be compromised.

“It’s actually more about teaching people about naturopathic medicine as a profession, and giving that the respect it deserves in Australia and overseas.

“I think the world has moved on, and I think those things which a decade ago some people might have felt some discomfort, now they realise they’re mainstream,” he said…

But Emeritus Professor, John Dwyer, from the Friends of Science in Medicine group thinks SCU is being compromised by accepting the personal gift.

“Blackmores is a company that’s made a fortune capitalising on the poor health of Australians and convincing them they need a whole lot of supplements and vitamins they don’t need,” Professor Dwyer said.

“Naturopathic medicine has got a long way to go to get the respect from clinical-based evidence scientists.

“This will only downgrade the level of tertiary academic standards at the university, not improve them,” he said.

“To spend more money on doing research on homeopathy would almost be unconscionable,” Professor Dwyer said.

—-

John Dwyer in the last couple of days has been outspoken in criticising the validity of study in the OP.

I cannot say much about recent Blackmore’s stuff but in the old days, it was good.
I do think the old man was at least genuine.
The best skin cream for chapped or worse, feet. Discontinued decades past.
Nothing as effective has ever been seen since on any pharmacsist shelves.

Have you tried all of them? I have an exellent non Blackmores foot balm.

If I haven’t tried it off my own bat, My skin specialist has referred me to them.

I am serious. I called Blackmmores and they had no reason for discontinuing it. Simply that they didn’t make it anymore.

roughbarked said:

Ian said:

roughbarked said:

I cannot say much about recent Blackmore’s stuff but in the old days, it was good.
I do think the old man was at least genuine.
The best skin cream for chapped or worse, feet. Discontinued decades past.
Nothing as effective has ever been seen since on any pharmacsist shelves.

Have you tried all of them? I have an exellent non Blackmores foot balm.

If I haven’t tried it off my own bat, My skin specialist has referred me to them.

I am serious. I called Blackmmores and they had no reason for discontinuing it. Simply that they didn’t make it anymore.

Probably discovered it can give you cancer.

roughbarked said:

Ian said:

roughbarked said:

I cannot say much about recent Blackmore’s stuff but in the old days, it was good.
I do think the old man was at least genuine.
The best skin cream for chapped or worse, feet. Discontinued decades past.
Nothing as effective has ever been seen since on any pharmacsist shelves.

Have you tried all of them? I have an exellent non Blackmores foot balm.

If I haven’t tried it off my own bat, My skin specialist has referred me to them.

I am serious. I called Blackmmores and they had no reason for discontinuing it. Simply that they didn’t make it anymore.

I’m sure I still have the empty jar somewhere though the label is probably hard to read. One application overnight and my chapped feet would be as smooth as a baby’s bum, no kidding. It probably contained hydrochloric acid for all I know.

PermeateFree said:

roughbarked said:

Ian said:

Have you tried all of them? I have an exellent non Blackmores foot balm.

If I haven’t tried it off my own bat, My skin specialist has referred me to them.

I am serious. I called Blackmmores and they had no reason for discontinuing it. Simply that they didn’t make it anymore.

Probably discovered it can give you cancer.

Well that didn’t work. The only diseases I have, I wish they would kill me.

roughbarked said:

PermeateFree said:

roughbarked said:

If I haven’t tried it off my own bat, My skin specialist has referred me to them.

I am serious. I called Blackmmores and they had no reason for discontinuing it. Simply that they didn’t make it anymore.

Probably discovered it can give you cancer.

Well that didn’t work. The only diseases I have, I wish they would kill me.

Notably https://rarediseases.info.nih.gov/diseases/7480/prurigo-nodularis

rb misses the point of the OP and John Dwyer’s objection to a Blackmores funded naturopathic study centre in a university.

Ian said:

rb misses the point of the OP and John Dwyer’s objection to a Blackmores funded naturopathic study centre in a university.

Of course I do.
What else to expect of me?

roughbarked said:

Ian said:

rb misses the point of the OP and John Dwyer’s objection to a Blackmores funded naturopathic study centre in a university.

Of course I do.
What else to expect of me?

I don’t actually care about that part. I’m simply anecdotally informing you of the various things I tested, that I could give a nod to. Notably I only mentioned but a few.

Ian said:

roughbarked said:

Ian said:

https://www.abc.net.au/news/2018-11-29/blackmores-pledges-donation-will-not-compromise-scu-research/10567286

The man behind a $10 million donation to Southern Cross University in northern New South Wales says he will not try to influence what is taught in holistic medical courses.

The head of the Blackmores vitamin empire, Marcus Blackmore, and his wife Caroline handed over the money this week to the university at a ceremony in Sydney.

The funds will be used to establish a National Centre for Naturopathic Medicine at the University.

Mr Blackmore said the donation had no strings attached and is to fulfil his father’s dying wish.

“My father, who is regularly referred to as Australia’s pioneering naturopath, said on his death bed that it saddened him not to see naturopathy as a profession in his lifetime,” Mr Blackmore said.

He said the university’s reputation would not be compromised.

“It’s actually more about teaching people about naturopathic medicine as a profession, and giving that the respect it deserves in Australia and overseas.

“I think the world has moved on, and I think those things which a decade ago some people might have felt some discomfort, now they realise they’re mainstream,” he said…

But Emeritus Professor, John Dwyer, from the Friends of Science in Medicine group thinks SCU is being compromised by accepting the personal gift.

“Blackmores is a company that’s made a fortune capitalising on the poor health of Australians and convincing them they need a whole lot of supplements and vitamins they don’t need,” Professor Dwyer said.

“Naturopathic medicine has got a long way to go to get the respect from clinical-based evidence scientists.

“This will only downgrade the level of tertiary academic standards at the university, not improve them,” he said.

“To spend more money on doing research on homeopathy would almost be unconscionable,” Professor Dwyer said.

—-

John Dwyer in the last couple of days has been outspoken in criticising the validity of study in the OP.

I cannot say much about recent Blackmore’s stuff but in the old days, it was good.
I do think the old man was at least genuine.
The best skin cream for chapped or worse, feet. Discontinued decades past.
Nothing as effective has ever been seen since on any pharmacsist shelves.

Have you tried all of them? I have an exellent non Blackmores foot balm.

Lanolin.

buffy said:

Ian said:

roughbarked said:

I cannot say much about recent Blackmore’s stuff but in the old days, it was good.
I do think the old man was at least genuine.
The best skin cream for chapped or worse, feet. Discontinued decades past.
Nothing as effective has ever been seen since on any pharmacsist shelves.

Have you tried all of them? I have an exellent non Blackmores foot balm.

Lanolin.

Yep. A big part, I am sure.

buffy said:

Ian said:

roughbarked said:

I cannot say much about recent Blackmore’s stuff but in the old days, it was good.
I do think the old man was at least genuine.
The best skin cream for chapped or worse, feet. Discontinued decades past.
Nothing as effective has ever been seen since on any pharmacsist shelves.

Have you tried all of them? I have an exellent non Blackmores foot balm.

Lanolin.

As anhydrous wool fat. Love this stuff.

Michael V said:

buffy said:

Ian said:

Have you tried all of them? I have an exellent non Blackmores foot balm.

Lanolin.

As anhydrous wool fat. Love this stuff.

Living off the sheep(‘s sic). back.

buffy said:

Lanolin.

Shit, I wouldn’t even rub that stuff on my pet sheep.

sibeen said:

buffy said:

Lanolin.

Shit, I wouldn’t even rub that stuff on my pet sheep.

you dog would love it though.

ChrispenEvan said:

sibeen said:

buffy said:

Lanolin.

Shit, I wouldn’t even rub that stuff on my pet sheep.

your dog would love it though.

better r

sibeen said:

buffy said:

Lanolin.

Shit, I wouldn’t even rub that stuff on my pet sheep.

We aren’t talking about sheep…we are talking about feet. Put a new battery in your hearing aid…

:)

buffy said:

sibeen said:

buffy said:

Lanolin.

Shit, I wouldn’t even rub that stuff on my pet sheep.

We aren’t talking about sheep…we are talking about feet. Put a new battery in your hearing aid…

:)

giggle

roughbarked said:

Michael V said:

buffy said:

Lanolin.

As anhydrous wool fat. Love this stuff.

Living off the sheep(‘s sic). back.

The thing about homeopathy or even naturopathy that most people seem to miss is the hair of a dog thing. I don’t care about magical dissolution levels. If I want hair of the dog, the rawest form is the bit to nibble on.
An anecdotal comment ensues: Back in the seventies(you see, I can remember this shit), a good mate from the nearby town of Leeton turned up with an extremely hungover attractive woman. He of course, wanted lively chat. It is how I knew him. His consort however was very worse for the last nights wear. I instructed her to lie down in the shade of the tortured willow next to the peppermint bed and offered the hint, “a little nibble on the tips of he plant by your elbow may help you”. About three minutes later, she was up and communicating.

buffy said:

sibeen said:

buffy said:

Lanolin.

Shit, I wouldn’t even rub that stuff on my pet sheep.

We aren’t talking about sheep…we are talking about feet. Put a new battery in your hearing aid…

:)

Cheers. :)

roughbarked said:

roughbarked said:

Michael V said:

As anhydrous wool fat. Love this stuff.

Living off the sheep(‘s sic). back.

The thing about homeopathy or even naturopathy that most people seem to miss is the hair of a dog thing. I don’t care about magical dissolution levels. If I want hair of the dog, the rawest form is the bit to nibble on.
An anecdotal comment ensues: Back in the seventies(you see, I can remember this shit), a good mate from the nearby town of Leeton turned up with an extremely hungover attractive woman. He of course, wanted lively chat. It is how I knew him. His consort however was very worse for the last nights wear. I instructed her to lie down in the shade of the tortured willow next to the peppermint bed and offered the hint, “a little nibble on the tips of he plant by your elbow may help you”. About three minutes later, she was up and communicating.

what a load of unrelated crap.

ChrispenEvan said:

roughbarked said:

roughbarked said:

Living off the sheep(‘s sic). back.

The thing about homeopathy or even naturopathy that most people seem to miss is the hair of a dog thing. I don’t care about magical dissolution levels. If I want hair of the dog, the rawest form is the bit to nibble on.
An anecdotal comment ensues: Back in the seventies(you see, I can remember this shit), a good mate from the nearby town of Leeton turned up with an extremely hungover attractive woman. He of course, wanted lively chat. It is how I knew him. His consort however was very worse for the last nights wear. I instructed her to lie down in the shade of the tortured willow next to the peppermint bed and offered the hint, “a little nibble on the tips of he plant by your elbow may help you”. About three minutes later, she was up and communicating.

what a load of unrelated crap.

Of course. However, you cannot deny that peppermint is a stimulant.

roughbarked said:

ChrispenEvan said:

roughbarked said:

The thing about homeopathy or even naturopathy that most people seem to miss is the hair of a dog thing. I don’t care about magical dissolution levels. If I want hair of the dog, the rawest form is the bit to nibble on.
An anecdotal comment ensues: Back in the seventies(you see, I can remember this shit), a good mate from the nearby town of Leeton turned up with an extremely hungover attractive woman. He of course, wanted lively chat. It is how I knew him. His consort however was very worse for the last nights wear. I instructed her to lie down in the shade of the tortured willow next to the peppermint bed and offered the hint, “a little nibble on the tips of he plant by your elbow may help you”. About three minutes later, she was up and communicating.

what a load of unrelated crap.

Of course. However, you cannot deny that peppermint is a stimulant.

well, i can until i see something other than anecdote.

ChrispenEvan said:

roughbarked said:

ChrispenEvan said:

what a load of unrelated crap.

Of course. However, you cannot deny that peppermint is a stimulant.

well, i can until i see something other than anecdote.

I’m not here for an argument. This is all play as I am sure you know by now.

roughbarked said:

ChrispenEvan said:

roughbarked said:

Of course. However, you cannot deny that peppermint is a stimulant.

well, i can until i see something other than anecdote.

I’m not here for an argument. This is all play as I am sure you know by now.

You want to test someone who has tried everything to see if it works? Even the skin specialist cannot figure out what I’ve done to myself. The important thing is that he could not find a positive result with any of his tests for whatever may be causing a possible skin allergic presentation and it did cause him to be peturbed.

roughbarked said:

roughbarked said:

ChrispenEvan said:

well, i can until i see something other than anecdote.

I’m not here for an argument. This is all play as I am sure you know by now.

You want to test someone who has tried everything to see if it works? Even the skin specialist cannot figure out what I’ve done to myself. The important thing is that he could not find a positive result with any of his tests for whatever may be causing a possible skin allergic presentation and it did cause him to be peturbed.

stop press: science doesn’t know everything!

ChrispenEvan said:

roughbarked said:

roughbarked said:

I’m not here for an argument. This is all play as I am sure you know by now.

You want to test someone who has tried everything to see if it works? Even the skin specialist cannot figure out what I’ve done to myself. The important thing is that he could not find a positive result with any of his tests for whatever may be causing a possible skin allergic presentation and it did cause him to be peturbed.

stop press: science doesn’t know everything!

who ever said it did?