just wondering, i’ve looked before at graphs of spectral output of the sun, what the earth gets, changes over time, now wondering about the temperature of space in the earth’s orbit, variations of that, if any, and what’s significant

also thinking about drag losses, for want of a better expression, what gasses are lost (or gained) as the earth orbits the sun, and oter tings related

it’s easy to sort of think about the earth’s orbit as a path through space, through nothingness, but it’s not

transition said:

just wondering, i’ve looked before at graphs of spectral output of the sun, what the earth gets, changes over time, now wondering about the temperature of space in the earth’s orbit, variations of that, if any, and what’s significant

also thinking about drag losses, for want of a better expression, what gasses are lost (or gained) as the earth orbits the sun, and oter tings related

it’s easy to sort of think about the earth’s orbit as a path through space, through nothingness, but it’s not

No need to take your inspiration from Barnaby, the external influences on the climate are well documented, and don’t account for the observed changes in climate over the last 150 years or so.

There are non-GHG internal influences that are not so well documented but the ones that I know of are reducing warming in the short term, rather than increasing it (particle emissions and increased albedo from forest clearance).

One thing that is not directly GHG related that is increasing bush fire risk is the reduced rainfall and increased droughts due to forest clearance. There is a good article on that in last week’s NS.

So if BJ is arguing for additional restrictions on land clearance, as well as increased action to reduce GHG emissions, we should support him in both respects.

The thing is:

Per the Milankovitch cycles, we should be in a cooling phase right now.

Anyway, why are we focussing on has-been Barnaby, when his replacement Wossisname is just as bad, if not worse?

dv said:

The thing is:

Per the Milankovitch cycles, we should be in a cooling phase right now.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Milankovitch_cycles

yeah I was thinking the temperature of space in the earth’s orbit is ~10C, or just over from what I quickly read

of course there’s very little matter, gasses or whatever for conduction of heat

The Rev Dodgson said:

Anyway, why are we focussing on has-been Barnaby, when his replacement Wossisname is just as bad, if not worse?

i’m trying to be interesting, I do that a lot, the struggle for significance you know

transition said:

dv said:

The thing is:

Per the Milankovitch cycles, we should be in a cooling phase right now.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Milankovitch_cycles

yeah I was thinking the temperature of space in the earth’s orbit is ~10C, or just over from what I quickly read

of course there’s very little matter, gasses or whatever for conduction of heat

the “temperature of space” isn’t really the issue. Milankovitch cycles relate to total insolation.

dv said:

transition said:

dv said:

The thing is:

Per the Milankovitch cycles, we should be in a cooling phase right now.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Milankovitch_cycles

yeah I was thinking the temperature of space in the earth’s orbit is ~10C, or just over from what I quickly read

of course there’s very little matter, gasses or whatever for conduction of heat

the “temperature of space” isn’t really the issue. Milankovitch cycles relate to total insolation.

yeah I see that, but my OP Q was re temperature of space in the earth’s orbit, i’d never considered it before, and guess it’d be insignificant to earth’s climate/temperature

The Internet says transition is right about the 10 degree C temperature, although how that is defined, and what that actually means, I don’t know.

https://sciencing.com/temperatures-outer-space-around-earth-20254.html

I note too it’s projected a 1C increase in global temperature may increase lightning strikes as much as 12%, which really matter in dry areas when you get dry thunder storms

The Rev Dodgson said:

The Internet says transition is right about the 10 degree C temperature, although how that is defined, and what that actually means, I don’t know.

https://sciencing.com/temperatures-outer-space-around-earth-20254.html

Does seem to be a bit arbitrary.

The Rev Dodgson said:

One thing that is not directly GHG related that is increasing bush fire risk is the reduced rainfall and increased droughts due to forest clearance. There is a good article on that in last week’s NS.

So if BJ is arguing for additional restrictions on land clearance, as well as increased action to reduce GHG emissions, we should support him in both respects.

Despite this we have people saying that we should manage the bush to suit modern humans. ie: thin the few bits we have left so that they can park six electoral buses in the space between each tree and it’s neighbour. Import rhinocerous to eat the grass and stomp on fires.

transition said:

I note too it’s projected a 1C increase in global temperature may increase lightning strikes as much as 12%, which really matter in dry areas when you get dry thunder storms

So climate change does cause bushfires then?

roughbarked said:

The Rev Dodgson said:

One thing that is not directly GHG related that is increasing bush fire risk is the reduced rainfall and increased droughts due to forest clearance. There is a good article on that in last week’s NS.

So if BJ is arguing for additional restrictions on land clearance, as well as increased action to reduce GHG emissions, we should support him in both respects.

Despite this we have people saying that we should manage the bush to suit modern humans. ie: thin the few bits we have left so that they can park six electoral buses in the space between each tree and it’s neighbour. Import rhinocerous to eat the grass and stomp on fires.

oh but that’s the beauty part. When winter rolls round the rhinoceroses simply freeze to death

dv said:

roughbarked said:

The Rev Dodgson said:

One thing that is not directly GHG related that is increasing bush fire risk is the reduced rainfall and increased droughts due to forest clearance. There is a good article on that in last week’s NS.

So if BJ is arguing for additional restrictions on land clearance, as well as increased action to reduce GHG emissions, we should support him in both respects.

Despite this we have people saying that we should manage the bush to suit modern humans. ie: thin the few bits we have left so that they can park six electoral buses in the space between each tree and it’s neighbour. Import rhinocerous to eat the grass and stomp on fires.

oh but that’s the beauty part. When winter rolls round the rhinoceroses simply freeze to death

I heard they go in search of unsuspecting campers so they can sneak inside their sleeping bags and huddle up for warmth.

Yes, many a young camper has woken up with a horn.

The Rev Dodgson said:

Anyway, why are we focussing on has-been Barnaby, when his replacement Wossisname is just as bad, if not worse?

Because Barnaby thinks he can get his job back by making stuff up. McCormack isn’t even capable of making stuff up. He simply repeats what the fucktards in his electorate tell him to say.

dv said:

Yes, many a young camper has woken up with a horn.

Oh dear.

roughbarked said:

transition said:

I note too it’s projected a 1C increase in global temperature may increase lightning strikes as much as 12%, which really matter in dry areas when you get dry thunder storms

So climate change does cause bushfires then?

it’s still required to state the in-between steps, mention the lightning, even in a climate-centric model of reality, the new environmental determinism, you’re learning the sentiments needed, the worries, and the language, it’s catchy

Michael V said:

dv said:

Yes, many a young camper has woken up with a horn.

Oh dear.

Yes dear.

I got the fkn ‘orn

Ian said:

Michael V said:

dv said:

Yes, many a young camper has woken up with a horn.

Oh dear.

Yes dear.

I got the fkn ‘orn

Do you want a B-J?

> yeah I see that, but my OP Q was re temperature of space in the earth’s orbit, i’d never considered it before, and guess it’d be insignificant to earth’s climate/temperature

Fair enough. There are actually four different definitions of “temperature of space in Earth’s orbit”. They are not all equally important.

1) One is the temperature of the solar wind at the Earth’s orbit. This is hot, like 140,000 degrees Kelvin. But space has such low gas density out there that the temperature of this gas has only one significant effect on Earth’s weather. It’s this solar wind that gives the Earth its auroras, so a heating of the upper atmosphere where the auroras come closest to the surface. Look at the graph below, the heating of the thermosphere at altitudes above 80 km is due to this gas from the solar wind.

2) Another is the temperature of the cosmological microwave background. At 2.725 Kelvin, this is cold, very cold. The effect of this low temperature is to accept outgoing infrared and microwave radiation form the Earth. It’s this outward radiation that allows undercooling with condensation during the night, making the surfaces of, for example galvanised iron cooler than the adjacent air. If it wasn’t for natural convection in the night air (eg. on a still cloudless night) the surface temperature could drop up to 20 degrees below the air temperature . But because of atmospheric convection this is normally limited to about a 2 degree drop.

3) A third temperature of space is the temperature of incoming starlight, and because the Sun counts as a typical star (in this context, not in some other contexts), the temperature of this incoming radiation is about 5,780 degrees Kelvin. Hot, but nowhere near as hot as the solar wind. That’s what we receive during the day, it drives photosynthesis and almost everything else we know.

4) A fourth temperature of space at the Earth’s orbit is -77 degrees Celsius. Cold, but nowhere near as cold as the cosmological microwave background. This is the mean temperature that the Earth would have it it didn’t have an atmosphere to keep it warm. To put it in apocalyptic terms, if the Earth had no carbon dioxide and water in its atmosphere, this would be roughly the temperature it would be outside when you’re putting out the garbage.