Which of these well-known words are borrowed from an aboriginal language? And if so then an aboriginal language in which state of Australia?
?
Which of these well-known words are borrowed from an aboriginal language? And if so then an aboriginal language in which state of Australia?
You’re welcome.
One of the appendices in Dawson’s tome includes names of animals in three local languages.
Echidna: Yuluwill/Willang gnilak/Wilang’gil
Emu: Kowwirr/Kappring or barringmall/Kapping
Kangaroo: kuurae/kuuriin/kuuriin
But there are different types of kangaroo:
Red kangaroo: Kaemun’gor/Puunporn/Kaemun’gor
Brush kangaroo: Kalarn/Kalarn/Karlarn
Wallaby: Peerae/Peerae or berra/Berra
Kookaburra: Kuurnk kuurnk/Kuunit/Kuunit
Platypus: Mirwil or mirpeeal/Allertil/Torron’gil
Wombat: Meeam/Meeam/Meeam
It doesn’t look like any of those were adopted into English. Words for meetings, women, children are much more complex, because various descriptions apply.
Been good so far.
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mollwollfumble said:
Which of these well-known words are borrowed from an aboriginal language? And if so then an aboriginal language in which state of Australia?
- corroboree – English, originally corroborie and probably based on corroborate
- echidna – Greek – a half-lizard Greek deity
- emu – English, named in England in 1790
- jin – aboriginal Dharug from Sydney, NSW
- kangaroo – aboriginal Cooktown, Qld
- kookaburra – aboriginal Wiradjuri, outback NSW – only entered English very late, in 1870, for use in the pet trade.
- lubra – aboriginal Adelaide, SA
- piccaninny – aboriginal Dharug from Sydney, NSW
- platypus – Greek
- wombat – aboriginal Dharug from Sydney, NSW – originally as waumbut
You’re welcome.
Shenanigans. See:
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pickaninny
> One of the appendices in Dawson’s tome includes names of animals in three local languages.
Thanks for that, buffy.
Michael V said:
mollwollfumble said:
Which of these well-known words are borrowed from an aboriginal language? And if so then an aboriginal language in which state of Australia?
- corroboree – English, originally corroborie and probably based on corroborate
- echidna – Greek – a half-lizard Greek deity
- emu – English, named in England in 1790
- jin – aboriginal Dharug from Sydney, NSW
- kangaroo – aboriginal Cooktown, Qld
- kookaburra – aboriginal Wiradjuri, outback NSW – only entered English very late, in 1870, for use in the pet trade.
- lubra – aboriginal Adelaide, SA
- piccaninny – aboriginal Dharug from Sydney, NSW
- platypus – Greek
- wombat – aboriginal Dharug from Sydney, NSW – originally as waumbut
You’re welcome.
- piccaninny – aboriginal Dharug from Sydney, NSW
Shenanigans. See:
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pickaninny
> “The word “pikinini” is used in Tok Pisin, Solomon Pijin and Bislama (the Melanesian pidgin dialects of Papua New Guinea, Solomon Islands and Vanuatu respectively)”.
I stand corrected. Thank you. Do you have a date for that? The Pidgin languages perhaps came later, or earlier?
I’ve found a reference where a Sydney native did use the word circa 1818, in the phrase “him make good settler, him be my pickinin”. And a white referred to a “jin and her pickinini” from Sydney, where “jin” is a Dharug word, in 1826. But I was uncertain as I’ve also seen a reference to the word pickinini being used (many years later) by an aborigine from the Kimberley.
> pikinini – child (from Pacific Pidgin English, but ultimately from Portuguese influenced Lingua franca, cf. pickaninny)
Hold on, Portuguese? Nah.
Michael V said:
mollwollfumble said:
Which of these well-known words are borrowed from an aboriginal language? And if so then an aboriginal language in which state of Australia?
- corroboree – English, originally corroborie and probably based on corroborate
- echidna – Greek – a half-lizard Greek deity
- emu – English, named in England in 1790
- jin – aboriginal Dharug from Sydney, NSW
- kangaroo – aboriginal Cooktown, Qld
- kookaburra – aboriginal Wiradjuri, outback NSW – only entered English very late, in 1870, for use in the pet trade.
- lubra – aboriginal Adelaide, SA
- piccaninny – aboriginal Dharug from Sydney, NSW
- platypus – Greek
- wombat – aboriginal Dharug from Sydney, NSW – originally as waumbut
You’re welcome.
- piccaninny – aboriginal Dharug from Sydney, NSW
Shenanigans. See:
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pickaninny
Not used by Matthew Flinders in his Voyage to Terra Australia. 1814. Not used by James Cook in his first Voyage, second Voyage, journal.
Hold on, WTF, the word “Le Piccinino” is Corsican for “The Little Ones”.
Borrowed from the Corsican language?! From French explorers?
mollwollfumble said:
Michael V said:
mollwollfumble said:
Which of these well-known words are borrowed from an aboriginal language? And if so then an aboriginal language in which state of Australia?
- corroboree – English, originally corroborie and probably based on corroborate
- echidna – Greek – a half-lizard Greek deity
- emu – English, named in England in 1790
- jin – aboriginal Dharug from Sydney, NSW
- kangaroo – aboriginal Cooktown, Qld
- kookaburra – aboriginal Wiradjuri, outback NSW – only entered English very late, in 1870, for use in the pet trade.
- lubra – aboriginal Adelaide, SA
- piccaninny – aboriginal Dharug from Sydney, NSW
- platypus – Greek
- wombat – aboriginal Dharug from Sydney, NSW – originally as waumbut
You’re welcome.
- piccaninny – aboriginal Dharug from Sydney, NSW
Shenanigans. See:
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pickaninny
Not used by Matthew Flinders in his Voyage to Terra Australia. 1814. Not used by James Cook in his first Voyage, second Voyage, journal.
Hold on, WTF, the word “Le Piccinino” is Corsican for “The Little Ones”.
Borrowed from the Corsican language?! From French explorers?
Wouldn’t a more plausible explanation be that British navy and army personnel were familiar with the term from time spent in the West Indies and they used the familiar term to describe Australian Aboriginal children and it became common usage here?
Witty Rejoinder said:
mollwollfumble said:
Michael V said:
- piccaninny – aboriginal Dharug from Sydney, NSW
Shenanigans. See:
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pickaninny
Not used by Matthew Flinders in his Voyage to Terra Australia. 1814. Not used by James Cook in his first Voyage, second Voyage, journal.
Hold on, WTF, the word “Le Piccinino” is Corsican for “The Little Ones”.
Borrowed from the Corsican language?! From French explorers?
Wouldn’t a more plausible explanation be that British navy and army personnel were familiar with the term from time spent in the West Indies and they used the familiar term to describe Australian Aboriginal children and it became common usage here?
Huh? Used in the West Indes? I haven’t heard that.
>> pikinini – child (from Pacific Pidgin English, but ultimately from Portuguese influenced Lingua franca, cf. pickaninny)
> Hold on, Portuguese? Nah.
Hold on, Portuguese is not impossible.
The word “small” translates to “piccolo/piccola” in Italian. To “picculu” in Corsican.
The word “small” translates to “pequeno/pequena” in Portuguese. “Pequena” would sound like “Pikinni” – (as in Bikini atoll?)
Spanish is very similar with “pequeño/pequeña”.
The suffix “-ino,-ina” in Italian also translates as small. Could “Pikinn-ina” have become “Pikinnini”?
I really need to track down the first Pacific explorer to use the word.
Magellan? A copy of Magellan’s journal is on the web, but I don’t see a text rendition. Magellan’s ship (under Elcano, because Magellan was dead by then) got as close to Australia as Timor in 1522.
Looking up “Bikini atoll” gives:
“The island’s English name is derived from the German colonial name Bikini given to the atoll when it was part of German New Guinea. The German name is transliterated from the Marshallese name for the island, Pikinni, () “Pik” meaning “surface” and “Ni” meaning “coconut”, or surface of coconuts.”
So “Bikini Atoll” is the same use of Pikinni but with a different explanation.
mollwollfumble said:
Witty Rejoinder said:
mollwollfumble said:Not used by Matthew Flinders in his Voyage to Terra Australia. 1814. Not used by James Cook in his first Voyage, second Voyage, journal.
Hold on, WTF, the word “Le Piccinino” is Corsican for “The Little Ones”.
Borrowed from the Corsican language?! From French explorers?
Wouldn’t a more plausible explanation be that British navy and army personnel were familiar with the term from time spent in the West Indies and they used the familiar term to describe Australian Aboriginal children and it became common usage here?
Huh? Used in the West Indes? I haven’t heard that.
“Together with several other Portuguese forms, pequeno and its diminutive pequenino have been widely adopted in many Pidgin or Creole languages, for ‘child’, ‘small’ and similar meanings. They are quite common in the creole languages of the Caribbean, especially those which are English-based. The Patois dialect of Jamaica, the word has been shortened to the form “pickney”, which is used to describe a child regardless of racial origin, while in the English-based national creole language of Suriname, Sranang Tongo, pequeno has been borrowed as pikin for “small” and “child”.”
From: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pickaninny
Witty Rejoinder said:
mollwollfumble said:
Witty Rejoinder said:Wouldn’t a more plausible explanation be that British navy and army personnel were familiar with the term from time spent in the West Indies and they used the familiar term to describe Australian Aboriginal children and it became common usage here?
Huh? Used in the West Indes? I haven’t heard that.
“Together with several other Portuguese forms, pequeno and its diminutive pequenino have been widely adopted in many Pidgin or Creole languages, for ‘child’, ‘small’ and similar meanings. They are quite common in the creole languages of the Caribbean, especially those which are English-based. The Patois dialect of Jamaica, the word has been shortened to the form “pickney”, which is used to describe a child regardless of racial origin, while in the English-based national creole language of Suriname, Sranang Tongo, pequeno has been borrowed as pikin for “small” and “child”.”
From: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pickaninny
Yeah, I gave that reference when I called shenanigans.
Michael V said:
Witty Rejoinder said:
mollwollfumble said:Huh? Used in the West Indes? I haven’t heard that.
“Together with several other Portuguese forms, pequeno and its diminutive pequenino have been widely adopted in many Pidgin or Creole languages, for ‘child’, ‘small’ and similar meanings. They are quite common in the creole languages of the Caribbean, especially those which are English-based. The Patois dialect of Jamaica, the word has been shortened to the form “pickney”, which is used to describe a child regardless of racial origin, while in the English-based national creole language of Suriname, Sranang Tongo, pequeno has been borrowed as pikin for “small” and “child”.”
From: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pickaninny
Yeah, I gave that reference when I called shenanigans.
At least you know i’m at least reading your posts. :-)
Witty Rejoinder said:
Michael V said:
Witty Rejoinder said:“Together with several other Portuguese forms, pequeno and its diminutive pequenino have been widely adopted in many Pidgin or Creole languages, for ‘child’, ‘small’ and similar meanings. They are quite common in the creole languages of the Caribbean, especially those which are English-based. The Patois dialect of Jamaica, the word has been shortened to the form “pickney”, which is used to describe a child regardless of racial origin, while in the English-based national creole language of Suriname, Sranang Tongo, pequeno has been borrowed as pikin for “small” and “child”.”
From: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pickaninny
Yeah, I gave that reference when I called shenanigans.
At least you know i’m at least reading your posts. :-)
:)
Finally hacked into the Oxford English Dictionary online. I thought I’d have to go hardcopy, but no need.
https://www.lexico.com/definition/piccaninny
piccaninny, also spelled picaninny, US pickaninny.
Mid 17th century from West Indian creole, from Spanish pequeño or Portuguese pequeno ‘little’, pequenino ‘tiny’.
Look, it appears in so many pidgin languages throughout the Pacific that it probably got there straight from Portuguese pequenino from Portuguese explorers in the East Indes rather than via the West Indies.
I’ll check Dampier. No mention of piccaniny in any of Dampier’s accounts (already ruled out Cook & Flinders), despite him starting in the West Indes.
Piccaniny is not mentioned by Watkin Tench (1793).
Piccaniny is not mentioned by John Oxley (1820).
Piccaniny is not mentioned by Abel Tasman.
Piccaniny is not mentioned by Hume and Hovel (1825).
Piccaniny is not mentioned by Sturt (1829 to 1931).
Piccaniny is not mentioned by Darwin (1831 to 1837).
In 1832 January, in Parramatta, the newspaper has “On Tuesday, about 279 black natives, principally chiefs – with their respective one or two “gins’‘ & “piccaninies” …”
So not getting anywhere.
mollwollfumble said:
Finally hacked into the Oxford English Dictionary online. I thought I’d have to go hardcopy, but no need.https://www.lexico.com/definition/piccaninny
piccaninny, also spelled picaninny, US pickaninny.
Mid 17th century from West Indian creole, from Spanish pequeño or Portuguese pequeno ‘little’, pequenino ‘tiny’.
Look, it appears in so many pidgin languages throughout the Pacific that it probably got there straight from Portuguese pequenino from Portuguese explorers in the East Indes rather than via the West Indies.
I’ll check Dampier. No mention of piccaniny in any of Dampier’s accounts (already ruled out Cook & Flinders), despite him starting in the West Indes.
Piccaniny is not mentioned by Watkin Tench (1793).
Piccaniny is not mentioned by John Oxley (1820).
Piccaniny is not mentioned by Abel Tasman.
Piccaniny is not mentioned by Hume and Hovel (1825).
Piccaniny is not mentioned by Sturt (1829 to 1931).
Piccaniny is not mentioned by Darwin (1831 to 1837).In 1832 January, in Parramatta, the newspaper has “On Tuesday, about 279 black natives, principally chiefs – with their respective one or two “gins’‘ & “piccaninies” …”
So not getting anywhere.
Besides Magellan Portuguese explorers never went anywhere near the South Pacific.
mollwollfumble said:
Finally hacked into the Oxford English Dictionary online. I thought I’d have to go hardcopy, but no need.https://www.lexico.com/definition/piccaninny
piccaninny, also spelled picaninny, US pickaninny.
Mid 17th century from West Indian creole, from Spanish pequeño or Portuguese pequeno ‘little’, pequenino ‘tiny’.
Look, it appears in so many pidgin languages throughout the Pacific that it probably got there straight from Portuguese pequenino from Portuguese explorers in the East Indes rather than via the West Indies.
I’ll check Dampier. No mention of piccaniny in any of Dampier’s accounts (already ruled out Cook & Flinders), despite him starting in the West Indes.
Piccaniny is not mentioned by Watkin Tench (1793).
Piccaniny is not mentioned by John Oxley (1820).
Piccaniny is not mentioned by Abel Tasman.
Piccaniny is not mentioned by Hume and Hovel (1825).
Piccaniny is not mentioned by Sturt (1829 to 1931).
Piccaniny is not mentioned by Darwin (1831 to 1837).In 1832 January, in Parramatta, the newspaper has “On Tuesday, about 279 black natives, principally chiefs – with their respective one or two “gins’‘ & “piccaninies” …”
So not getting anywhere.
Anyway, what does pidgin have to do with any Aboriginal language?
What’s the Aboriginal word for…
You might have found this page because you are looking for a particular Aboriginal word. But like artist Ben Quilty, you might be disappointed…
Ben’s furious realisation
When Australian artist Ben Quilty was young, he took a road trip during which he hoped to “learn Aboriginal” along the way, picking up a book on the Pitjantjatjara language.
It wasn’t until he met a young Aboriginal man that he learned an important lesson.
“We showed him the book,” recalls Quilty, “and he said, ‘Why you learning that mob’s language?’ We said, ‘What – where are you from?’”
“And that’s the first time I realised we’d travelled through 62 language groups on that drive. I was 19 years old and I was ashamed. I was also furious that my whole education had missed the entire existence of Indigenous Australia.”
You’ve guessed it: There is no single Aboriginal word for a term. Before invasion, at least 250 Aboriginal languages existed, each possibly having a word for what you’re looking for.
Source: Aboriginal words in Australian English – Creative Spirits, retrieved from https://www.creativespirits.info/aboriginalculture/language/aboriginal-words-in-australian-english
Witty Rejoinder said:
mollwollfumble said:
Finally hacked into the Oxford English Dictionary online. I thought I’d have to go hardcopy, but no need.https://www.lexico.com/definition/piccaninny
piccaninny, also spelled picaninny, US pickaninny.
Mid 17th century from West Indian creole, from Spanish pequeño or Portuguese pequeno ‘little’, pequenino ‘tiny’.
Look, it appears in so many pidgin languages throughout the Pacific that it probably got there straight from Portuguese pequenino from Portuguese explorers in the East Indes rather than via the West Indies.
I’ll check Dampier. No mention of piccaniny in any of Dampier’s accounts (already ruled out Cook & Flinders), despite him starting in the West Indes.
Piccaniny is not mentioned by Watkin Tench (1793).
Piccaniny is not mentioned by John Oxley (1820).
Piccaniny is not mentioned by Abel Tasman.
Piccaniny is not mentioned by Hume and Hovel (1825).
Piccaniny is not mentioned by Sturt (1829 to 1931).
Piccaniny is not mentioned by Darwin (1831 to 1837).In 1832 January, in Parramatta, the newspaper has “On Tuesday, about 279 black natives, principally chiefs – with their respective one or two “gins’‘ & “piccaninies” …”
So not getting anywhere.
Besides Magellan Portuguese explorers never went anywhere near the South Pacific.
The East Indes was initially Portuguese. The West Indes was initially Spanish.
The Portuguese held parts Timor from 1702 to 1975. Many vessels from Australia went to Timor.
Pedro Fernandes de Queirós was Portuguese.
I can’t help wondering if the word made its way into English via Dutch. Doesn’t seem to have.
Piccaniny does not appear in the English translation of “The Voyages of Pedro Fernandez de Quiros, 1595 to 1606”
Piccaniny does not appear in “Terra Australis Incognita … Lately found out by Ferdinand de Quir” (1617)
Piccaniny is not mentioned by Bligh (1790) (Mutiny and Voyage to Timor)
Piccaniny is not mentioned by Bligh (1792) (Voyage to the South Sea in Search of Breadfruit)
Piccaniny is not mentioned by Peron (1801 to 1804, translated from French 1809) – Baudin, Freycinet expeditions.
Piccaniny is not mentioned in Logbooks of the lady Nelson (1800 to 1825)
Piccaniny is not mentioned in “Official Papers … Swan River Settlement” (1826 to 1830)
Piccaniny is not mentioned in Barrington “A voyage to botany bay”
Piccaniny is not mentioned in Bradley “Journal of A Voyage to New South Wales” (1786 to 1792)
Try elsewhere around the world.
Piccaniny is not mentioned in Stowe “Uncle Tom’s cabin” (1852)
Piccaniny is not mentioned in “Bayou Folk” (1894) – which includes American creole
Piccaniny is not mentioned in “Gombo Zhèbes – Little Dictionary of Creole Proverbs – selected from six creole dialects” (1885)
Piccaniny is not mentioned in “Nos Hommes et Notre Histoire” (1910), a French book about Creoles
Piccaniny is not mentioned in “Os dialectos romanicos ou neo-latinos na África, Ásia e América” (1881) by Adolfo Coelho. This is a book in Portuguese about latino dialects in Africa, Asia and America. “picciolo popolo” just means the stalk of a plant. “Pequena/pequeno” meaning “small” appears nine times.
In Grey (1837 to 1839, publ. 1841) “Two expeditions of discovery in Western and north-Western Australia” we find “pequeno”, the Portuguese word for small, in “Tabite : Tarro pequeno : A small earthen pan.”
In 1835 we find a mention in an Aboriginal word list, as borrowed from English.
Thomas Braidwood WILSON “A Voyage Round the World” http://gutenberg.net.au/ebooks13/1300561h.html
…
A SHORT VOCABULARY OF THE DIALECT OF THE NATIVES OF RAFFLES BAY. (Coburg Peninsula, NT)
…
WOMEN’S NAMES.
Dunakeit – Riveral
Margona – Wargana
Rudiea
Orie – Men.
Yal-cuhee – Women.
Ana-don-ye – A boy.
Ni-ad – A girl.
Nad-ia-man – Elder brother.
Nabarēē - Younger brother.
Picka-ninnie A young child, (evidently taken from us.)
Still no clue as to the jump from “pequina” to “piccaninies / picka-ninnie” in 1832 or earlier. It rapidly jumped from English to at least two Aboriginal languages.
As a child I was disturbed by the vehemence behind the word gubba when that word was thrown along with stones by aboriginal children passing by.
The ‘Gubba Man’
The most fearful cry Aboriginal people in north-west NSW could hear in the 1850s was ‘Gubbamen’ or ‘Gubba Man’ .
This term resulted from an Aboriginal mispronunciation of ‘government’ and it meant officers were coming to take more children away or do other ills to the community.
The word (sometimes shortened to just ‘Gubba’) was later applied to all white persons.
Source: Aboriginal words in Australian English – Creative Spirits, retrieved from https://www.creativespirits.info/aboriginalculture/language/aboriginal-words-in-australian-english#toc3
https://www.creativespirits.info/aboriginalculture/language/how-many-aboriginal-language-speakers-are-left