I swear to god, if Victoria goes into a third wave, I’m going to start slapping stupid people.

Rule 303 said:

I swear to god, if Victoria goes into a third wave, I’m going to start slapping stupid people.

Start by slapping those people who are delaying release of the vaccines that were developed 5 months ago.

Rule 303 said:

I swear to god, if Victoria goes into a third wave, I’m going to start slapping stupid people.

Slap them anyway because god isn’t listening.

mollwollfumble said:

Rule 303 said:

I swear to god, if Victoria goes into a third wave, I’m going to start slapping stupid people.

Start by slapping those people who are delaying release of the vaccines that were developed 5 months ago.

And which vaccine is that?

Witty Rejoinder said:

mollwollfumble said:

Rule 303 said:

I swear to god, if Victoria goes into a third wave, I’m going to start slapping stupid people.

Start by slapping those people who are delaying release of the vaccines that were developed 5 months ago.

And which vaccine is that?

The one in Trump’s head.

Witty Rejoinder said:

mollwollfumble said:

Rule 303 said:

I swear to god, if Victoria goes into a third wave, I’m going to start slapping stupid people.

Start by slapping those people who are delaying release of the vaccines that were developed 5 months ago.

And which vaccine is that?

All of them. CSIRO is on public record as saying that it had a vaccine one day after receiving coronavirus samples from China. And the vaccines that will be eventually released are exactly the same as those developed 5 months ago. By the time of release, the virus will have mutated.

Next slap TV presenters that appear on TV without wearing a face mask. Starting with Daniel Andrews.

mollwollfumble said:

CSIRO is on public record as saying that it had a vaccine one day after receiving coronavirus samples from China. And the vaccines that will be eventually released are exactly the same as those developed 5 months ago. By the time of release, the virus will have mutated.

Ref?

mollwollfumble said:

Witty Rejoinder said:

mollwollfumble said:

Start by slapping those people who are delaying release of the vaccines that were developed 5 months ago.

And which vaccine is that?

All of them. CSIRO is on public record as saying that it had a vaccine one day after receiving coronavirus samples from China. And the vaccines that will be eventually released are exactly the same as those developed 5 months ago. By the time of release, the virus will have mutated.

FMD you’re an idiot. Care to provide a ref?

Witty Rejoinder said:

mollwollfumble said:

Witty Rejoinder said:

And which vaccine is that?

All of them. CSIRO is on public record as saying that it had a vaccine one day after receiving coronavirus samples from China. And the vaccines that will be eventually released are exactly the same as those developed 5 months ago. By the time of release, the virus will have mutated.

FMD you’re an idiot. Care to provide a ref?

*throws pins across floor.

sarahs mum said:

Witty Rejoinder said:

mollwollfumble said:

All of them. CSIRO is on public record as saying that it had a vaccine one day after receiving coronavirus samples from China. And the vaccines that will be eventually released are exactly the same as those developed 5 months ago. By the time of release, the virus will have mutated.

FMD you’re an idiot. Care to provide a ref?

*throws pins across floor.

I take it you’ve never been bowling before

dv said:

sarahs mum said:

Witty Rejoinder said:

FMD you’re an idiot. Care to provide a ref?

*throws pins across floor.

I take it you’ve never been bowling before

bowling is fun and it’s easy to do
Yeah. Bowling. It brings out the swinger in you.

sarahs mum said:

dv said:

sarahs mum said:

*throws pins across floor.

I take it you’ve never been bowling before

bowling is fun and it’s easy to do
Yeah. Bowling. It brings out the swinger in you.

What’s with the pins across floor then? I’ve never heard the saying or statement or whatever it is.

sibeen said:

sarahs mum said:

dv said:

I take it you’ve never been bowling before

bowling is fun and it’s easy to do
Yeah. Bowling. It brings out the swinger in you.

What’s with the pins across floor then? I’ve never heard the saying or statement or whatever it is.

we thought it was a modern version of “spilling the beans” as related to security codes

sibeen said:

sarahs mum said:

dv said:

I take it you’ve never been bowling before

bowling is fun and it’s easy to do
Yeah. Bowling. It brings out the swinger in you.

What’s with the pins across floor then? I’ve never heard the saying or statement or whatever it is.

But you have heard that it is so quiet you can hear a pin drop.

sarahs mum said:

dv said:

sarahs mum said:

*throws pins across floor.

I take it you’ve never been bowling before

bowling is fun and it’s easy to do
Yeah. Bowling. It brings out the swinger in you.

Bowling does what now?

sarahs mum said:

sibeen said:

sarahs mum said:

bowling is fun and it’s easy to do
Yeah. Bowling. It brings out the swinger in you.

What’s with the pins across floor then? I’ve never heard the saying or statement or whatever it is.

But you have heard that it is so quiet you can hear a pin drop.

Yes to that.

sarahs mum said:

sibeen said:

sarahs mum said:

bowling is fun and it’s easy to do
Yeah. Bowling. It brings out the swinger in you.

What’s with the pins across floor then? I’ve never heard the saying or statement or whatever it is.

But you have heard that it is so quiet you can hear a pin drop.

Yes. WR was making a point of the fact that mollwolfumble had not responded.

Dark Orange said:

mollwollfumble said:

CSIRO is on public record as saying that it had a vaccine one day after receiving coronavirus samples from China. And the vaccines that will be eventually released are exactly the same as those developed 5 months ago. By the time of release, the virus will have mutated.

Ref?

OK we’re not mollwollfumble, at least not today, and we don’t have any such “public record” but we do have this

https://www.abc.net.au/news/2020-01-24/coronavirus-vaccine-work-starts-with-queensland-researchers/11896346

and stand by for more.

dv said:

sarahs mum said:

sibeen said:

What’s with the pins across floor then? I’ve never heard the saying or statement or whatever it is.

But you have heard that it is so quiet you can hear a pin drop.

Yes. WR was making a point of the fact that mollwolfumble had not responded.

wait, BilGilAlex is both sarahs mum and Whitty Rejoindehr ¿

sarahs mum said:

dv said:

sarahs mum said:

*throws pins across floor.

I take it you’ve never been bowling before

bowling is fun and it’s easy to do
Yeah. Bowling. It brings out the swinger in you.

She speaks true.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3Waf5ek5JDA

SCIENCE said:

Dark Orange said:

mollwollfumble said:

CSIRO is on public record as saying that it had a vaccine one day after receiving coronavirus samples from China. And the vaccines that will be eventually released are exactly the same as those developed 5 months ago. By the time of release, the virus will have mutated.

Ref?

OK we’re not mollwollfumble, at least not today, and we don’t have any such “public record” but we do have this

https://www.abc.net.au/news/2020-01-24/coronavirus-vaccine-work-starts-with-queensland-researchers/11896346

and stand by for more.

https://www.abc.net.au/news/2020-01-29/wuhan-coronavirus-created-in-australian-lab-outside-of-china/11906390

SCIENCE said:

SCIENCE said:

Dark Orange said:

Ref?

OK we’re not mollwollfumble, at least not today, and we don’t have any such “public record” but we do have this

https://www.abc.net.au/news/2020-01-24/coronavirus-vaccine-work-starts-with-queensland-researchers/11896346

and stand by for more.

https://www.abc.net.au/news/2020-01-29/wuhan-coronavirus-created-in-australian-lab-outside-of-china/11906390

and so, in summary, big talk, no salk

Neophyte said:

sarahs mum said:

dv said:

I take it you’ve never been bowling before

bowling is fun and it’s easy to do
Yeah. Bowling. It brings out the swinger in you.

She speaks true.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3Waf5ek5JDA

Yes Yes.I must have imagined it being green.

sarahs mum said:

Neophyte said:

sarahs mum said:

bowling is fun and it’s easy to do
Yeah. Bowling. It brings out the swinger in you.

She speaks true.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3Waf5ek5JDA

Yes Yes.I must have imagined it being green.

I got the year rightish.

Neophyte said:

sarahs mum said:

dv said:

I take it you’ve never been bowling before

bowling is fun and it’s easy to do
Yeah. Bowling. It brings out the swinger in you.

She speaks true.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3Waf5ek5JDA

Oh come on. Nobody wants to go swinger with skinheads!

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gKfMlQ7KWFE

SCIENCE said:

SCIENCE said:

SCIENCE said:

https://www.abc.net.au/news/2020-01-24/coronavirus-vaccine-work-starts-with-queensland-researchers/11896346

https://www.abc.net.au/news/2020-01-29/wuhan-coronavirus-created-in-australian-lab-outside-of-china/11906390

and so, in summary, big talk, no salk

On the other hand, that CHINA mouthpiece the WHO had this unbelievable lie to say

https://www.abc.net.au/news/2020-02-12/coronavirus-public-enemy-number-one-vaccine/11956446

The first vaccine targeting the new coronavirus could be 18 months away, and the outbreak could end up creating a global threat potentially worse than terrorism, the World Health Organisation (WHO) has warned.

who would believe something cautious and unfavourable like that eh? In the same article, CHINA KNEW

Hopes epidemic will be ‘over by April’

Meanwhile, China’s senior medical adviser on the outbreak, Zhong Nanshan, told Reuters the coronavirus outbreak may be over by April.

see, 100% engineered, bioweapon, autism

and since we’re on the topic

https://www.abc.net.au/news/2020-02-22/coronavirus-vaccine-animal-testing-days-away-uq-researchers/11991456

sarahs mum said:

sarahs mum said:

Neophyte said:

She speaks true.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3Waf5ek5JDA

Yes Yes.I must have imagined it being green.

I got the year rightish.

read accompanying stuff…

‘At the height of their career in 1967 The Twilights recorded this promotional track for Bowling as an EMI custom pressing courtesy of AMF. I believe it was available from bowling centres Australia wide. The Twilights comprised Glenn Shorrock, Terry Britten, Paddy McCartney, Laurie Pryor, Peter Brideoake & John Bywaters.’

Apparently we shouldn’t be aiming for this but it happened and now politics.

https://www.abc.net.au/news/2020-09-22/nsw-coronavirus-milestone-as-no-locally-acquired-cases-found/12687882

https://jamanetwork.com/journals/jamaophthalmology/fullarticle/2770872

“Association of Daily Wear of Eyeglasses With Susceptibility to Coronavirus Disease 2019 Infection”

Small observational study indicates that wearing spectacles pretty much full time may reduce the rick of catching COVID-19.

Michael V said:

https://jamanetwork.com/journals/jamaophthalmology/fullarticle/2770872

“Association of Daily Wear of Eyeglasses With Susceptibility to Coronavirus Disease 2019 Infection”

Small observational study indicates that wearing spectacles pretty much full time may reduce the rick of catching COVID-19.

And the nerds shall inherit the Earth

dv said:

Michael V said:

https://jamanetwork.com/journals/jamaophthalmology/fullarticle/2770872

“Association of Daily Wear of Eyeglasses With Susceptibility to Coronavirus Disease 2019 Infection”

Small observational study indicates that wearing spectacles pretty much full time may reduce the rick of catching COVID-19.

And the nerds shall inherit the Earth

:)

dv said:

Michael V said:

https://jamanetwork.com/journals/jamaophthalmology/fullarticle/2770872

“Association of Daily Wear of Eyeglasses With Susceptibility to Coronavirus Disease 2019 Infection”

Small observational study indicates that wearing spectacles pretty much full time may reduce the rick of catching COVID-19.

And the nerds shall inherit the Earth

and old farts.

sibeen said:

dv said:

Michael V said:

https://jamanetwork.com/journals/jamaophthalmology/fullarticle/2770872

“Association of Daily Wear of Eyeglasses With Susceptibility to Coronavirus Disease 2019 Infection”

Small observational study indicates that wearing spectacles pretty much full time may reduce the rick of catching COVID-19.

And the nerds shall inherit the Earth

and old farts.

and Biden in his sunnies

Michael V said:

https://jamanetwork.com/journals/jamaophthalmology/fullarticle/2770872

“Association of Daily Wear of Eyeglasses With Susceptibility to Coronavirus Disease 2019 Infection”

Small observational study indicates that wearing spectacles pretty much full time may reduce the rick of catching COVID-19.

I note that they didn’t consider people with astigmatism corrected by spectacles, in the study. Only myopia corrections.

Why the wait for a vaccine might be longer than you think

9 min video On Coronacast with Dr Norman Swan

There are several potential vaccines for coronavirus currently in phase 3 trials, but large scale safety and efficacy testing is far from the only hurdles the vaccines face.

The first round of vaccines could have complicated transportation and temperature requirements, and may have limited effectiveness and side effects.

So are the first available vaccines for COVID-19 the ones we’ll have to just deal with forever? Or could the second round of vaccines be even better?

Tau.Neutrino said:

Tau.Neutrino said:

Jacinda Ardern in hot water after breaking social distancing for selfie

Believing in yourself is different to vanity.

She said she did the wrong thing. ?

People exist, they have bodies, faces and identity.

Why are selfies seen in negative light for ?

Not everyone is narcissistic.

If they had fresh clean air blowing on them then that would be acceptable.

They would need a whole lot of fans for that.

this transgression is probably up there with overseeing mass murder and sterilisation of disadvantaged groups, diverting government funds into your friends’ deserving associates’ pockets, and sexual assault

bout half of U.S. adults (51%) now say they would definitely or probably get a vaccine to prevent COVID-19 if it were available today; nearly as many (49%) say they definitely or probably would not get vaccinated at this time. Intent to get a COVID-19 vaccine has fallen from 72% in May, a 21 percentage point drop.

https://www.pewresearch.org/science/2020/09/17/u-s-public-now-divided-over-whether-to-get-covid-19-vaccine/

Hahahaha, the USA really is fucked.

And for those who think it is the dumb fuck republicans at fault in this case it appears that it is the dumb fuck democrats who are even worse.

Politics now apparently trumps (sic) science.

sibeen said:

bout half of U.S. adults (51%) now say they would definitely or probably get a vaccine to prevent COVID-19 if it were available today; nearly as many (49%) say they definitely or probably would not get vaccinated at this time. Intent to get a COVID-19 vaccine has fallen from 72% in May, a 21 percentage point drop.

https://www.pewresearch.org/science/2020/09/17/u-s-public-now-divided-over-whether-to-get-covid-19-vaccine/

Hahahaha, the USA really is fucked.

And for those who think it is the dumb fuck republicans at fault in this case it appears that it is the dumb fuck democrats who are even worse.

Politics now apparently trumps (sic) science.

sibeen said:

bout half of U.S. adults (51%) now say they would definitely or probably get a vaccine to prevent COVID-19 if it were available today; nearly as many (49%) say they definitely or probably would not get vaccinated at this time. Intent to get a COVID-19 vaccine has fallen from 72% in May, a 21 percentage point drop.

https://www.pewresearch.org/science/2020/09/17/u-s-public-now-divided-over-whether-to-get-covid-19-vaccine/

Hahahaha, the USA really is fucked.

And for those who think it is the dumb fuck republicans at fault in this case it appears that it is the dumb fuck democrats who are even worse.

Politics now apparently trumps (sic) science.

Would you trust a vaccine that Donald Trump rushed into production just in time for his re-election campaign?

party_pants said:

sibeen said:

bout half of U.S. adults (51%) now say they would definitely or probably get a vaccine to prevent COVID-19 if it were available today; nearly as many (49%) say they definitely or probably would not get vaccinated at this time. Intent to get a COVID-19 vaccine has fallen from 72% in May, a 21 percentage point drop.

https://www.pewresearch.org/science/2020/09/17/u-s-public-now-divided-over-whether-to-get-covid-19-vaccine/

Hahahaha, the USA really is fucked.

And for those who think it is the dumb fuck republicans at fault in this case it appears that it is the dumb fuck democrats who are even worse.

Politics now apparently trumps (sic) science.

Would you trust a vaccine that Donald Trump rushed into production just in time for his re-election campaign?

That was my thoughts as well, re the Dems.

Bogsnorkler said:

party_pants said:

sibeen said:

bout half of U.S. adults (51%) now say they would definitely or probably get a vaccine to prevent COVID-19 if it were available today; nearly as many (49%) say they definitely or probably would not get vaccinated at this time. Intent to get a COVID-19 vaccine has fallen from 72% in May, a 21 percentage point drop.

https://www.pewresearch.org/science/2020/09/17/u-s-public-now-divided-over-whether-to-get-covid-19-vaccine/

Hahahaha, the USA really is fucked.

And for those who think it is the dumb fuck republicans at fault in this case it appears that it is the dumb fuck democrats who are even worse.

Politics now apparently trumps (sic) science.

Would you trust a vaccine that Donald Trump rushed into production just in time for his re-election campaign?

That was my thoughts as well, re the Dems.

We’re getting too cynical.

party_pants said:

sibeen said:

bout half of U.S. adults (51%) now say they would definitely or probably get a vaccine to prevent COVID-19 if it were available today; nearly as many (49%) say they definitely or probably would not get vaccinated at this time. Intent to get a COVID-19 vaccine has fallen from 72% in May, a 21 percentage point drop.

https://www.pewresearch.org/science/2020/09/17/u-s-public-now-divided-over-whether-to-get-covid-19-vaccine/

Hahahaha, the USA really is fucked.

And for those who think it is the dumb fuck republicans at fault in this case it appears that it is the dumb fuck democrats who are even worse.

Politics now apparently trumps (sic) science.

Would you trust a vaccine that Donald Trump rushed into production just in time for his re-election campaign?

May have too many unwanted side effects involving the following traits:

• serial Lying
• rude to people.
• dismissive to people
• likes power and control
• likes self promotion using other people
• treats people like crap
• greedy
• arrogant
• ignorant
• sexist
• racist
• misogynist
• woman molester
• tax avoider
• climate change denier
• wall builder, segregationist
• contradictory
• hypocrite
• bully
• making unwanted sexual advances
• groping and grabing women
• inciting hatred
• vain
• pompous
• narcissistic
• demagogue
• egotistical
• obnoxious
• megalomaniac
• control Freak
• vexed litigator
• vindictive
• cruel
• full of revenge
• full of hatred
• plagiarist
• likes attacking the Free Press
• insults people using the media
• criminal
• sociopath
• mocks people.
• inept
• incompetent
• stubborn
• stupid
• reckless
• changing opinion constantly
• changing history and what other people say constantly
• spreading fake news
• climate denier
• hostile to the homeless, poor and needy
• has terrible logic, goes against sound advice
• has horrendous ethics
• unstable
• throwing tantrums
• saying anything that comes to mind
• is ignorant on a lot of matters and history
• is real horrible pig of a person who I wouldn’t be friends with.
• going easily into denial
• turning a blind eye
• protecting the entrenched oligarchy
• Like glamour and attention
• Cheating

Better to talk with your doctor first.

sibeen said:

bout half of U.S. adults (51%) now say they would definitely or probably get a vaccine to prevent COVID-19 if it were available today; nearly as many (49%) say they definitely or probably would not get vaccinated at this time. Intent to get a COVID-19 vaccine has fallen from 72% in May, a 21 percentage point drop.

https://www.pewresearch.org/science/2020/09/17/u-s-public-now-divided-over-whether-to-get-covid-19-vaccine/

Hahahaha, the USA really is fucked.

And for those who think it is the dumb fuck republicans at fault in this case it appears that it is the dumb fuck democrats who are even worse.

Politics now apparently trumps (sic) science.

In all of that you failed to mention why the apparent change.

Bogsnorkler said:

party_pants said:

sibeen said:

bout half of U.S. adults (51%) now say they would definitely or probably get a vaccine to prevent COVID-19 if it were available today; nearly as many (49%) say they definitely or probably would not get vaccinated at this time. Intent to get a COVID-19 vaccine has fallen from 72% in May, a 21 percentage point drop.

https://www.pewresearch.org/science/2020/09/17/u-s-public-now-divided-over-whether-to-get-covid-19-vaccine/

Hahahaha, the USA really is fucked.

And for those who think it is the dumb fuck republicans at fault in this case it appears that it is the dumb fuck democrats who are even worse.

Politics now apparently trumps (sic) science.

Would you trust a vaccine that Donald Trump rushed into production just in time for his re-election campaign?

That was my thoughts as well, re the Dems.

Yep, politics now apparently trumps (sic) science. Trump doesn’t approve vaccines, that’s done by the FDA.

Witty Rejoinder said:

sibeen said:

bout half of U.S. adults (51%) now say they would definitely or probably get a vaccine to prevent COVID-19 if it were available today; nearly as many (49%) say they definitely or probably would not get vaccinated at this time. Intent to get a COVID-19 vaccine has fallen from 72% in May, a 21 percentage point drop.

https://www.pewresearch.org/science/2020/09/17/u-s-public-now-divided-over-whether-to-get-covid-19-vaccine/

Hahahaha, the USA really is fucked.

And for those who think it is the dumb fuck republicans at fault in this case it appears that it is the dumb fuck democrats who are even worse.

Politics now apparently trumps (sic) science.

In all of that you failed to mention why the apparent change.

Because dickheads, on both side, are politising science.

sibeen said:

Witty Rejoinder said:

sibeen said:

bout half of U.S. adults (51%) now say they would definitely or probably get a vaccine to prevent COVID-19 if it were available today; nearly as many (49%) say they definitely or probably would not get vaccinated at this time. Intent to get a COVID-19 vaccine has fallen from 72% in May, a 21 percentage point drop.

https://www.pewresearch.org/science/2020/09/17/u-s-public-now-divided-over-whether-to-get-covid-19-vaccine/

Hahahaha, the USA really is fucked.

And for those who think it is the dumb fuck republicans at fault in this case it appears that it is the dumb fuck democrats who are even worse.

Politics now apparently trumps (sic) science.

In all of that you failed to mention why the apparent change.

Because dickheads, on both side, are politising science.

yeah, but the other side has more dickheads!!!

sibeen said:

Bogsnorkler said:

party_pants said:

Would you trust a vaccine that Donald Trump rushed into production just in time for his re-election campaign?

That was my thoughts as well, re the Dems.

Yep, politics now apparently trumps (sic) science. Trump doesn’t approve vaccines, that’s done by the FDA.

Ah for an independent health authority like the WTHO or the FDTA.

Bogsnorkler said:

sibeen said:

Witty Rejoinder said:

In all of that you failed to mention why the apparent change.

Because dickheads, on both side, are politising science.

yeah, but the other side has more dickheads!!!

imagine a female president or vice president

sibeen said:

Witty Rejoinder said:

sibeen said:

bout half of U.S. adults (51%) now say they would definitely or probably get a vaccine to prevent COVID-19 if it were available today; nearly as many (49%) say they definitely or probably would not get vaccinated at this time. Intent to get a COVID-19 vaccine has fallen from 72% in May, a 21 percentage point drop.

https://www.pewresearch.org/science/2020/09/17/u-s-public-now-divided-over-whether-to-get-covid-19-vaccine/

Hahahaha, the USA really is fucked.

And for those who think it is the dumb fuck republicans at fault in this case it appears that it is the dumb fuck democrats who are even worse.

Politics now apparently trumps (sic) science.

In all of that you failed to mention why the apparent change.

Because dickheads, on both side, are politising science.

Not something you’d ever do I’m sure.

Bogsnorkler said:

sibeen said:

Witty Rejoinder said:

In all of that you failed to mention why the apparent change.

Because dickheads, on both side, are politising science.

yeah, but the other side has more dickheads!!!

Doesn’t make stupidity any less stupid.

Witty Rejoinder said:

sibeen said:

Witty Rejoinder said:

In all of that you failed to mention why the apparent change.

Because dickheads, on both side, are politising science.

Not something you’d ever do I’m sure.

WE ARE SCIENCE AND WE WON’T BE POLITISED

sibeen said:

Bogsnorkler said:

sibeen said:

Because dickheads, on both side, are politising science.

yeah, but the other side has more dickheads!!!

Doesn’t make stupidity any less stupid.

but if the question literally is, would you take a vaccine available right now, the smart answer is wtfnowait

remember COVIDSafe ¿ LOL

Witty Rejoinder said:

sibeen said:

Witty Rejoinder said:

In all of that you failed to mention why the apparent change.

Because dickheads, on both side, are politising science.

Not something you’d ever do I’m sure.

Fuck, I’m champing at the bit for Trump to get thrashed, but I can still call out stupidity on the side I support. Harris was being particularly fucktard on this issue the other day.

sibeen said:

Witty Rejoinder said:

sibeen said:

Because dickheads, on both side, are politising science.

Not something you’d ever do I’m sure.

Fuck, I’m champing at the bit for Trump to get thrashed, but I can still call out stupidity on the side I support. Harris was being particularly fucktard on this issue the other day.

what did they say

sibeen said:

Witty Rejoinder said:

sibeen said:

Because dickheads, on both side, are politising science.

Not something you’d ever do I’m sure.

Fuck, I’m champing at the bit for Trump to get thrashed, but I can still call out stupidity on the side I support. Harris was being particularly fucktard on this issue the other day.

What she do?

Witty Rejoinder said:

sibeen said:

Witty Rejoinder said:

Not something you’d ever do I’m sure.

Fuck, I’m champing at the bit for Trump to get thrashed, but I can still call out stupidity on the side I support. Harris was being particularly fucktard on this issue the other day.

What she do?

Kamala Harris says she wouldn’t trust Trump on safety of Covid vaccine before election

https://www.theguardian.com/us-news/2020/sep/05/kamala-harris-covid-vaccine-safety-trump-election

sibeen said:

Witty Rejoinder said:

sibeen said:

Because dickheads, on both side, are politising science.

Not something you’d ever do I’m sure.

Fuck, I’m champing at the bit for Trump to get thrashed, but I can still call out stupidity on the side I support. Harris was being particularly fucktard on this issue the other day.

from what i gather from reading most comments here you ain’t Robinson Crusoe

sibeen said:

Witty Rejoinder said:

sibeen said:

Fuck, I’m champing at the bit for Trump to get thrashed, but I can still call out stupidity on the side I support. Harris was being particularly fucktard on this issue the other day.

What she do?

Kamala Harris says she wouldn’t trust Trump on safety of Covid vaccine before election

https://www.theguardian.com/us-news/2020/sep/05/kamala-harris-covid-vaccine-safety-trump-election

Would you trust Trump not to interfere?

Witty Rejoinder said:

sibeen said:

Witty Rejoinder said:

What she do?

Kamala Harris says she wouldn’t trust Trump on safety of Covid vaccine before election

https://www.theguardian.com/us-news/2020/sep/05/kamala-harris-covid-vaccine-safety-trump-election

Would you trust Trump not to interfere?

>falls about laughing<

Oh come on… You couldn’t trust Trump to take a dog outside for a pee.

Witty Rejoinder said:

sibeen said:

Witty Rejoinder said:

What she do?

Kamala Harris says she wouldn’t trust Trump on safety of Covid vaccine before election

https://www.theguardian.com/us-news/2020/sep/05/kamala-harris-covid-vaccine-safety-trump-election

Would you trust Trump not to interfere?

I would trust the FDA. I’m sure Trump would try to apply pressure, no doubt, but I’d trust the leadership at the FDA to tell him and his minions to fuck right off.

sibeen said:

Witty Rejoinder said:

sibeen said:

Kamala Harris says she wouldn’t trust Trump on safety of Covid vaccine before election

https://www.theguardian.com/us-news/2020/sep/05/kamala-harris-covid-vaccine-safety-trump-election

Would you trust Trump not to interfere?

I would trust the FDA. I’m sure Trump would try to apply pressure, no doubt, but I’d trust the leadership at the FDA to tell him and his minions to fuck right off.

That’s what the DoJT said and now look what happened!

sibeen said:

Witty Rejoinder said:

sibeen said:

Kamala Harris says she wouldn’t trust Trump on safety of Covid vaccine before election

https://www.theguardian.com/us-news/2020/sep/05/kamala-harris-covid-vaccine-safety-trump-election

Would you trust Trump not to interfere?

I would trust the FDA. I’m sure Trump would try to apply pressure, no doubt, but I’d trust the leadership at the FDA to tell him and his minions to fuck right off.

And if Trump fired the FDA chief which he is perfectly allowed to do?

but permit us to object again, how is refusing to trust a known liar, a sic politising of SCIENCE ¿ explain

Witty Rejoinder said:

sibeen said:

Witty Rejoinder said:

Would you trust Trump not to interfere?

I would trust the FDA. I’m sure Trump would try to apply pressure, no doubt, but I’d trust the leadership at the FDA to tell him and his minions to fuck right off.

And if Trump fired the FDA chief which he is perfectly allowed to do?

That would change matters.

so we can safely conclude that there won’t be a vaccine available before election counting then

According to a whistleblower complaint filed by HHS infectious disease expert Rick Bright, in April 2020, Hahn instructed FEMA administrator Peter Gaynor “to distribute hydroxychloroquine to pharmacies nationwide,” even though the emergency use authorization (EUA) issued by the FDA did not provide for outpatient use of hydroxychloroquine for COVID-19. Hydroxychloroquine was later linked to multiple deaths of COVID-19 patients, and the FDA revoked the EUA in June 2020.

On July 5, 2020, Hahn refused to defend Trump’s false claim that 99% of coronavirus cases are “totally harmless”; in response to an interview question about the president’s claim, Hahn said, “I’m not going to get into who is right and who is wrong.”

On August 23, 2020, Hahn joined with Trump and Azar in announcing an emergency authorization for the use of coronavirus convalescent plasma in treating COVID-19. As with hydroxychloroquine, Trump publicly exerted major pressure on the FDA to approve convalescent plasma as a COVID-19 treatment, even suggesting that “deep state, or whoever over at the FDA” was blocking the authorization. The approval came a few days after Trump publicly complained that the agency was moving too slowly on plasma and suggested they might be delaying the approval for political reasons. In fact, the delay was due to concerns at the National Institutes of Health that the treatment’s effectiveness had not been adequately demonstrated. Hahn has said that Trump “has asked FDA to cut back red tape and try to speed medical products into the hands of providers, patients and American consumers.” In making the announcement Trump exaggerated plasma’s effectiveness compared to the FDA’s own assessment, and Hahn did not correct him. After coming under criticism from scientists and former FDA officials for echoing Trump’s exaggerated claims about the benefits of convalescent plasma, Hahn issued an apology/correction, saying, “The criticism is entirely justified. What I should have said better is that the data show a relative risk reduction, not an absolute risk reduction.”

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Stephen_Hahn_(oncologist)

…

What Sibeen needs is some hydroxychloroquine.

Witty Rejoinder said:

According to a whistleblower complaint filed by HHS infectious disease expert Rick Bright, in April 2020, Hahn instructed FEMA administrator Peter Gaynor “to distribute hydroxychloroquine to pharmacies nationwide,” even though the emergency use authorization (EUA) issued by the FDA did not provide for outpatient use of hydroxychloroquine for COVID-19. Hydroxychloroquine was later linked to multiple deaths of COVID-19 patients, and the FDA revoked the EUA in June 2020.

On July 5, 2020, Hahn refused to defend Trump’s false claim that 99% of coronavirus cases are “totally harmless”; in response to an interview question about the president’s claim, Hahn said, “I’m not going to get into who is right and who is wrong.”

On August 23, 2020, Hahn joined with Trump and Azar in announcing an emergency authorization for the use of coronavirus convalescent plasma in treating COVID-19. As with hydroxychloroquine, Trump publicly exerted major pressure on the FDA to approve convalescent plasma as a COVID-19 treatment, even suggesting that “deep state, or whoever over at the FDA” was blocking the authorization. The approval came a few days after Trump publicly complained that the agency was moving too slowly on plasma and suggested they might be delaying the approval for political reasons. In fact, the delay was due to concerns at the National Institutes of Health that the treatment’s effectiveness had not been adequately demonstrated. Hahn has said that Trump “has asked FDA to cut back red tape and try to speed medical products into the hands of providers, patients and American consumers.” In making the announcement Trump exaggerated plasma’s effectiveness compared to the FDA’s own assessment, and Hahn did not correct him. After coming under criticism from scientists and former FDA officials for echoing Trump’s exaggerated claims about the benefits of convalescent plasma, Hahn issued an apology/correction, saying, “The criticism is entirely justified. What I should have said better is that the data show a relative risk reduction, not an absolute risk reduction.”

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Stephen_Hahn_(oncologist)

…

What Sibeen needs is some hydroxychloroquine.

ah, Wikipedia, that reliable peer reviewed academic source, no way it could be edited by TEENAGE ANTIFA SOCIAL JUSTICE TROLLS

SCIENCE said:

Witty Rejoinder said:

According to a whistleblower complaint filed by HHS infectious disease expert Rick Bright, in April 2020, Hahn instructed FEMA administrator Peter Gaynor “to distribute hydroxychloroquine to pharmacies nationwide,” even though the emergency use authorization (EUA) issued by the FDA did not provide for outpatient use of hydroxychloroquine for COVID-19. Hydroxychloroquine was later linked to multiple deaths of COVID-19 patients, and the FDA revoked the EUA in June 2020.

On July 5, 2020, Hahn refused to defend Trump’s false claim that 99% of coronavirus cases are “totally harmless”; in response to an interview question about the president’s claim, Hahn said, “I’m not going to get into who is right and who is wrong.”

On August 23, 2020, Hahn joined with Trump and Azar in announcing an emergency authorization for the use of coronavirus convalescent plasma in treating COVID-19. As with hydroxychloroquine, Trump publicly exerted major pressure on the FDA to approve convalescent plasma as a COVID-19 treatment, even suggesting that “deep state, or whoever over at the FDA” was blocking the authorization. The approval came a few days after Trump publicly complained that the agency was moving too slowly on plasma and suggested they might be delaying the approval for political reasons. In fact, the delay was due to concerns at the National Institutes of Health that the treatment’s effectiveness had not been adequately demonstrated. Hahn has said that Trump “has asked FDA to cut back red tape and try to speed medical products into the hands of providers, patients and American consumers.” In making the announcement Trump exaggerated plasma’s effectiveness compared to the FDA’s own assessment, and Hahn did not correct him. After coming under criticism from scientists and former FDA officials for echoing Trump’s exaggerated claims about the benefits of convalescent plasma, Hahn issued an apology/correction, saying, “The criticism is entirely justified. What I should have said better is that the data show a relative risk reduction, not an absolute risk reduction.”

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Stephen_Hahn_(oncologist)

…

What Sibeen needs is some hydroxychloroquine.

ah, Wikipedia, that reliable peer reviewed academic source, no way it could be edited by TEENAGE ANTIFA SOCIAL JUSTICE TROLLS

His name is DV.

Witty Rejoinder said:

SCIENCE said:

Witty Rejoinder said:

According to a whistleblower complaint filed by HHS infectious disease expert Rick Bright, in April 2020, Hahn instructed FEMA administrator Peter Gaynor “to distribute hydroxychloroquine to pharmacies nationwide,” even though the emergency use authorization (EUA) issued by the FDA did not provide for outpatient use of hydroxychloroquine for COVID-19. Hydroxychloroquine was later linked to multiple deaths of COVID-19 patients, and the FDA revoked the EUA in June 2020.

On July 5, 2020, Hahn refused to defend Trump’s false claim that 99% of coronavirus cases are “totally harmless”; in response to an interview question about the president’s claim, Hahn said, “I’m not going to get into who is right and who is wrong.”

On August 23, 2020, Hahn joined with Trump and Azar in announcing an emergency authorization for the use of coronavirus convalescent plasma in treating COVID-19. As with hydroxychloroquine, Trump publicly exerted major pressure on the FDA to approve convalescent plasma as a COVID-19 treatment, even suggesting that “deep state, or whoever over at the FDA” was blocking the authorization. The approval came a few days after Trump publicly complained that the agency was moving too slowly on plasma and suggested they might be delaying the approval for political reasons. In fact, the delay was due to concerns at the National Institutes of Health that the treatment’s effectiveness had not been adequately demonstrated. Hahn has said that Trump “has asked FDA to cut back red tape and try to speed medical products into the hands of providers, patients and American consumers.” In making the announcement Trump exaggerated plasma’s effectiveness compared to the FDA’s own assessment, and Hahn did not correct him. After coming under criticism from scientists and former FDA officials for echoing Trump’s exaggerated claims about the benefits of convalescent plasma, Hahn issued an apology/correction, saying, “The criticism is entirely justified. What I should have said better is that the data show a relative risk reduction, not an absolute risk reduction.”

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Stephen_Hahn_(oncologist)

…

What Sibeen needs is some hydroxychloroquine.

ah, Wikipedia, that reliable peer reviewed academic source, no way it could be edited by TEENAGE ANTIFA SOCIAL JUSTICE TROLLS

His name is DV.

ROFL

Holy Shit

“We should assume the restrictions that I have announced will remain in place for six months”

PM Boris Johnson adds if we “fail to bring the R below 1, then we reserve the right to deploy greater fire power, with significantly greater restrictions”

Fuck That Economy Must Grow

party_pants said:

Bogsnorkler said:

party_pants said:

Would you trust a vaccine that Donald Trump rushed into production just in time for his re-election campaign?

That was my thoughts as well, re the Dems.

We’re getting too cynical.

I’m with you two. “..if it was available today..” tells you nothing about whether it has been properly researched along the way.

In other breaking news apparently SARS-CoV-2 is highly genetically stable, doesn’t change a lot, y’no’, all that. This of course proves that it was MANUFACTURED IN A CHINESE BIOWEAPONS LABORATORY IN WUHAN!!!!11!1111!!! because how could it possibly “evolve” to the infection perfection it achieves, it is irreducibly complex and so optimal that it must have been intelligently designed.

Well, it could also mean that adequate infection control measures are limiting spread “reasonably” well, and have so far averted major genetic shifts, or hence or otherwise applied huge selection pressure for virus to do exactly what it does to spread as well as it can, but you know, GOD CHINA was the maker and blindsided us on our watch.

Michael V said:

buffy said:

I’ve got a question about this hotel quarantine thing in Victoria. I don’t understand why it was apparently inherently wrong to use private companies. I think they used the biggest (supposedly the best) three companies in the state. In my view, it’s those companies, who then subcontracted, who have failed to supply what was in their contracts, not the government. So trying to find fault with public servants seems to me to be the wrong thing to do. Shouldn’t the enquiry be taking a very close interest in the people running the companies who failed in their jobs?

I’d reckon.

it’s cool, if it’s done by surveillance capitalism then it’s good for The Economy Must Grow and the LIFE of everyone

if it’s done by surveillance communism then it’s Worse Than Women and needs to be put back in the box

SCIENCE said:

Michael V said:

buffy said:

I’ve got a question about this hotel quarantine thing in Victoria. I don’t understand why it was apparently inherently wrong to use private companies. I think they used the biggest (supposedly the best) three companies in the state. In my view, it’s those companies, who then subcontracted, who have failed to supply what was in their contracts, not the government. So trying to find fault with public servants seems to me to be the wrong thing to do. Shouldn’t the enquiry be taking a very close interest in the people running the companies who failed in their jobs?

I’d reckon.

it’s cool, if it’s done by surveillance capitalism then it’s good for The Economy Must Grow and the LIFE of everyone

if it’s done by surveillance communism then it’s Worse Than Women and needs to be put back in the box

Bit of dichotomy between The Economy Must Grow and MMT. Which is correct?

Any of you heard about this before ¿ we hadn’t but interesting…

https://www.abc.net.au/news/2020-09-23/covid-19-may-cause-parkinsons-disease-research-finds/12688384

Five years after the Spanish flu pandemic in the early 1900s, there was up to a three-fold increase in the incidence of Parkinson’s disease.

SCIENCE said:

Any of you heard about this before ¿ we hadn’t but interesting…

https://www.abc.net.au/news/2020-09-23/covid-19-may-cause-parkinsons-disease-research-finds/12688384

Five years after the Spanish flu pandemic in the early 1900s, there was up to a three-fold increase in the incidence of Parkinson’s disease.

It has been all over the news of late.

SCIENCE said:

Any of you heard about this before ¿ we hadn’t but interesting…

https://www.abc.net.au/news/2020-09-23/covid-19-may-cause-parkinsons-disease-research-finds/12688384

Five years after the Spanish flu pandemic in the early 1900s, there was up to a three-fold increase in the incidence of Parkinson’s disease.

So you’re saying 6 years after WW1 there was up to a three-fold increase in the incidence of Parkinson’s disease

dv said:

SCIENCE said:

Any of you heard about this before ¿ we hadn’t but interesting…

https://www.abc.net.au/news/2020-09-23/covid-19-may-cause-parkinsons-disease-research-finds/12688384

Five years after the Spanish flu pandemic in the early 1900s, there was up to a three-fold increase in the incidence of Parkinson’s disease.

So you’re saying 6 years after WW1 there was up to a three-fold increase in the incidence of Parkinson’s disease

You could argue that it was caused by the post WWI babyboom.

dv said:

SCIENCE said:

Any of you heard about this before ¿ we hadn’t but interesting…

https://www.abc.net.au/news/2020-09-23/covid-19-may-cause-parkinsons-disease-research-finds/12688384

Five years after the Spanish flu pandemic in the early 1900s, there was up to a three-fold increase in the incidence of Parkinson’s disease.

So you’re saying 6 years after WW1 there was up to a three-fold increase in the incidence of Parkinson’s disease

they didn’t have agent orange back then did they and we don’t mean the fkwt in the white house

SCIENCE said:

dv said:

SCIENCE said:

Any of you heard about this before ¿ we hadn’t but interesting…

https://www.abc.net.au/news/2020-09-23/covid-19-may-cause-parkinsons-disease-research-finds/12688384

Five years after the Spanish flu pandemic in the early 1900s, there was up to a three-fold increase in the incidence of Parkinson’s disease.

So you’re saying 6 years after WW1 there was up to a three-fold increase in the incidence of Parkinson’s disease

they didn’t have agent orange back then did they and we don’t mean the fkwt in the white house

Agent orange was Vietnam.

Mustard Gas was WW1.

SCIENCE said:

Any of you heard about this before ¿ we hadn’t but interesting…

https://www.abc.net.au/news/2020-09-23/covid-19-may-cause-parkinsons-disease-research-finds/12688384

Five years after the Spanish flu pandemic in the early 1900s, there was up to a three-fold increase in the incidence of Parkinson’s disease.

Yes, I had. My great aunt Bebe survived Spanish flu and later got Parkinson’s disease.

There’s another possibility for how the inquiry into the hotel quarantine failures could go down: They could throw a single bureaucrat under the bus.

I say this because (a) the normal state government procurement process can be varied under a declared State of Disaster, but we weren’t under a State of Disaster at the time, and (b) although the three contractors appear to have been correctly chosen (from the approved ‘Panel’ of contractors) there’s a strict limit to how much money each position in the chain of responsibility is allowed to spend, which is not varied by the SoD, and strict forbidance of splitting large expenses to stay under a cap.

If the Minister didn’t know (which is what he’s saying) there’s every possibility somebody’s acted improperly under their financial delegation rules.

Get Ready For COVID-20 With This Food That ASIANS Eat

https://www.abc.net.au/news/2020-09-23/jellyfish-sustainable-fishing-nutritional-delicacy-queensland/12692542

https://www.theage.com.au/world/europe/sweden-considers-restrictions-as-covid-19-cases-rise-20200923-p55yfr.html

Very pleading. Well done Victoria!

Witty Rejoinder said:

https://www.theage.com.au/world/europe/sweden-considers-restrictions-as-covid-19-cases-rise-20200923-p55yfr.html

Well, more specifically Stockholm from that piece. And on Worldometers they still just seem to be bouncing along much the same as they’ve been for some months. Both for daily new cases and for deaths.

https://www.worldometers.info/coronavirus/country/sweden/

buffy said:

Witty Rejoinder said:

https://www.theage.com.au/world/europe/sweden-considers-restrictions-as-covid-19-cases-rise-20200923-p55yfr.html

Well, more specifically Stockholm from that piece. And on Worldometers they still just seem to be bouncing along much the same as they’ve been for some months. Both for daily new cases and for deaths.

https://www.worldometers.info/coronavirus/country/sweden/

ah so the actions doesn’t match the numbers, could there be wilful blindness or cover up no way nah impossible

The Age said:

Victorian Premier Daniel Andrews has signalled his government is willing to negotiate with crossbench MPs to get a controversial new law through parliament that would give state officials the power to detain people considered a high risk of spreading COVID-19.

Under the proposed law, health authorities could forcibly detain people they suspect would be likely to spread the virus. The rules could be applied to conspiracy theorists who refuse to self-isolate or severely drug-affected or mentally impaired people who do not have the capacity to quarantine.

https://www.theage.com.au/national/victoria/andrews-open-to-doing-a-deal-on-arbitrary-detention-laws-20200923-p55yd7.html

Is it naive of Andrews to think that powers of arbitrary detention wont be abused?

Caters Report Increased Stress From Having To Look After Family Who Failed To Catch COVID-19 And Die

https://www.abc.net.au/news/2020-09-24/number-of-people-dying-at-home-surges-in-lockdown/12681140

Flock Immunity Strategy Was Right All Along, Economy Will (Must) Grow Under Smaller Aged Care Burden And There Will Be Less Carer Stress

SCIENCE said:

Caters Report Increased Stress From Having To Look After Family Who Failed To Catch COVID-19 And Die

https://www.abc.net.au/news/2020-09-24/number-of-people-dying-at-home-surges-in-lockdown/12681140

Flock Immunity Strategy Was Right All Along, Economy Will (Must) Grow Under Smaller Aged Care Burden And There Will Be Less Carer Stress

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QcbR1J_4ICg

I’ve slept on the situation in Argentina, which has had 400 deaths per day through this week.

Poll: 51% of Republicans trust Trump on coronavirus more than the CDC

Americans’ political affiliations could determine which source they trust for information about the coronavirus, with 51% of Republicans saying they trust President Trump over CDC scientists, according to a Quinnipiac poll out Tuesday.

Why it matters: It’s another indication of how partisan politics have consumed the national conversation about the virus, and how Trump’s attacks on his own health officials have affected public opinion.

An Axios-Ipsos coronavirus poll out in June showed a political divide on mask-wearing habits based on party affiliation.Trump and top government scientists have at times given conflicting messages about the virus, with Trump claiming earlier this month that his CDC director was “incorrect” and “confused” about the timeline for widespread vaccine distribution.

By the numbers: 70% of all likely voters who responded to the poll said they trust CDC scientists more than Trump, while 21% chose the president.

51% of Republican respondents preferred Trump, while 36% chose CDC scientists.97% of Democratic respondents chose the CDC, while 1% said they prefer Trump.

The big picture: 42% of all voters approved of Trump’s response to the coronavirus, while 56% said they disapprove. 87% of Republicans approved, while 96% of Democrats disapproved.

https://www.google.com/amp/s/www.axios.com/coronavirus-trump-cdc-poll-fd7df7c3-5808-4f1a-996a-f9ef37accb48.html

The Republicans are the official party of stupidity

dv said:

Poll: 51% of Republicans trust Trump on coronavirus more than the CDC

Americans’ political affiliations could determine which source they trust for information about the coronavirus, with 51% of Republicans saying they trust President Trump over CDC scientists, according to a Quinnipiac poll out Tuesday.

Why it matters: It’s another indication of how partisan politics have consumed the national conversation about the virus, and how Trump’s attacks on his own health officials have affected public opinion.

An Axios-Ipsos coronavirus poll out in June showed a political divide on mask-wearing habits based on party affiliation.Trump and top government scientists have at times given conflicting messages about the virus, with Trump claiming earlier this month that his CDC director was “incorrect” and “confused” about the timeline for widespread vaccine distribution.

By the numbers: 70% of all likely voters who responded to the poll said they trust CDC scientists more than Trump, while 21% chose the president.

51% of Republican respondents preferred Trump, while 36% chose CDC scientists.97% of Democratic respondents chose the CDC, while 1% said they prefer Trump.

The big picture: 42% of all voters approved of Trump’s response to the coronavirus, while 56% said they disapprove. 87% of Republicans approved, while 96% of Democrats disapproved.

https://www.google.com/amp/s/www.axios.com/coronavirus-trump-cdc-poll-fd7df7c3-5808-4f1a-996a-f9ef37accb48.html

The Republicans are the official party of stupidity

1% of dem voters trust Trump more ….ROFL, who are these people?

sibeen said:

dv said:

Poll: 51% of Republicans trust Trump on coronavirus more than the CDC

Americans’ political affiliations could determine which source they trust for information about the coronavirus, with 51% of Republicans saying they trust President Trump over CDC scientists, according to a Quinnipiac poll out Tuesday.

Why it matters: It’s another indication of how partisan politics have consumed the national conversation about the virus, and how Trump’s attacks on his own health officials have affected public opinion.

An Axios-Ipsos coronavirus poll out in June showed a political divide on mask-wearing habits based on party affiliation.Trump and top government scientists have at times given conflicting messages about the virus, with Trump claiming earlier this month that his CDC director was “incorrect” and “confused” about the timeline for widespread vaccine distribution.

By the numbers: 70% of all likely voters who responded to the poll said they trust CDC scientists more than Trump, while 21% chose the president.

51% of Republican respondents preferred Trump, while 36% chose CDC scientists.97% of Democratic respondents chose the CDC, while 1% said they prefer Trump.

The big picture: 42% of all voters approved of Trump’s response to the coronavirus, while 56% said they disapprove. 87% of Republicans approved, while 96% of Democrats disapproved.

https://www.google.com/amp/s/www.axios.com/coronavirus-trump-cdc-poll-fd7df7c3-5808-4f1a-996a-f9ef37accb48.html

The Republicans are the official party of stupidity

1% of dem voters trust Trump more ….ROFL, who are these people?

Devout Christian US patriots.

sibeen said:

dv said:

Poll: 51% of Republicans trust Trump on coronavirus more than the CDC

Americans’ political affiliations could determine which source they trust for information about the coronavirus, with 51% of Republicans saying they trust President Trump over CDC scientists, according to a Quinnipiac poll out Tuesday.

Why it matters: It’s another indication of how partisan politics have consumed the national conversation about the virus, and how Trump’s attacks on his own health officials have affected public opinion.

An Axios-Ipsos coronavirus poll out in June showed a political divide on mask-wearing habits based on party affiliation.Trump and top government scientists have at times given conflicting messages about the virus, with Trump claiming earlier this month that his CDC director was “incorrect” and “confused” about the timeline for widespread vaccine distribution.

By the numbers: 70% of all likely voters who responded to the poll said they trust CDC scientists more than Trump, while 21% chose the president.

51% of Republican respondents preferred Trump, while 36% chose CDC scientists.97% of Democratic respondents chose the CDC, while 1% said they prefer Trump.

The big picture: 42% of all voters approved of Trump’s response to the coronavirus, while 56% said they disapprove. 87% of Republicans approved, while 96% of Democrats disapproved.

https://www.google.com/amp/s/www.axios.com/coronavirus-trump-cdc-poll-fd7df7c3-5808-4f1a-996a-f9ef37accb48.html

The Republicans are the official party of stupidity

1% of dem voters trust Trump more ….ROFL, who are these people?

the silent majority of democrats who are all idiots as well

Craig Kelly hits bottom and keeps digging, then brings in earth moving equipment and explosives.

https://7news.com.au/lifestyle/health-wellbeing/tragic-mistake-mp-slams-insane-rule-that-hampered-search-for-teen-later-found-dead-c-1340285

10,000 more deaths than usual occurred in UK homes since June

Excess deaths in private homes prompts fears people are avoiding hospitals due to Covid

https://www.theguardian.com/world/2020/sep/24/10000-more-deaths-than-usual-occurred-in-uk-homes-since-june

graph is a bit interesting.

Rule 303 said:

Craig Kelly hits bottom and keeps digging, then brings in earth moving equipment and explosives.

https://7news.com.au/lifestyle/health-wellbeing/tragic-mistake-mp-slams-insane-rule-that-hampered-search-for-teen-later-found-dead-c-1340285

I’m almost certain I read that the boy’s father said that most of the time he presented as normal. Cannot compare, I wouldn’t have thought.

sarahs mum said:

10,000 more deaths than usual occurred in UK homes since June

Excess deaths in private homes prompts fears people are avoiding hospitals due to Covid

https://www.theguardian.com/world/2020/sep/24/10000-more-deaths-than-usual-occurred-in-uk-homes-since-june

graph is a bit interesting.

well obviously the solution is to open up The Economy Must Grow and let it rip, at least that way they’ll die of confirmed COVID-19 and they’ll die away from home

buffy said:

Rule 303 said:

Craig Kelly hits bottom and keeps digging, then brings in earth moving equipment and explosives.

https://7news.com.au/lifestyle/health-wellbeing/tragic-mistake-mp-slams-insane-rule-that-hampered-search-for-teen-later-found-dead-c-1340285

I’m almost certain I read that the boy’s father said that most of the time he presented as normal. Cannot compare, I wouldn’t have thought.

Putting aside for a moment that he’s openly criticising the way the search was conducted, I’m disgusted that Kelly would attempt to use the suicide of a 14yo child to advance his moronic reptilian bullshit.

Rule 303 said:

buffy said:

Rule 303 said:

Craig Kelly hits bottom and keeps digging, then brings in earth moving equipment and explosives.

https://7news.com.au/lifestyle/health-wellbeing/tragic-mistake-mp-slams-insane-rule-that-hampered-search-for-teen-later-found-dead-c-1340285

I’m almost certain I read that the boy’s father said that most of the time he presented as normal. Cannot compare, I wouldn’t have thought.

Putting aside for a moment that he’s openly criticising the way the search was conducted, I’m disgusted that Kelly would attempt to use the suicide of a 14yo child to advance his moronic reptilian bullshit.

So it was a suicide? There was not mental health advice at the end of the articles I have read. Maybe because he was underage.

Witty Rejoinder said:

Rule 303 said:

buffy said:

I’m almost certain I read that the boy’s father said that most of the time he presented as normal. Cannot compare, I wouldn’t have thought.

Putting aside for a moment that he’s openly criticising the way the search was conducted, I’m disgusted that Kelly would attempt to use the suicide of a 14yo child to advance his moronic reptilian bullshit.

So it was a suicide? There was not mental health advice at the end of the articles I have read. Maybe because he was underage.

It’s extremely rare that the media (even the Murdoch media, who carried the above-linked load of bullshit) will report suicide as such – Partially because the Coroner has not made a finding yet. I understand it was clear to the members at the scene.

Rule 303 said:

Witty Rejoinder said:

Rule 303 said:

Putting aside for a moment that he’s openly criticising the way the search was conducted, I’m disgusted that Kelly would attempt to use the suicide of a 14yo child to advance his moronic reptilian bullshit.

So it was a suicide? There was not mental health advice at the end of the articles I have read. Maybe because he was underage.

It’s extremely rare that the media (even the Murdoch media, who carried the above-linked load of bullshit) will report suicide as such – Partially because the Coroner has not made a finding yet. I understand it was clear to the members at the scene.

How awful.

Witty Rejoinder said:

Rule 303 said:

buffy said:

I’m almost certain I read that the boy’s father said that most of the time he presented as normal. Cannot compare, I wouldn’t have thought.

Putting aside for a moment that he’s openly criticising the way the search was conducted, I’m disgusted that Kelly would attempt to use the suicide of a 14yo child to advance his moronic reptilian bullshit.

So it was a suicide? There was not mental health advice at the end of the articles I have read. Maybe because he was underage.

Fit 14 year olds wouldn’t normally succumb to hypothermia quite that quickly. And he was apparently used to walking.

buffy said:

Witty Rejoinder said:

Rule 303 said:

Putting aside for a moment that he’s openly criticising the way the search was conducted, I’m disgusted that Kelly would attempt to use the suicide of a 14yo child to advance his moronic reptilian bullshit.

So it was a suicide? There was not mental health advice at the end of the articles I have read. Maybe because he was underage.

Fit 14 year olds wouldn’t normally succumb to hypothermia quite that quickly. And he was apparently used to walking.

Yep. The weather conditions would not have reduced his survival time. He would be cold and miserable, but not hypothermic unless there was some compounding factor. I have walked the trail he was on three times, it’s not difficult or confusing or remote, and he was familiar with it.

Witty Rejoinder said:

Rule 303 said:

Witty Rejoinder said:

So it was a suicide? There was not mental health advice at the end of the articles I have read. Maybe because he was underage.

It’s extremely rare that the media (even the Murdoch media, who carried the above-linked load of bullshit) will report suicide as such – Partially because the Coroner has not made a finding yet. I understand it was clear to the members at the scene.

How awful.

Not to down-play the terrible impact it will have on his family: He was found by people who were ready for this outcome, fairly quickly, still in good condition. He would have been treated carefully, with respect, and in a way that preserved his remains and any evidence at the scene.

Yes, it’s awful for his family, but (I am not going to describe the ways) it could have been much worse.

9m ago 13:47
Coronavirus cases now rising in 22 states, nationally running 16% higher than a week ago

Some strong words on the US Covid response from Sam Baker and Andrew Witherspoon at Axios this morning as they report that coronavirus cases are rising in 22 states.

There isn’t one big event or sudden occurrence that explains this increase. We simply have never done a very good job containing the virus, despite losing 200,000 lives in just the past six months, and this is what that persistent failure looks like.

They report that US is now averaging roughly 43,000 new cases per day, a 16% increase from a week ago, and that seven states – Arizona, Colorado, Minnesota, Montana, Texas, Utah and Wyoming — saw their daily infections rise by at least 60% over the past week.

Morning pilgrims, nice day coming up in the Pearl of the South Specific.

Peak Warming Man said:

Morning pilgrims, nice day coming up in the Pearl of the South Specific.

bugger

How convenient, delay the reporting until the borders open. YOU LOSE ¡¡¡

—

Health authorities in NSW have confirmed four new cases of COVID-19 in the last 24 hours.

Three are returned travellers in hotel quarantine and the other infection, a man in his 50s from Sydney’s south-west, has not yet been linked to any known cases or clusters.

His positive swab was flagged by NSW Health yesterday, but was officially included in the state’s COVID-19 statistics today.

The new infection breaks NSW’s three-day streak of zero locally acquired cases.

Simple blood test predicts patients most likely to die from COVID-19

One of the big challenges healthcare workers are facing in this global pandemic is identifying those COVID-19 patients most at risk of severe illness and death. COVID-19 certainly is more dangerous, on average, in the elderly or those with pre-existing health problems, but that doesn’t preclude a 96-year-old from presenting with no symptoms, or a healthy 21-year-old losing her life. A team of researchers from Massachusetts General Hospital have been trawling through hospital admission data to find some way to help doctors better assess those patients most at risk of suffering the worst effects of the disease.

“We were surprised to find that one standard test that quantifies the variation in size of red blood cells – called red cell distribution width, or RDW – was highly correlated with patient mortality, and the correlation persisted when controlling for other identified risk factors like patient age, some other lab tests, and some pre-existing illnesses,” says co-author on the new study, Jonathan Carlson.

RDW is a very common metric gathered in most standard blood count tests. The new study found patients displaying an elevated RDW at time of admission were 2.7 times more likely to die from COVID-19. Elevated RDW was also more significantly associated with mortality in younger COVID-19 patients.

The study also notes that patients whose RDW was seen to increase during hospitalization were more likely to suffer worse outcomes from the disease. The researchers suggest this indicates RDW may be a useful biomarker to track the progress of a patient while admitted in hospital.

https://newatlas.com/health-wellbeing/coronavirus-blood-test-predicts-mortality-disease-severity-rdw/

PermeateFree said:

Simple blood test predicts patients most likely to die from COVID-19

One of the big challenges healthcare workers are facing in this global pandemic is identifying those COVID-19 patients most at risk of severe illness and death. COVID-19 certainly is more dangerous, on average, in the elderly or those with pre-existing health problems, but that doesn’t preclude a 96-year-old from presenting with no symptoms, or a healthy 21-year-old losing her life. A team of researchers from Massachusetts General Hospital have been trawling through hospital admission data to find some way to help doctors better assess those patients most at risk of suffering the worst effects of the disease.

“We were surprised to find that one standard test that quantifies the variation in size of red blood cells – called red cell distribution width, or RDW – was highly correlated with patient mortality, and the correlation persisted when controlling for other identified risk factors like patient age, some other lab tests, and some pre-existing illnesses,” says co-author on the new study, Jonathan Carlson.

RDW is a very common metric gathered in most standard blood count tests. The new study found patients displaying an elevated RDW at time of admission were 2.7 times more likely to die from COVID-19. Elevated RDW was also more significantly associated with mortality in younger COVID-19 patients.

The study also notes that patients whose RDW was seen to increase during hospitalization were more likely to suffer worse outcomes from the disease. The researchers suggest this indicates RDW may be a useful biomarker to track the progress of a patient while admitted in hospital.

https://newatlas.com/health-wellbeing/coronavirus-blood-test-predicts-mortality-disease-severity-rdw/

quick test everyone and let it rip

SCIENCE said:

PermeateFree said:

Simple blood test predicts patients most likely to die from COVID-19

One of the big challenges healthcare workers are facing in this global pandemic is identifying those COVID-19 patients most at risk of severe illness and death. COVID-19 certainly is more dangerous, on average, in the elderly or those with pre-existing health problems, but that doesn’t preclude a 96-year-old from presenting with no symptoms, or a healthy 21-year-old losing her life. A team of researchers from Massachusetts General Hospital have been trawling through hospital admission data to find some way to help doctors better assess those patients most at risk of suffering the worst effects of the disease.

“We were surprised to find that one standard test that quantifies the variation in size of red blood cells – called red cell distribution width, or RDW – was highly correlated with patient mortality, and the correlation persisted when controlling for other identified risk factors like patient age, some other lab tests, and some pre-existing illnesses,” says co-author on the new study, Jonathan Carlson.

RDW is a very common metric gathered in most standard blood count tests. The new study found patients displaying an elevated RDW at time of admission were 2.7 times more likely to die from COVID-19. Elevated RDW was also more significantly associated with mortality in younger COVID-19 patients.

The study also notes that patients whose RDW was seen to increase during hospitalization were more likely to suffer worse outcomes from the disease. The researchers suggest this indicates RDW may be a useful biomarker to track the progress of a patient while admitted in hospital.

https://newatlas.com/health-wellbeing/coronavirus-blood-test-predicts-mortality-disease-severity-rdw/

quick test everyone and let it rip

Hope my haematologist is on to this. Me having a blood cancer and all.

PermeateFree said:

Simple blood test predicts patients most likely to die from COVID-19

One of the big challenges healthcare workers are facing in this global pandemic is identifying those COVID-19 patients most at risk of severe illness and death. COVID-19 certainly is more dangerous, on average, in the elderly or those with pre-existing health problems, but that doesn’t preclude a 96-year-old from presenting with no symptoms, or a healthy 21-year-old losing her life. A team of researchers from Massachusetts General Hospital have been trawling through hospital admission data to find some way to help doctors better assess those patients most at risk of suffering the worst effects of the disease.

“We were surprised to find that one standard test that quantifies the variation in size of red blood cells – called red cell distribution width, or RDW – was highly correlated with patient mortality, and the correlation persisted when controlling for other identified risk factors like patient age, some other lab tests, and some pre-existing illnesses,” says co-author on the new study, Jonathan Carlson.

RDW is a very common metric gathered in most standard blood count tests. The new study found patients displaying an elevated RDW at time of admission were 2.7 times more likely to die from COVID-19. Elevated RDW was also more significantly associated with mortality in younger COVID-19 patients.

The study also notes that patients whose RDW was seen to increase during hospitalization were more likely to suffer worse outcomes from the disease. The researchers suggest this indicates RDW may be a useful biomarker to track the progress of a patient while admitted in hospital.

https://newatlas.com/health-wellbeing/coronavirus-blood-test-predicts-mortality-disease-severity-rdw/

Thanks.

PermeateFree said:

Simple blood test predicts patients most likely to die from COVID-19

One of the big challenges healthcare workers are facing in this global pandemic is identifying those COVID-19 patients most at risk of severe illness and death. COVID-19 certainly is more dangerous, on average, in the elderly or those with pre-existing health problems, but that doesn’t preclude a 96-year-old from presenting with no symptoms, or a healthy 21-year-old losing her life. A team of researchers from Massachusetts General Hospital have been trawling through hospital admission data to find some way to help doctors better assess those patients most at risk of suffering the worst effects of the disease.

“We were surprised to find that one standard test that quantifies the variation in size of red blood cells – called red cell distribution width, or RDW – was highly correlated with patient mortality, and the correlation persisted when controlling for other identified risk factors like patient age, some other lab tests, and some pre-existing illnesses,” says co-author on the new study, Jonathan Carlson.

RDW is a very common metric gathered in most standard blood count tests. The new study found patients displaying an elevated RDW at time of admission were 2.7 times more likely to die from COVID-19. Elevated RDW was also more significantly associated with mortality in younger COVID-19 patients.

The study also notes that patients whose RDW was seen to increase during hospitalization were more likely to suffer worse outcomes from the disease. The researchers suggest this indicates RDW may be a useful biomarker to track the progress of a patient while admitted in hospital.

https://newatlas.com/health-wellbeing/coronavirus-blood-test-predicts-mortality-disease-severity-rdw/

Probably this paper, I think.

https://jamanetwork.com/journals/jamanetworkopen/fullarticle/2770945

It seems this particular parameter is rather broadly associated with poor outcomes.

>>Elevated RDW is associated with an increased risk for all-cause mortality; mortality from heart disease, pulmonary disease, sepsis, influenza, and cancer; complications associated with heart failure, severity of coronary artery disease and viral hepatitis, advanced stage and grade for many cancers; and the development of diabetes, chronic obstructive pulmonary disease, stroke, anemia, and many other conditions.8-18 RDW appears to be a nonspecific marker of illness that has the potential to provide general quantitative risk stratification that may be particularly useful for a new and unknown disease.<<

So you would need to eliminate all other possible associations before you could say it is definitely associated with COVID19.

Michael V said:

PermeateFree said:

Simple blood test predicts patients most likely to die from COVID-19

One of the big challenges healthcare workers are facing in this global pandemic is identifying those COVID-19 patients most at risk of severe illness and death. COVID-19 certainly is more dangerous, on average, in the elderly or those with pre-existing health problems, but that doesn’t preclude a 96-year-old from presenting with no symptoms, or a healthy 21-year-old losing her life. A team of researchers from Massachusetts General Hospital have been trawling through hospital admission data to find some way to help doctors better assess those patients most at risk of suffering the worst effects of the disease.

“We were surprised to find that one standard test that quantifies the variation in size of red blood cells – called red cell distribution width, or RDW – was highly correlated with patient mortality, and the correlation persisted when controlling for other identified risk factors like patient age, some other lab tests, and some pre-existing illnesses,” says co-author on the new study, Jonathan Carlson.

RDW is a very common metric gathered in most standard blood count tests. The new study found patients displaying an elevated RDW at time of admission were 2.7 times more likely to die from COVID-19. Elevated RDW was also more significantly associated with mortality in younger COVID-19 patients.

The study also notes that patients whose RDW was seen to increase during hospitalization were more likely to suffer worse outcomes from the disease. The researchers suggest this indicates RDW may be a useful biomarker to track the progress of a patient while admitted in hospital.

https://newatlas.com/health-wellbeing/coronavirus-blood-test-predicts-mortality-disease-severity-rdw/

Thanks.

+1

buffy said:

PermeateFree said:

Simple blood test predicts patients most likely to die from COVID-19

One of the big challenges healthcare workers are facing in this global pandemic is identifying those COVID-19 patients most at risk of severe illness and death. COVID-19 certainly is more dangerous, on average, in the elderly or those with pre-existing health problems, but that doesn’t preclude a 96-year-old from presenting with no symptoms, or a healthy 21-year-old losing her life. A team of researchers from Massachusetts General Hospital have been trawling through hospital admission data to find some way to help doctors better assess those patients most at risk of suffering the worst effects of the disease.

“We were surprised to find that one standard test that quantifies the variation in size of red blood cells – called red cell distribution width, or RDW – was highly correlated with patient mortality, and the correlation persisted when controlling for other identified risk factors like patient age, some other lab tests, and some pre-existing illnesses,” says co-author on the new study, Jonathan Carlson.

RDW is a very common metric gathered in most standard blood count tests. The new study found patients displaying an elevated RDW at time of admission were 2.7 times more likely to die from COVID-19. Elevated RDW was also more significantly associated with mortality in younger COVID-19 patients.

The study also notes that patients whose RDW was seen to increase during hospitalization were more likely to suffer worse outcomes from the disease. The researchers suggest this indicates RDW may be a useful biomarker to track the progress of a patient while admitted in hospital.

https://newatlas.com/health-wellbeing/coronavirus-blood-test-predicts-mortality-disease-severity-rdw/

Probably this paper, I think.

https://jamanetwork.com/journals/jamanetworkopen/fullarticle/2770945

It seems this particular parameter is rather broadly associated with poor outcomes.

>>Elevated RDW is associated with an increased risk for all-cause mortality; mortality from heart disease, pulmonary disease, sepsis, influenza, and cancer; complications associated with heart failure, severity of coronary artery disease and viral hepatitis, advanced stage and grade for many cancers; and the development of diabetes, chronic obstructive pulmonary disease, stroke, anemia, and many other conditions.8-18 RDW appears to be a nonspecific marker of illness that has the potential to provide general quantitative risk stratification that may be particularly useful for a new and unknown disease.<<

So you would need to eliminate all other possible associations before you could say it is definitely associated with COVID19.

I’ve read a bit more of the paper. There is mention of co-morbidities. But they also say:

>>Patients with many different underlying acute and chronic illnesses would be expected to have a higher baseline RDW, and it is possible that the RDW measured at admission is a nonspecific summary marker of the presence of these illnesses that have been shown to be associated with elevated RDW and may be expected to complicate the COVID-19 clinical course. Regardless of the reasons for the differences in RDW at admission, the association of elevated RDW with increased mortality risk appears to persist after admission, as demonstrated by the higher mortality rate for patients in the present cohort whose RDW increased during hospitalization.<<

So it’s a correlation, but perhaps not a very surprising one.

buffy said:

buffy said:

PermeateFree said:

Simple blood test predicts patients most likely to die from COVID-19

One of the big challenges healthcare workers are facing in this global pandemic is identifying those COVID-19 patients most at risk of severe illness and death. COVID-19 certainly is more dangerous, on average, in the elderly or those with pre-existing health problems, but that doesn’t preclude a 96-year-old from presenting with no symptoms, or a healthy 21-year-old losing her life. A team of researchers from Massachusetts General Hospital have been trawling through hospital admission data to find some way to help doctors better assess those patients most at risk of suffering the worst effects of the disease.

“We were surprised to find that one standard test that quantifies the variation in size of red blood cells – called red cell distribution width, or RDW – was highly correlated with patient mortality, and the correlation persisted when controlling for other identified risk factors like patient age, some other lab tests, and some pre-existing illnesses,” says co-author on the new study, Jonathan Carlson.

RDW is a very common metric gathered in most standard blood count tests. The new study found patients displaying an elevated RDW at time of admission were 2.7 times more likely to die from COVID-19. Elevated RDW was also more significantly associated with mortality in younger COVID-19 patients.

The study also notes that patients whose RDW was seen to increase during hospitalization were more likely to suffer worse outcomes from the disease. The researchers suggest this indicates RDW may be a useful biomarker to track the progress of a patient while admitted in hospital.

https://newatlas.com/health-wellbeing/coronavirus-blood-test-predicts-mortality-disease-severity-rdw/

Probably this paper, I think.

https://jamanetwork.com/journals/jamanetworkopen/fullarticle/2770945

It seems this particular parameter is rather broadly associated with poor outcomes.

>>Elevated RDW is associated with an increased risk for all-cause mortality; mortality from heart disease, pulmonary disease, sepsis, influenza, and cancer; complications associated with heart failure, severity of coronary artery disease and viral hepatitis, advanced stage and grade for many cancers; and the development of diabetes, chronic obstructive pulmonary disease, stroke, anemia, and many other conditions.8-18 RDW appears to be a nonspecific marker of illness that has the potential to provide general quantitative risk stratification that may be particularly useful for a new and unknown disease.<<

So you would need to eliminate all other possible associations before you could say it is definitely associated with COVID19.

I’ve read a bit more of the paper. There is mention of co-morbidities. But they also say:

>>Patients with many different underlying acute and chronic illnesses would be expected to have a higher baseline RDW, and it is possible that the RDW measured at admission is a nonspecific summary marker of the presence of these illnesses that have been shown to be associated with elevated RDW and may be expected to complicate the COVID-19 clinical course. Regardless of the reasons for the differences in RDW at admission, the association of elevated RDW with increased mortality risk appears to persist after admission, as demonstrated by the higher mortality rate for patients in the present cohort whose RDW increased during hospitalization.<<

So it’s a correlation, but perhaps not a very surprising one.

well done.

PermeateFree said:

Simple blood test predicts patients most likely to die from COVID-19

One of the big challenges healthcare workers are facing in this global pandemic is identifying those COVID-19 patients most at risk of severe illness and death. COVID-19 certainly is more dangerous, on average, in the elderly or those with pre-existing health problems, but that doesn’t preclude a 96-year-old from presenting with no symptoms, or a healthy 21-year-old losing her life. A team of researchers from Massachusetts General Hospital have been trawling through hospital admission data to find some way to help doctors better assess those patients most at risk of suffering the worst effects of the disease.

“We were surprised to find that one standard test that quantifies the variation in size of red blood cells – called red cell distribution width, or RDW – was highly correlated with patient mortality, and the correlation persisted when controlling for other identified risk factors like patient age, some other lab tests, and some pre-existing illnesses,” says co-author on the new study, Jonathan Carlson.

RDW is a very common metric gathered in most standard blood count tests. The new study found patients displaying an elevated RDW at time of admission were 2.7 times more likely to die from COVID-19. Elevated RDW was also more significantly associated with mortality in younger COVID-19 patients.

The study also notes that patients whose RDW was seen to increase during hospitalization were more likely to suffer worse outcomes from the disease. The researchers suggest this indicates RDW may be a useful biomarker to track the progress of a patient while admitted in hospital.

https://newatlas.com/health-wellbeing/coronavirus-blood-test-predicts-mortality-disease-severity-rdw/

From the same article:

The study also notes that patients whose RDW was seen to increase during hospitalization were more likely to suffer worse outcomes from the disease. The researchers suggest this indicates RDW may be a useful biomarker to track the progress of a patient while admitted in hospital.

RDW has been previously determined to be an effective non-specific biomarker of illness, and the researchers do note it is unlikely there is a direct causal relationship at play. But, what is important here is the routine nature of RDW measurements gathered in common blood testing.

A number of similar studies have been published over the past few months exploring blood-based biomarkers to identify patients most as risk of death or severe illness from COVID-19. Many researchers have homed in on particular blood biomarker patterns that can be associated with the worst outcomes, however, not many of those blood measurements are as simple and routine to collect as RDW measurements.

The finding needs further validation in broader cohorts of patients, but if confirmed, this simple laboratory test may be a useful way to detect those COVID-19 patients most in need of clinical care.

The new research was published in the journal JAMA Network Open.

roughbarked said:

buffy said:

buffy said:

Probably this paper, I think.

https://jamanetwork.com/journals/jamanetworkopen/fullarticle/2770945

It seems this particular parameter is rather broadly associated with poor outcomes.

>>Elevated RDW is associated with an increased risk for all-cause mortality; mortality from heart disease, pulmonary disease, sepsis, influenza, and cancer; complications associated with heart failure, severity of coronary artery disease and viral hepatitis, advanced stage and grade for many cancers; and the development of diabetes, chronic obstructive pulmonary disease, stroke, anemia, and many other conditions.8-18 RDW appears to be a nonspecific marker of illness that has the potential to provide general quantitative risk stratification that may be particularly useful for a new and unknown disease.<<

So you would need to eliminate all other possible associations before you could say it is definitely associated with COVID19.

I’ve read a bit more of the paper. There is mention of co-morbidities. But they also say:

>>Patients with many different underlying acute and chronic illnesses would be expected to have a higher baseline RDW, and it is possible that the RDW measured at admission is a nonspecific summary marker of the presence of these illnesses that have been shown to be associated with elevated RDW and may be expected to complicate the COVID-19 clinical course. Regardless of the reasons for the differences in RDW at admission, the association of elevated RDW with increased mortality risk appears to persist after admission, as demonstrated by the higher mortality rate for patients in the present cohort whose RDW increased during hospitalization.<<

So it’s a correlation, but perhaps not a very surprising one.

well done.

so they were going to die anyway, might as well save them the trouble and killemall now

SCIENCE said:

roughbarked said:

buffy said:

I’ve read a bit more of the paper. There is mention of co-morbidities. But they also say:

>>Patients with many different underlying acute and chronic illnesses would be expected to have a higher baseline RDW, and it is possible that the RDW measured at admission is a nonspecific summary marker of the presence of these illnesses that have been shown to be associated with elevated RDW and may be expected to complicate the COVID-19 clinical course. Regardless of the reasons for the differences in RDW at admission, the association of elevated RDW with increased mortality risk appears to persist after admission, as demonstrated by the higher mortality rate for patients in the present cohort whose RDW increased during hospitalization.<<

So it’s a correlation, but perhaps not a very surprising one.

well done.

so they were going to die anyway, might as well save them the trouble and killemall now

Before making silly statements like this, it might be wise to read the complete article, Buffy too.

we promise to sometimes read complete articles

PermeateFree said:

SCIENCE said:

roughbarked said:

well done.

so they were going to die anyway, might as well save them the trouble and killemall now

Before making silly statements like this, it might be wise to read the complete article, Buffy too.

Yes, I read the paper. I put the link to the paper in my post.

buffy said:

PermeateFree said:

SCIENCE said:

so they were going to die anyway, might as well save them the trouble and killemall now

Before making silly statements like this, it might be wise to read the complete article, Buffy too.

Yes, I read the paper. I put the link to the paper in my post.

Then you would read the following?

>>Conclusions and Relevance
Elevated RDW at the time of hospital admission and an increase in RDW during hospitalization were associated with increased mortality risk for patients with COVID-19 who received treatment at 4 hospitals in a large academic medical center network.<<

PermeateFree said:

buffy said:

PermeateFree said:

Before making silly statements like this, it might be wise to read the complete article, Buffy too.

Yes, I read the paper. I put the link to the paper in my post.

Then you would read the following?

>>Conclusions and Relevance
Elevated RDW at the time of hospital admission and an increase in RDW during hospitalization were associated with increased mortality risk for patients with COVID-19 who received treatment at 4 hospitals in a large academic medical center network.<<

Yes, I read that. Did you also note that they acknowledged that they didn’t know if the patients had increased RDW (due to other causes) prior to getting COVID19 and that this may have been a confounding factor too?

PermeateFree said:

buffy said:

PermeateFree said:

Before making silly statements like this, it might be wise to read the complete article, Buffy too.

Yes, I read the paper. I put the link to the paper in my post.

Then you would read the following?

>>Conclusions and Relevance
Elevated RDW at the time of hospital admission and an increase in RDW during hospitalization were associated with increased mortality risk for patients with COVID-19 who received treatment at 4 hospitals in a large academic medical center network.<<

Also

>>Conclusions
In this cohort study of patients hospitalized for COVID-19, RDW measured at admission and during hospitalization was associated with a statistically significant increase in mortality. RDW is a routine laboratory test that may be useful in risk stratification of hospitalized patients with COVID-19.<<

SCIENCE said:

we promise to sometimes read complete articles

It’s not the forum way.

buffy said:

PermeateFree said:

buffy said:

Yes, I read the paper. I put the link to the paper in my post.

Then you would read the following?

>>Conclusions and Relevance
Elevated RDW at the time of hospital admission and an increase in RDW during hospitalization were associated with increased mortality risk for patients with COVID-19 who received treatment at 4 hospitals in a large academic medical center network.<<

Yes, I read that. Did you also note that they acknowledged that they didn’t know if the patients had increased RDW (due to other causes) prior to getting COVID19 and that this may have been a confounding factor too?

Yes! It is an on going study with potential, so why present it as little better than rubbish?

>>The study also notes that patients whose RDW was seen to increase during hospitalization were more likely to suffer worse outcomes from the disease. The researchers suggest this indicates RDW may be a useful biomarker to track the progress of a patient while admitted in hospital.

RDW has been previously determined to be an effective non-specific biomarker of illness, and the researchers do note it is unlikely there is a direct causal relationship at play. But, what is important here is the routine nature of RDW measurements gathered in common blood testing.

A number of similar studies have been published over the past few months exploring blood-based biomarkers to identify patients most as risk of death or severe illness from COVID-19. Many researchers have homed in on particular blood biomarker patterns that can be associated with the worst outcomes, however, not many of those blood measurements are as simple and routine to collect as RDW measurements.

The finding needs further validation in broader cohorts of patients, but if confirmed, this simple laboratory test may be a useful way to detect those COVID-19 patients most in need of clinical care.<<

PermeateFree said:

buffy said:

PermeateFree said:

Then you would read the following?

>>Conclusions and Relevance
Elevated RDW at the time of hospital admission and an increase in RDW during hospitalization were associated with increased mortality risk for patients with COVID-19 who received treatment at 4 hospitals in a large academic medical center network.<<

Yes, I read that. Did you also note that they acknowledged that they didn’t know if the patients had increased RDW (due to other causes) prior to getting COVID19 and that this may have been a confounding factor too?

Yes! It is an on going study with potential, so why present it as little better than rubbish?

>>The study also notes that patients whose RDW was seen to increase during hospitalization were more likely to suffer worse outcomes from the disease. The researchers suggest this indicates RDW may be a useful biomarker to track the progress of a patient while admitted in hospital.

RDW has been previously determined to be an effective non-specific biomarker of illness, and the researchers do note it is unlikely there is a direct causal relationship at play. But, what is important here is the routine nature of RDW measurements gathered in common blood testing.

A number of similar studies have been published over the past few months exploring blood-based biomarkers to identify patients most as risk of death or severe illness from COVID-19. Many researchers have homed in on particular blood biomarker patterns that can be associated with the worst outcomes, however, not many of those blood measurements are as simple and routine to collect as RDW measurements.

The finding needs further validation in broader cohorts of patients, but if confirmed, this simple laboratory test may be a useful way to detect those COVID-19 patients most in need of clinical care.<<

I am not presenting it as little better than rubbish. It is a sign. But I’d be interested for them to do the same for blood sugar levels. They can be spiked by infection/inflammation. And if they show a correlation, testing them with a quick prick test would be quicker/easier/cheaper biomarker than full blood testing.

https://acutecaretesting.org/en/journal-scans/raised-blood-glucose-during-acute-illness-and-risk-of-subsequent-diabetes

in truth, a little evidence really is merely a little better than nothing, though perhaps not the same as rubbish

SCIENCE said:

in truth, a little evidence really is merely a little better than nothing, though perhaps not the same as rubbish

And sometimes it really is just rubbish.

poikilotherm said:

SCIENCE said:

in truth, a little evidence really is merely a little better than nothing, though perhaps not the same as rubbish

And sometimes it really is just rubbish.

Sometimes it is, which is why they have investigations and a hypothesis to work by is an important start, especially when there have been interesting findings supporting it. One thing is for sure however, investigators would not go near an online forum as they would be so thoroughly discouraged by the armchair experts from doing anything and therefore never achieving anything.

PermeateFree said:

poikilotherm said:

SCIENCE said:

in truth, a little evidence really is merely a little better than nothing, though perhaps not the same as rubbish

And sometimes it really is just rubbish.

Sometimes it is, which is why they have investigations and a hypothesis to work by is an important start, especially when there have been interesting findings supporting it. One thing is for sure however, investigators would not go near an online forum as they would be so thoroughly discouraged by the armchair experts from doing anything and therefore never achieving anything.

That’s Why We’re Called SCIENCE Because We’re Here And Couldn’t Possibly Know About Any Of This Kind Of Stuff

SCIENCE said:

PermeateFree said:

poikilotherm said:

And sometimes it really is just rubbish.

Sometimes it is, which is why they have investigations and a hypothesis to work by is an important start, especially when there have been interesting findings supporting it. One thing is for sure however, investigators would not go near an online forum as they would be so thoroughly discouraged by the armchair experts from doing anything and therefore never achieving anything.

That’s Why We’re Called SCIENCE Because We’re Here And Couldn’t Possibly Know About Any Of This Kind Of Stuff

Keep on kidding yourself, you might actually end up believing it.

:)))

PermeateFree said:

SCIENCE said:

PermeateFree said:

Sometimes it is, which is why they have investigations and a hypothesis to work by is an important start, especially when there have been interesting findings supporting it. One thing is for sure however, investigators would not go near an online forum as they would be so thoroughly discouraged by the armchair experts from doing anything and therefore never achieving anything.

That’s Why We’re Called SCIENCE Because We’re Here And Couldn’t Possibly Know About Any Of This Kind Of Stuff

Keep on kidding yourself, you might actually end up believing it.

:)))

Enough Of This Faith Based Reasoning Here You May Be Surprised That We Rely On Good Evidence Not Belief

SCIENCE said:

PermeateFree said:

SCIENCE said:

That’s Why We’re Called SCIENCE Because We’re Here And Couldn’t Possibly Know About Any Of This Kind Of Stuff

Keep on kidding yourself, you might actually end up believing it.

:)))

Enough Of This Faith Based Reasoning Here You May Be Surprised That We Rely On Good Evidence Not Belief

Your naivety is very endearing.

LOL

PermeateFree said:

SCIENCE said:

PermeateFree said:

Keep on kidding yourself, you might actually end up believing it.

:)))

Enough Of This Faith Based Reasoning Here You May Be Surprised That We Rely On Good Evidence Not Belief

Your naivety is very endearing.

LOL

We’re Talking About Our Reasoning Not Your Faith But Sure

SCIENCE said:

PermeateFree said:

SCIENCE said:

Enough Of This Faith Based Reasoning Here You May Be Surprised That We Rely On Good Evidence Not Belief

Your naivety is very endearing.

LOL

We’re Talking About Our Reasoning Not Your Faith But Sure

Very cute. :))))

Anyway in rehouse viewing, here’s some more fun stuff.

China’s mainland reports 2 domestic cases of coronavirus, the first in more than a month. They work at the Port of Qingdao and handled frozen seafood imported from abroad. Both are asymptomatic.

Qingdao Health Commission says the 2 cases were found during routine testing at the port. They tested negative September 8, handled imported seafood on September 19, and tested positive on September 24. Packages were also positive for coronavirus.

PermeateFree said:

SCIENCE said:

PermeateFree said:

Your naivety is very endearing.

LOL

We’re Talking About Our Reasoning Not Your Faith But Sure

Very cute. :))))

So You Agree Thanks

SCIENCE said:

Anyway in regular viewing, here’s some more fun stuff.

China’s mainland reports 2 domestic cases of coronavirus, the first in more than a month. They work at the Port of Qingdao and handled frozen seafood imported from abroad. Both are asymptomatic.

Qingdao Health Commission says the 2 cases were found during routine testing at the port. They tested negative September 8, handled imported seafood on September 19, and tested positive on September 24. Packages were also positive for coronavirus.

pardon the prédictive text

SCIENCE said:

PermeateFree said:

SCIENCE said:

We’re Talking About Our Reasoning Not Your Faith But Sure

Very cute. :))))

So You Agree Thanks

Have it your way tiddles. :)))))

PermeateFree said:

SCIENCE said:

PermeateFree said:

Keep on kidding yourself, you might actually end up believing it.

:)))

Enough Of This Faith Based Reasoning Here You May Be Surprised That We Rely On Good Evidence Not Belief

Your naivety is very endearing.

LOL

Your objection to anyone questioning articles you post is not. But it is amusing.

Witty Rejoinder said:

PermeateFree said:

SCIENCE said:

Enough Of This Faith Based Reasoning Here You May Be Surprised That We Rely On Good Evidence Not Belief

Your naivety is very endearing.

LOL

Your objection to anyone questioning articles you post is not. But it is amusing.

I don’t mind people questioning articles I posts, I just like them to read them so they know what they are talking about (something very rarely done). Also I object to people who crap over everything regardless of its validity. This forum spends a great deal of its time shitting on people and things, usually just on hearsay evidence or ideology.

PermeateFree said:

Witty Rejoinder said:

PermeateFree said:

Your naivety is very endearing.

LOL

Your objection to anyone questioning articles you post is not. But it is amusing.

I don’t mind people questioning articles I posts, I just like them to read them so they know what they are talking about (something very rarely done). Also I object to people who crap over everything regardless of its validity. This forum spends a great deal of its time shitting on people and things, usually just on hearsay evidence or ideology.

Everything Must Be Read

“It looks like this virus has one big trick,” said Shane Crotty, a professor in the Center for Infectious Disease and Vaccine Research at the La Jolla Institute for Immunology in California. “That big trick is to avoid the initial innate immune response for a significant period of time and, in particular, avoid an early type-1 interferon response.”

The common thread in the research is the lack of a substance called interferon that helps orchestrate the body’s defense against viral pathogens and can be infused to treat conditions such as infectious hepatitis. Now, increasing evidence suggests that a significant minority of Covid-19 patients get very ill because of an impaired interferon response. Twin landmark studies published Thursday in the journal Science showed that insufficient interferon may lurk at a dangerous turning point in SARS-CoV-2 infections.

some more words

https://academic.oup.com/cid/advance-article/doi/10.1093/cid/ciaa1451/5910388

G’donya Victoria!

Divine Angel said:

For Aussies it would be highly unlikely.

I see there was some discussion last night about the Victorian hotel quarantine and hindsight. I thought I’d find out some information on the state of knowledge etc at the time because it’s difficult to remember accurately.

This was published in March:

>>Although 2019-nCoV can cause a severe respiratory illness like SARS and MERS, evidence from clinics suggested that 2019-nCoV is generally less pathogenic than SARS-CoV, and much less than MERS-CoV. The transmissibility of 2019-nCoV is still debated and needs to be further assessed.<<

REF: https://www.sciencedirect.com/science/article/pii/S1286457920300265

And the question of transmissibility and asymptomatic spread was only just starting to be asked:

https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC7074995/

And the timeline for quarantine:

https://www.aap.com.au/timeline-of-vic-hotel-quarantine-program/

From that you can see that in March knowledge of transmissibility was poor. You can also see that it took 2 months for the breakout at Rydges to happen. Another month for it to get out into the community. A week later an enquiry was announced and the housing towers shutdown. Four days later Melbourne and Mitchell shire went into 6 weeks of lockdown.

All in all, it seems quite a reasonable development of things given the state of knowledge at the time.

buffy said:

I see there was some discussion last night about the Victorian hotel quarantine and hindsight. I thought I’d find out some information on the state of knowledge etc at the time because it’s difficult to remember accurately.

This was published in March:

>>Although 2019-nCoV can cause a severe respiratory illness like SARS and MERS, evidence from clinics suggested that 2019-nCoV is generally less pathogenic than SARS-CoV, and much less than MERS-CoV. The transmissibility of 2019-nCoV is still debated and needs to be further assessed.<<

REF: https://www.sciencedirect.com/science/article/pii/S1286457920300265

And the question of transmissibility and asymptomatic spread was only just starting to be asked:

https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC7074995/

And the timeline for quarantine:

https://www.aap.com.au/timeline-of-vic-hotel-quarantine-program/

From that you can see that in March knowledge of transmissibility was poor. You can also see that it took 2 months for the breakout at Rydges to happen. Another month for it to get out into the community. A week later an enquiry was announced and the housing towers shutdown. Four days later Melbourne and Mitchell shire went into 6 weeks of lockdown.

All in all, it seems quite a reasonable development of things given the state of knowledge at the time.

Many of the critics seem gifted with 20/20 hindsight.

Mikakos has jumped ship.

Rule 303 said:

Mikakos has jumped ship.

good to see some pollies have the decency to quit when they have made a mistake. good on her.

Tamb said:

buffy said:

I see there was some discussion last night about the Victorian hotel quarantine and hindsight. I thought I’d find out some information on the state of knowledge etc at the time because it’s difficult to remember accurately.

This was published in March:

>>Although 2019-nCoV can cause a severe respiratory illness like SARS and MERS, evidence from clinics suggested that 2019-nCoV is generally less pathogenic than SARS-CoV, and much less than MERS-CoV. The transmissibility of 2019-nCoV is still debated and needs to be further assessed.<<

REF: https://www.sciencedirect.com/science/article/pii/S1286457920300265

And the question of transmissibility and asymptomatic spread was only just starting to be asked:

https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC7074995/

And the timeline for quarantine:

https://www.aap.com.au/timeline-of-vic-hotel-quarantine-program/

From that you can see that in March knowledge of transmissibility was poor. You can also see that it took 2 months for the breakout at Rydges to happen. Another month for it to get out into the community. A week later an enquiry was announced and the housing towers shutdown. Four days later Melbourne and Mitchell shire went into 6 weeks of lockdown.

All in all, it seems quite a reasonable development of things given the state of knowledge at the time.

Many of the critics seem gifted with 20/20 hindsight.

I’ll say.

Rule 303 said:

Mikakos has jumped ship.

Or fallen on her sword.

Or pushed onto her sword…

Michael V said:

Rule 303 said:

Mikakos has jumped ship.

Or fallen on her sword.

Or pushed onto her sword…

Or just too tired to continue.

so relying on private industry that should be competent but turned out otherwise is unacceptable but pumping government funds into paying your friends to vandalise the environment is worth electing again makes sense to us

Tamb said:

Divine Angel said:

For Aussies it would be highly unlikely.

planet, healing, COVID-19

The UK are getting the European second wave now, and it looks like being bigger than the first wave. BoJo and his associated fuckwits have responded with…

forcing pubs to close at 10pm.

who shall we burn over Ruby

party_pants said:

The UK are getting the European second wave now, and it looks like being bigger than the first wave. BoJo and his associated fuckwits have responded with…

forcing pubs to close at 10pm.

We used to dream of being able to stay in the pubs to 10pm.

The Rev Dodgson said:

party_pants said:

The UK are getting the European second wave now, and it looks like being bigger than the first wave. BoJo and his associated fuckwits have responded with…

forcing pubs to close at 10pm.

We used to dream of being able to stay in the pubs to 10pm.

Quite.

party_pants said:

The UK are getting the European second wave now, and it looks like being bigger than the first wave. BoJo and his associated fuckwits have responded with…

forcing pubs to close at 10pm.

This is just outrageous, it comes at a time of social stress when more than ever the punters need time to relax with a pint of Watney’s Red Barrel and at a time when there is increasing proof that alcohol is an effective virus preventative.
Madness.

Peak Warming Man said:

party_pants said:

The UK are getting the European second wave now, and it looks like being bigger than the first wave. BoJo and his associated fuckwits have responded with…

forcing pubs to close at 10pm.

This is just outrageous, it comes at a time of social stress when more than ever the punters need time to relax with a pint of Watney’s Red Barrel and at a time when there is increasing proof that alcohol is an effective virus preventative.
Madness.

snort

Michael V said:

Peak Warming Man said:

party_pants said:

The UK are getting the European second wave now, and it looks like being bigger than the first wave. BoJo and his associated fuckwits have responded with…

forcing pubs to close at 10pm.

This is just outrageous, it comes at a time of social stress when more than ever the punters need time to relax with a pint of Watney’s Red Barrel and at a time when there is increasing proof that alcohol is an effective virus preventative.
Madness.

snort

Silly boy. You don’t snort alcohol.

Florida governor signs order clearing restaurants and bars to fully open

https://edition.cnn.com/2020/09/25/us/florida-ron-desantis-restaurants-open-trnd/index.html

They are still pegging along at 100 deaths per day but w/e.
“Life is an illusion, why drag it out”

dv said:

Florida governor signs order clearing restaurants and bars to fully open

https://edition.cnn.com/2020/09/25/us/florida-ron-desantis-restaurants-open-trnd/index.html

They are still pegging along at 100 deaths per day but w/e.
“Life is an illusion, why drag it out”

Americans will tolerate surprisingly high losses of life.

A Vietnam veteran once said that Australian forces considered a maximum of 5% wounded/killed could be called ‘light casualties’. He also saidthat there was plenty of American commanders who’d happily apply that term to 20%-25% killed/wounded.

dv said:

Florida governor signs order clearing restaurants and bars to fully open

https://edition.cnn.com/2020/09/25/us/florida-ron-desantis-restaurants-open-trnd/index.html

They are still pegging along at 100 deaths per day but w/e.
“Life is an illusion, why drag it out”

fucking West Taiwan

captain_spalding said:

dv said:

Florida governor signs order clearing restaurants and bars to fully open

https://edition.cnn.com/2020/09/25/us/florida-ron-desantis-restaurants-open-trnd/index.html

They are still pegging along at 100 deaths per day but w/e.
“Life is an illusion, why drag it out”

Americans will tolerate surprisingly high losses of life.

A Vietnam veteran once said that Australian forces considered a maximum of 5% wounded/killed could be called ‘light casualties’. He also saidthat there was plenty of American commanders who’d happily apply that term to 20%-25% killed/wounded.

still 9/11 all matters.

200k+ not so much.

Dan Andrews is about to front the media:

so uh what was the outcome

SCIENCE said:

so uh what was the outcome

Outcome? Of coronavirus?

Oh, several million infected/suffering. several hundred thousand dead, maybe a couple of million.

SCIENCE said:

so uh what was the outcome

the child died of autism and now the family are suing the state for a billion dollars.

ABC News:

‘China denies destroying thousands of mosques, dismisses Australian report as foreign slander
China says there is one mosque for every 530 Muslims in Xinjiang as it responds to a report that claims it is destroying holy sites and places of worship as part of a plot to erase Uyghur language and culture.’

Sounds like China’s govt. has Stig O’Tracy working in their press bureau.

captain_spalding said:

ABC News:

‘China denies destroying thousands of mosques, dismisses Australian report as foreign slander
China says there is one mosque for every 530 Muslims in Xinjiang as it responds to a report that claims it is destroying holy sites and places of worship as part of a plot to erase Uyghur language and culture.’

Sounds like China’s govt. has Stig O’Tracy working in their press bureau.

Wrong thread (sigh). Apologies.

sorry we mean Whitty said Dan Andrews is about to front the media, we should have some sort of quote by now right

captain_spalding said:

captain_spalding said:

ABC News:

‘China denies destroying thousands of mosques, dismisses Australian report as foreign slander
China says there is one mosque for every 530 Muslims in Xinjiang as it responds to a report that claims it is destroying holy sites and places of worship as part of a plot to erase Uyghur language and culture.’

Sounds like China’s govt. has Stig O’Tracy working in their press bureau.

Wrong thread (sigh). Apologies.

but how does it compare to destroying confederate history

captain_spalding said:

SCIENCE said:

so uh what was the outcome

Outcome? Of coronavirus?

Oh, several million infected/suffering. several hundred thousand dead, maybe a couple of million.

And It’s round 2.

SCIENCE said:

sorry we mean Whitty said Dan Andrews is about to front the media, we should have some sort of quote by now right

Witty Rejoinder said:

SCIENCE said:

sorry we mean Whitty said Dan Andrews is about to front the media, we should have some sort of quote by now right

Premier Daniel Andrews says the resignation of former Health Minister Jenny Mikakos is “the appropriate course of action”, but insists he did not ask her to step down.

That sounds like a bit more than a sporting bus throw to us…

SCIENCE said:

Witty Rejoinder said:

SCIENCE said:

sorry we mean Whitty said Dan Andrews is about to front the media, we should have some sort of quote by now right

Premier Daniel Andrews says the resignation of former Health Minister Jenny Mikakos is “the appropriate course of action”, but insists he did not ask her to step down.

That sounds like a bit more than a sporting bus throw to us…

And the opinion from those communists at the ABC.

She cemented deep unpopularity with health workers in the early days of the crisis, when she publicly criticised a doctor who unknowingly saw patients while he had COVID-19.

“I am flabbergasted that a doctor that has flu-like symptoms has presented to work,” she told a press conference in March.

As it turned out, that doctor did not even meet her Government’s criteria for a coronavirus test at the time.

He made this clear, and disputed her version of events, in a widely shared Facebook post.

The outrage among the medical fraternity was palpable. Many wanted her to resign or be sacked.

Since then, controversies over issues like PPE and healthcare worker infections have put those in the sector further offside. That relationship hit a low point this week when the Health Workers Union called Ms Mikakos “breathtakingly incompetent”, and called for her immediate resignation.

There’s a chance we’ll hit a million deaths tonight. If not it’ll be tomorrow.

sibeen said:

There’s a chance we’ll hit a million deaths tonight. If not it’ll be tomorrow.

I looked up the average of deaths due to influenza the other night to get a comparative picture with Covid19.

And then I thought about that bottleneck in human evolution that is hypothesised to be the event that led to the modernisation of humans as a collective and almost extinction. Could a pandemic been the cause back then as well…

monkey skipper said:

And then I thought about that bottleneck in human evolution that is hypothesised to be the event that led to the modernisation of humans as a collective and almost extinction. Could a pandemic been the cause back then as well…

That’s one possibility, especially if the right-wing populists were in power.

here’s some more good news

https://www.abc.net.au/news/2020-09-27/protesters-clash-with-police-london-coronavirus-anti-lockdown/12707992

dv said:

In a world where nobody cares for their hair, nothing is comprehensible.

roughbarked said:

dv said:

In a world where nobody cares for their hair, nothing is comprehensible.

to be fair it’s 1/30 of what the LABOR Sydney council spent on travel wasn’t it, hey hey

OK expert armchairs here, what do we all think about this strategy component in isolation without other components of a comprehensive pandemic control strategy ¿

https://www.abc.net.au/news/2020-09-27/boris-johnsons-operation-moonshot-coronavirus-testing-plan-covid/12695498

Mass testing is the UK’s pathway out of coronavirus, according to Boris Johnson. Experts aren’t so sure

SCIENCE said:

OK expert armchairs here, what do we all think about this strategy component in isolation without other components of a comprehensive pandemic control strategy ¿

https://www.abc.net.au/news/2020-09-27/boris-johnsons-operation-moonshot-coronavirus-testing-plan-covid/12695498

Mass testing is the UK’s pathway out of coronavirus, according to Boris Johnson. Experts aren’t so sure

A Swedish friend has given me a new conspiracy. N.B. This is not my idea & I don’t endorse any part of it.
The Swedish herd immunity approach was orchestrated by the refugees to deplete the native population.

Andrews’ announcements live:

127,000 people going back to work
VCE & VCAL students are back
Prep-6 and SE back to school 12/10
Childcare re-opens
1 child minder can mind in the home
Outside gatherings – 1 household, or <5 from 2 households
1 person shopping limit lifted
Care facilities 1 visitor / day for <2 hours
Dental care re-opens
Allied health re-opens
Churches <5 people outdoors
Weddings <5 (inc couple)
Exercise – Tennis, bowls, golf stay closed, other outdoor allowed <5km of home or work, <2hr
Outdoor pools open

Next step announcement 19/10

Curfew lifted as of 05:00 tomorrow morning.

Rule 303 said:

Andrews’ announcements live:

127,000 people going back to work
VCE & VCAL students are back
Prep-6 and SE back to school 12/10
Childcare re-opens
1 child minder can mind in the home
Outside gatherings – 1 household, or <5 from 2 households
1 person shopping limit lifted
Care facilities 1 visitor / day for <2 hours
Dental care re-opens
Allied health re-opens
Churches <5 people outdoors
Weddings <5 (inc couple)
Exercise – Tennis, bowls, golf stay closed, other outdoor allowed <5km of home or work, <2hr
Outdoor pools open

Next step announcement 19/10

OK Victoria, try not to fuck it up this time.

Divine Angel said:

Rule 303 said:

Andrews’ announcements live:

127,000 people going back to work
VCE & VCAL students are back
Prep-6 and SE back to school 12/10
Childcare re-opens
1 child minder can mind in the home
Outside gatherings – 1 household, or <5 from 2 households
1 person shopping limit lifted
Care facilities 1 visitor / day for <2 hours
Dental care re-opens
Allied health re-opens
Churches <5 people outdoors
Weddings <5 (inc couple)
Exercise – Tennis, bowls, golf stay closed, other outdoor allowed <5km of home or work, <2hr
Outdoor pools open

Next step announcement 19/10

OK Victoria, try not to fuck it up this time.

LOL. Thanks for your encouragement.

:-)

I do what I can. Personal cheerleader etc.

Divine Angel said:

I do what I can. Personal cheerleader etc.

dv said:

Probably using the new US billion.

The Rev Dodgson said:

dv said:

Probably using the new US billion.

I’m just a little bit worried that the US is going to coast along, gradually deteriorating til it’s not really part of the first world any more but still has the world’s biggest nuclear arsenal and it really only has one remaining way to reinforce its status.

dv said:

The Rev Dodgson said:

dv said:

Probably using the new US billion.

I’m just a little bit worried that the US is going to coast along, gradually deteriorating til it’s not really part of the first world any more but still has the world’s biggest nuclear arsenal and it really only has one remaining way to reinforce its status.

I’m worried about our status of being allied to that.

dv said:

The Rev Dodgson said:

dv said:

Probably using the new US billion.

I’m just a little bit worried that the US is going to coast along, gradually deteriorating til it’s not really part of the first world any more but still has the world’s biggest nuclear arsenal and it really only has one remaining way to reinforce its status.

Maybe the smarter states will secede and take the nukes with them.

dv said:

I think they’ve overcounted.

Maybe this is going by the number of postal ballots received?

It could become two countries, the United States of America and the Forsaken States of White Trashia.

party_pants said:

dv said:

I think they’ve overcounted.

Maybe this is going by the number of postal ballots received?

Maybe that plus sign represents SCIENCE’s new “addition”

dv said:

party_pants said:

dv said:

I think they’ve overcounted.

Maybe this is going by the number of postal ballots received?

Maybe that plus sign represents SCIENCE’s new “addition”

Maybe this indicated a customary billion rather than a metric billion like other sensible countries use.

party_pants said:

dv said:

party_pants said:

I think they’ve overcounted.

Maybe this is going by the number of postal ballots received?

Maybe that plus sign represents SCIENCE’s new “addition”

Maybe this indicated a customary billion rather than a metric billion like other sensible countries use.

Could be a typo and they actually meant “umpteen zillion”.

dv said:

The Rev Dodgson said:

dv said:

Probably using the new US billion.

I’m just a little bit worried that the US is going to coast along, gradually deteriorating til it’s not really part of the first world any more but still has the world’s biggest nuclear arsenal and it really only has one remaining way to reinforce its status.

I’m not worried I’m pretty sure Rodd Rummel knew exactly what he was doing.

Peak Warming Man said:

dv said:

The Rev Dodgson said:

Probably using the new US billion.

I’m just a little bit worried that the US is going to coast along, gradually deteriorating til it’s not really part of the first world any more but still has the world’s biggest nuclear arsenal and it really only has one remaining way to reinforce its status.

I’m not worried I’m pretty sure Rodd Rummel knew exactly what he was doing.

Aye, talking shite.

One million and counting
The covid-19 pandemic is worse than official figures show
But some things are improving, and it will not go on for ever

Briefing
Sep 26th 2020 edition

As the autumnal equinox passed, Europe was battening down the hatches for a gruelling winter. Intensive-care wards and hospital beds were filling up in Madrid and Marseille—a city which, a few months ago, thought it had more or less eliminated covid-19. Governments were implementing new restrictions, sometimes, as in England, going back on changes made just a few months ago. The al-fresco life of summer was returning indoors. Talk of a second wave was everywhere.

Across the Atlantic the United States saw its official covid-19 death toll—higher than that of all western Europe put together—break the 200,000 barrier. India, which has seen more than half a million new cases a week for four weeks running, will soon take America’s unenviable laurels as the country with the largest official case count.

The world looks set to see its millionth officially recorded death from covid-19 before the beginning of October. That is more than the World Health Organisation (who) recorded as having died from malaria (620,000), suicide (794,000) or hiv/aids (954,000) over the whole of 2017, the most recent year for which figures are available.

Those deaths represent just over 3% of the recorded covid-19 cases, which now number over 32m. That tally is itself an underestimate of the number who have actually been infected by sars-cov-2, the virus which causes covid 19. Many of the infected do not get sick. Many who do are never seen by any health system.

A better, if still imperfect, sense of how many infections have taken place since the outbreak began at the end of last year can be gleaned from “serosurveys” which scientists and public-health officials have undertaken around the world. These look for antibodies against sars-cov-2 in blood samples which may have been taken for other purposes. Their presence reveals past exposure to the virus.

Various things make these surveys inaccurate. They can pick up antibodies against other viruses, inflating their totals—an effect which can differ from place to place, as there are more similar-looking viruses circulating in some regions than in others. They can mislead in the other direction, too. Some tests miss low levels of antibody. Some people (often young ones) fight off the virus without ever producing antibodies and will thus not be recorded as having been infected. As a result, estimates based on serosurveys have to be taken with more than a grain of salt.

But in many countries it would take a small sea’s worth of the stuff to bring the serosurvey figures into line with the official number of cases. The fact that serosurvey data are spotty—there is very little, for example, openly available from China—means it is not possible to calculate the global infection rate directly from the data at hand. But by constructing an empirical relationship between death rates, case rates, average income—a reasonable proxy for intensity of testing—and seropositivity it is possible to impute rates for countries where data are not available and thus estimate a global total.

The graphic on this page shows such an estimate based on 279 serosurveys in 19 countries. It suggests that infections were already running at over 1m a day by the end of January—when the world at large was only just beginning to hear of the virus’s existence. In May the worldwide rate appears to have been more than 5m a day. The uncertainties in the estimate are large, and become greater as you draw close to the present, but all told it finds that somewhere between 500m and 730m people worldwide have been infected—from 6.4% to 9.3% of the world’s population. The who has not yet released serosurvey-based estimates of its own, though such work is under way; but it has set an upper bound at 10% of the global population.

As the upper part of the following data panel shows, serosurvey results which can be directly compared with the diagnosed totals are often a great deal bigger. In Germany, where cases have been low and testing thorough, the seropositivity rate was 4.5 times the diagnosed rate in August. In Minnesota a survey carried out in July found a multiplier of seven. A survey completed on August 23rd found a 6.02% seropositivity rate in England, implying a multiplier of 12. A national serosurvey of India conducted from the middle of May to early June found that 0.73% were infected, suggesting a national total of 10m. The number of registered cases at that time was 226,713, giving a multiplier of 44. Such results suggest that a global multiplier of 20 or so is quite possible.

If the disease is far more widespread than it appears, is it proportionately less deadly than official statistics, mainly gathered in rich countries, have made it look? Almost certainly. On the basis of British figures David Spiegelhalter, who studies the public understanding of risk at Cambridge University, has calculated that the risk of death from covid increases by about 13% for every year of age, which means a 65-year-old is 100 times more likely to die than a 25-year-old. And 65-year-olds are not evenly distributed around the world. Last year 20.5% of the eu’s population was over 65, as opposed to just 3% of sub-Saharan Africa’s.

But it is also likely that the number of deaths, like the number of cases, is being seriously undercounted, because many people will have died of the disease without having had a positive test for the virus. One way to get around this is by comparing the number of deaths this year with that which would be predicted on the basis of years past. This “excess mortality” method relies on the idea that, though official statistics may often be silent or misleading as to the cause of death, they are rarely wrong about a death actually having taken place.

The excessive force of destiny
The Economist has gathered all-cause mortality data from countries which report them weekly or monthly, a group which includes most of western Europe, some of Latin America, and a few other large countries, including the United States, Russia and South Africa (see lower part of data panel). Between March and August these countries recorded 580,000 covid-19 deaths but 900,000 excess deaths; the true toll of their share of the pandemic appears to have been 55% greater than the official one. This analysis suggests that America’s official figures underestimate the death toll by 30% or more (America’s Centres for Disease Control and Prevention have provided a similar estimate). This means that the real number of deaths to date is probably a lot closer to 300,000 than 200,000. That is about 10% of the 2.8m Americans who die each year—or, put another way, half the number who succumb to cancer. And there is plenty of 2020 still to go.

Add to all this excess mortality unreported deaths from countries where record keeping is not good enough to allow such assessments and the true death toll for the pandemic may be as high as 2m.

What can be done to slow its further rise? The response to the virus’s original vertiginous ascent was an avalanche of lockdowns; at its greatest extent, around April 10th, at least 3.5bn people were being ordered to stay at home either by national governments or regional ones. The idea was to stop the spread of the disease before health-care systems collapsed beneath its weight, and in this the lockdowns were largely successful. But in themselves they were never a solution. They severely slowed the spread of the disease while they were in place, but they could not stay in place for ever.

Stopping people interacting with each other at all, as lockdowns and limits on the size of gatherings do, is the first of three ways to lower a disease’s reproduction number, R—the number of new cases caused by each existing case. The second is reducing the likelihood that interactions lead to infection; it requires mandated levels of social distancing, hygiene measures and barriers to transmission such as face masks and visors. The third is reducing the time during which an infectious person can interact with people under any conditions. This is achieved by finding people who may recently have been infected and getting them to isolate themselves.

Ensuring that infectious people do not have time to do much infecting requires a fast and thorough test-and-trace system. Some countries, including Canada, China, Germany, Italy, Japan, Singapore and Taiwan, have successfully combined big testing programmes which provide rapid results with a well developed capacity for contact tracing and effective subsequent action. Others have foundered.

Networks and herds
Israel provides a ready example. An early and well-enforced lockdown had the expected effect of reducing new infections. But the time thus bought for developing a test-and-trace system was not well used, and the country’s emergence from lockdown was ill-thought-through. This was in part because the small circle around prime minister Binyamin Netanyahu into which power has been concentrated includes no one with relevant expertise; the health ministry is weak and politicised.

Things have been made worse by the fact that social distancing and barrier methods are being resisted by some parts of society. Synagogues and Torah seminaries in the ultra-Orthodox community and large tribal weddings in the Arab-Israeli community have been major centres of infection. While unhappy countries, like Tolstoy’s unhappy families, all differ, the elements of Israel’s dysfunction have clear parallels elsewhere.

Getting to grips with “superspreader” events is crucial to keeping R low. Close gatherings in confined spaces allow people to be infected dozens at a time. In March almost 100 were infected at a biotech conference in Boston. Many of them spread the virus on: genetic analysis subsequently concluded that 20,000 cases could be traced to that conference.

Nipping such blooms in the bud requires lots of contact tracing. Taiwan’s system logs 15-20 contacts for each person with a positive test. Contact tracers in England register four to five close contacts per positive test; those in France and Spain get just three. It also requires that people be willing to get tested in the first place. In England only 10-30% of people with covid-like symptoms ask for a test through the National Health Service. One of the reasons is that a positive test means self-isolation. Few want to undergo such restrictions, and few are good at abiding by them. In early May a survey in England found that only a fifth of those with covid symptoms had self-isolated as fully as required. The government is now seeking to penalise such breaches with fines of up to £10,000 ($12,800). That will reduce the incentive to get tested in the first place yet further.

As much of Europe comes to terms with the fact that its initial lockdowns have not put an end to its problems, there is increased interest in the Swedish experience. Unlike most of Europe, Sweden never instigated a lockdown, preferring to rely on social distancing. This resulted in a very high death rate compared with that seen in its Nordic neighbours; 58.1 per 100,000, where the rate in Denmark is 11.1, in Finland 6.19 and in Norway 4.93. It is not clear that this high death rate bought Sweden any immediate economic advantage. Its gdp dropped in the second quarter in much the same way as gdps did elsewhere.

It is possible that by accepting so many deaths upfront Sweden may see fewer of them in the future, for two reasons. One is the phenomenon known, in a rather macabre piece of jargon, as “harvesting”. Those most likely to succumb do so early on, reducing the number of deaths seen later. The other possibility is that Sweden will benefit from a level of herd immunity: once the number of presumably immune survivors in the population grows high enough, the spread of the disease slows down because encounters between the infected and the susceptible become rare. Avoiding lockdown may conceivably have helped with this.

On the other hand, one of the advantages of lockdowns was that they provided time not just for the development of test-and-trace systems but also for doctors to get better at curing the sick. In places with good health systems, getting covid-19 is less risky today than it was six months ago. isaric, which researches infectious diseases, has analysed the outcomes for 68,000 patients hospitalised with covid-19; their survival rate increased from 66% in March to 84% in August. The greatest relative gains have been made among the most elderly patients. Survival rates among British people 60 and over who needed intensive care have risen from 39% to 58%.

This is largely a matter of improved case management. Putting patients on oxygen earlier helps. So does reticence about using mechanical ventilators and a greater awareness of the disease’s effects beyond the lungs, such as its tendency to provoke clotting disorders.

Nouvelle vague
As for treatments, two already widely available steroids, dexamethasone and hydrocortisone, increase survival by reducing inflammation. Avigan, a Japanese flu drug, has been found to hasten recovery. Remdesivir, a drug designed to fight other viruses, and convalescent plasma, which provides patients with antibodies from people who have already recovered from the disease, seem to offer marginal benefits.

Many consider antibodies tailor-made for the job by biotech companies a better bet; over the past few years they have provided a breakthrough in the treatment of Ebola. The American government has paid $450m for supplies of a promising two-antibody treatment being developed by Regeneron. That will be enough for between 70,000 and 300,000 doses, depending on what stage of the disease the patients who receive it have reached. Regeneron is now working with Roche, another drug company, to crank up production worldwide. But antibodies will remain expensive, and the need to administer them intravenously limits their utility.

It is tempting to look to better treatment for the reason why, although diagnosed cases in Europe have been climbing steeply into what is being seen as a second wave, the number of deaths has not followed: indeed it has, as yet, barely moved. The main reason, though, is simpler. During the first wave little testing was being done, and so many infections were being missed. Now lots of testing is being done, and vastly more infections are being picked up. Correct for this distortion and you see that the first wave was far larger than what is being seen today, which makes today’s lower death rate much less surprising (see data panel).

The coming winter is nevertheless worrying. Exponential growth can bring change quickly when R gets significantly above one. There is abundant evidence of what Katrine Bach Habersaat of the who calls “pandemic fatigue” eating away at earlier behavioural change, as well as increasing resentment of other public-health measures. YouGov, a pollster, has been tracking opinion on such matters in countries around the world. It has seen support for quarantining people who have had contact with someone infected fall a bit in Asia and rather more in the West, where it is down from 78% to 63%. In America it has fallen to 55%.

It is true that infection rates are currently climbing mostly among the young. But the young do not live in bubbles. Recent figures from Bouches-du-Rhône, the French department which includes Marseille, show clearly how a spike of cases in the young becomes, in a few weeks, an increase in cases at all ages.

As the fear of such spikes increases, though, so does the hope that they will not be recurring all that much longer. Pfizer, which has promising vaccine candidate in efficacy trials, has previously said that it will seek regulatory review of preliminary results in October, though new standards at the Food and Drug Administration may not allow it to do so in America quite that soon. Three other candidates, from AstraZeneca, Moderna and j&j, are nipping at Pfizer’s heels. The j&j vaccine is a newcomer; it entered efficacy trials only on September 23rd. But whereas the other vaccines need a booster a month after the first jab, the j&j vaccine is administered just once, which will make the trial quicker; it could have preliminary results in November.

None of the companies will have all the trial data they are planning for until the first quarter of next year. But in emergencies regulators can authorise a vaccine’s use based on interim analysis if it meets a minimum standard (in this case, protection of half those who are vaccinated). Authorisation for use under such conditions would still make such a vaccine more credible than those already in use in China and Russia, neither of which was tested for efficacy at all. But there have been fears that American regulators may, in the run up to the presidential election, set the bar too low. Making an only-just-good-enough vaccine available might see social-distancing collapse and infections increase; alternatively, a perfectly decent vaccine approved in a politically toxic way might not be taken up as widely as it should be.

In either case, though, the practical availability of a vaccine will lag behind any sort of approval. In the long run, billions of doses could be needed. A global coalition of countries known as Covax wants to distribute 2bn by the end of 2021—which will only be enough for 1bn people if the vaccine in question, like Pfizer’s or AstraZeneca’s, needs to be administered twice. The world’s largest manufacturer of vaccines, the Serum Institute in India, recently warned that there will not be enough supplies for universal inoculation until 2024 at the earliest.

Even if everything goes swimmingly, it is hard to see distribution extending beyond a small number of front-line health and care workers this year. But the earlier vaccines are pushed out, the better. The data panel on this page looks at the results of vaccinating earlier versus later in a hypothetical population not that unlike Britain’s. Vaccination at a slower rate which starts earlier sees fewer eventual infections than a much more ambitious campaign started later. At the same time increases in R—which might come about if social distancing and similar measures fall away as vaccination becomes real—make all scenarios worse.

By next winter the covid situation in developed countries should be improved. What level of immunity the vaccines will provide, and for how long, remains to be seen. But few expect none of them to work at all.

Access to the safety thus promised will be unequal, both within countries and between them. Some will see loved ones who might have been vaccinated die because they were not. Minimising such losses will require getting more people vaccinated more quickly than has ever been attempted before. It is a prodigious organisational challenge—and one which, judging by this year’s experience, some governments will handle considerably better than others. ■

https://www.economist.com/briefing/2020/09/26/the-covid-19-pandemic-is-worse-than-official-figures-show?

Excellent article.

If the top diagram is correct, then the virus has become much morr deadly.

dv said:

If the top diagram is correct, then the virus has become much morr deadly.

Even if the numbers were potentially correct with reasonable assumptions, the indicated “margin of error” on the total cases graph is ridiculously small.

Witty Rejoinder said:

One million and counting
The covid-19 pandemic is worse than official figures show
But some things are improving, and it will not go on for ever

https://www.economist.com/briefing/2020/09/26/the-covid-19-pandemic-is-worse-than-official-figures-show?

Thanks for that one, Witty.

sibeen said:

Witty Rejoinder said:

One million and counting
The covid-19 pandemic is worse than official figures show
But some things are improving, and it will not go on for ever

https://www.economist.com/briefing/2020/09/26/the-covid-19-pandemic-is-worse-than-official-figures-show?

Thanks for that one, Witty.

No worries.

You know how I’ve been saying for months that Health are abject garbage at community education / engagement?

Does anyone feel like they say with any confidence whether my mate the self-employed gardener can go back to work tomorrow?

I have been unable to find any other direction.

Rule 303 said:

You know how I’ve been saying for months that Health are abject garbage at community education / engagement?

Does anyone feel like they say with any confidence whether my mate the self-employed gardener can go back to work tomorrow?

I have been unable to find any other direction.

Outdoor sole traders — including gardening, landscaping and garden maintenance businesses — will also be allowed to return to work as long as they adhere to COVID-safe plans.

—
ABC

Ian said:

Rule 303 said:

You know how I’ve been saying for months that Health are abject garbage at community education / engagement?

Does anyone feel like they say with any confidence whether my mate the self-employed gardener can go back to work tomorrow?

I have been unable to find any other direction.

Outdoor sole traders — including gardening, landscaping and garden maintenance businesses — will also be allowed to return to work as long as they adhere to COVID-safe plans.

—
ABC

The phrase “Partial return to work for…” is sloppy at best.

Rule 303 said:

Ian said:

Rule 303 said:

You know how I’ve been saying for months that Health are abject garbage at community education / engagement?

Does anyone feel like they say with any confidence whether my mate the self-employed gardener can go back to work tomorrow?

I have been unable to find any other direction.

Outdoor sole traders — including gardening, landscaping and garden maintenance businesses — will also be allowed to return to work as long as they adhere to COVID-safe plans.

—
ABC

The phrase “Partial return to work for…” is sloppy at best.

Dig it.. but don’t bust a gut

Golf is still not allowed. I really don’t get that at all.

Ian said:

Rule 303 said:

Ian said:

Outdoor sole traders — including gardening, landscaping and garden maintenance businesses — will also be allowed to return to work as long as they adhere to COVID-safe plans.

—
ABC

The phrase “Partial return to work for…” is sloppy at best.

Dig it.. but don’t bust a gut

Am I right in thinking that most people would interpret that to mean he’s allowed to return to work, if he’s got a CovidSafe Plan?

sibeen said:

Golf is still not allowed. I really don’t get that at all.

By coincidence, the mate in the previous questions is the small engine mechanic at one of the ‘international’ golf courses – Also shut down.

Rule 303 said:

Ian said:

Rule 303 said:

The phrase “Partial return to work for…” is sloppy at best.

Dig it.. but don’t bust a gut

Am I right in thinking that most people would interpret that to mean he’s allowed to return to work, if he’s got a CovidSafe Plan?

Spose so

Rule 303 said:

Ian said:

Rule 303 said:

The phrase “Partial return to work for…” is sloppy at best.

Dig it.. but don’t bust a gut

Am I right in thinking that most people would interpret that to mean he’s allowed to return to work, if he’s got a CovidSafe Plan?

I would interpret it that way. Not sure where he’d find a template for a plan. I only know where to find the one for optometrists. There might be something on the government website that you just download and fill the gaps…

https://www.abc.net.au/news/rural/2020-09-27/restrictions-ease-on-victorian-meat-processing/12675168

On a purely selfish level…we might be able to get Don savs again.

:)

buffy said:

https://www.abc.net.au/news/rural/2020-09-27/restrictions-ease-on-victorian-meat-processing/12675168

On a purely selfish level…we might be able to get Don savs again.

:)

I read that EXACTLY the same way :)

There should be a new release of Australian Provisional Mortality Statistics on 1/10/20 according to the webpage.

https://www.abs.gov.au/statistics/health/causes-death/provisional-mortality-statistics/latest-release

There is an explanation of “excess deaths” on that page.

buffy said:

There should be a new release of Australian Provisional Mortality Statistics on 1/10/20 according to the webpage.

https://www.abs.gov.au/statistics/health/causes-death/provisional-mortality-statistics/latest-release

There is an explanation of “excess deaths” on that page.

> 55,047 doctor certified deaths occurred between 1 January 2020 and 26 May 2020 and were registered by 30 June. This compares to a baseline average of 53,361 over the past 5 years.

Ta. I’ve been wanting to know that.

mollwollfumble said:

buffy said:

There should be a new release of Australian Provisional Mortality Statistics on 1/10/20 according to the webpage.

https://www.abs.gov.au/statistics/health/causes-death/provisional-mortality-statistics/latest-release

There is an explanation of “excess deaths” on that page.

> 55,047 doctor certified deaths occurred between 1 January 2020 and 26 May 2020 and were registered by 30 June. This compares to a baseline average of 53,361 over the past 5 years.

Ta. I’ve been wanting to know that.

No reports of flu-like illnesses in Melbourne, except 2 reports in Sunshine, postcode 3020.

What’s worse? Leunig or genital warts?

dv said:

What’s worse? Leunig or genital warts?

Hmmmmm.

dv said:

What’s worse? Leunig or genital warts?

They’re both signs of knob rot.

“Sneaky virus, fooling people into believing that they do not have COVID-19. But, ironically, it may be gifting us with the knowledge of a new protein, critical for pain.

Two roads emerge in the forest ahead: (1) block neuropilin-1 to limit SARS-CoV-2 entry, and (2) block neuropilin-1 to block pain.”

https://www.sciencealert.com/sars-cov-2-appears-to-stop-us-feeling-pain-which-could-be-why-it-s-spreads-so-easily

Rule 303 said:

dv said:

What’s worse? Leunig or genital warts?

They’re both signs of knob rot.

LOL

dv said:

What’s worse? Leunig or genital warts?

this stock image shows a gardener with her peas

SCIENCE said:

dv said:

What’s worse? Leunig or genital warts?

this stock image shows a gardener with her peas

Yes. Yes it does.

Apparently humans make errors and mistakes happen, and surprisingly enough, despite all the disease and death, we’re meant to believe that nobody in charge was actually trying to do the wrong thing!

https://www.abc.net.au/news/2020-09-28/covid-19-hotel-quarantine-inquiry-hears-final-submissions/12709782

Wonder who was paying them.

more breaking news, it’s possible that better pandemic control correlates with more economic activity

SCIENCE said:

more breaking news, it’s possible that better pandemic control correlates with more economic activity

I’m sure there is a correlation, but I doubt that it is commutative.

I have noticed the air quality is better.

Tau.Neutrino said:

I have noticed the air quality is better.

Melbourne and surrounding areas .

The Inquiry into the Melbourne Quarantine failures seems to be taking the line that the mess is officially nobody’s fault.

Whatever you might say about that, I suggest it would be worth considering this question before passing judgement:

What would NSW have done if they had decided (as they clearly should have) to confine the 2647 passengers and 1148 crew from the Ruby Princess? Assume they can’t stay on the ship.

Rule 303 said:

The Inquiry into the Melbourne Quarantine failures seems to be taking the line that the mess is officially nobody’s fault.

Whatever you might say about that, I suggest it would be worth considering this question before passing judgement:

What would NSW have done if they had decided (as they clearly should have) to confine the 2647 passengers and 1148 crew from the Ruby Princess? Assume they can’t stay on the ship.

Who had enough empty hotels?

http://tinyurl.com/FAQ-aerosols