I was asked today when the Baptist religion began, I didn’t know, and neither did the Christians I was with. So I looked it up.

It’s quite interesting really. Many other religions you can pin down to a certain person or a certain date. Baptist is not one of them.

The first Baptist church was started in 1609 in Amsterdam. But it didn’t become popular until the 1730s in America.

While looking it up, I looked at origin dates for some other religions as well, dates are approximate.

Timeline of some major religions

Before 60,000 BC, Witchcraft / Ghosts / Werewolf / Monsters / Teleportation
3,100 BC or before, Pantheism / Norse / Egyptian / Greek / Roman
C 2,000 BC, Hindu / Astrology
1,000 BC, Judaism
Before 550 BC, Zoroastrian
570 BC, Confuscius
C 550 BC, Jain
C 350 BC, Buddhist
C 350 BC, Tao
325 AD, Roman Catholic
610 AD, Islam / Sunni / Sufi / Shia
C 800 AD, Zen
988 AD, Eastern Orthodox
1490, Sikh
1534, Church of England
1609, Baptist (became popular in the 1730s)
1707, Presbyterian
1781, Druidism
1791, Methodist
1830, Latter Day Saints
1844, Bahai
1855, Churches of Christ in Australia
1884, Jehovas Witness
1895, SciFi / Aliens / FTL / Telepathy / Time travel
1950, Scientology
1965, Hare Krishna
1965, Eckankar
1967, Hippie / Anti-Western / New Age / Environmentalism / Vegan / Apocalypse coming

mollwollfumble said:

I was asked today when the Baptist religion began, I didn’t know, and neither did the Christians I was with. So I looked it up.

It’s quite interesting really. Many other religions you can pin down to a certain person or a certain date. Baptist is not one of them.

The first Baptist church was started in 1609 in Amsterdam. But it didn’t become popular until the 1730s in America.

While looking it up, I looked at origin dates for some other religions as well, dates are approximate.

Timeline of some major religions

Before 60,000 BC, Witchcraft / Ghosts / Werewolf / Monsters / Teleportation
3,100 BC or before, Pantheism / Norse / Egyptian / Greek / Roman
C 2,000 BC, Hindu / Astrology
1,000 BC, Judaism
Before 550 BC, Zoroastrian
570 BC, Confuscius
C 550 BC, Jain
C 350 BC, Buddhist
C 350 BC, Tao
325 AD, Roman Catholic
610 AD, Islam / Sunni / Sufi / Shia
C 800 AD, Zen
988 AD, Eastern Orthodox
1490, Sikh
1534, Church of England
1609, Baptist (became popular in the 1730s)
1707, Presbyterian
1781, Druidism
1791, Methodist
1830, Latter Day Saints
1844, Bahai
1855, Churches of Christ in Australia
1884, Jehovas Witness
1895, SciFi / Aliens / FTL / Telepathy / Time travel
1950, Scientology
1965, Hare Krishna
1965, Eckankar
1967, Hippie / Anti-Western / New Age / Environmentalism / Vegan / Apocalypse coming

I thought Druids were around longer than that.

mollwollfumble said:

I was asked today when the Baptist religion began, I didn’t know, and neither did the Christians I was with. So I looked it up.

It’s quite interesting really. Many other religions you can pin down to a certain person or a certain date. Baptist is not one of them.

The first Baptist church was started in 1609 in Amsterdam. But it didn’t become popular until the 1730s in America.

While looking it up, I looked at origin dates for some other religions as well, dates are approximate.

Timeline of some major religions

Before 60,000 BC, Witchcraft / Ghosts / Werewolf / Monsters / Teleportation
3,100 BC or before, Pantheism / Norse / Egyptian / Greek / Roman
C 2,000 BC, Hindu / Astrology
1,000 BC, Judaism
Before 550 BC, Zoroastrian
570 BC, Confuscius
C 550 BC, Jain
C 350 BC, Buddhist
C 350 BC, Tao
325 AD, Roman Catholic
610 AD, Islam / Sunni / Sufi / Shia
C 800 AD, Zen
988 AD, Eastern Orthodox
1490, Sikh
1534, Church of England
1609, Baptist (became popular in the 1730s)
1707, Presbyterian
1781, Druidism
1791, Methodist
1830, Latter Day Saints
1844, Bahai
1855, Churches of Christ in Australia
1884, Jehovas Witness
1895, SciFi / Aliens / FTL / Telepathy / Time travel
1950, Scientology
1965, Hare Krishna
1965, Eckankar
1967, Hippie / Anti-Western / New Age / Environmentalism / Vegan / Apocalypse coming
!998 PeterT Ministries.

mollwollfumble said:

I was asked today when the Baptist religion began, I didn’t know, and neither did the Christians I was with. So I looked it up.

It’s quite interesting really. Many other religions you can pin down to a certain person or a certain date. Baptist is not one of them.

The first Baptist church was started in 1609 in Amsterdam. But it didn’t become popular until the 1730s in America.

While looking it up, I looked at origin dates for some other religions as well, dates are approximate.

Timeline of some major religions

Before 60,000 BC, Witchcraft / Ghosts / Werewolf / Monsters / Teleportation
3,100 BC or before, Pantheism / Norse / Egyptian / Greek / Roman
C 2,000 BC, Hindu / Astrology
1,000 BC, Judaism
Before 550 BC, Zoroastrian
570 BC, Confuscius
C 550 BC, Jain
C 350 BC, Buddhist
C 350 BC, Tao
325 AD, Roman Catholic
610 AD, Islam / Sunni / Sufi / Shia
C 800 AD, Zen
988 AD, Eastern Orthodox
1490, Sikh
1534, Church of England
1609, Baptist (became popular in the 1730s)
1707, Presbyterian
1781, Druidism
1791, Methodist
1830, Latter Day Saints
1844, Bahai
1855, Churches of Christ in Australia
1884, Jehovas Witness
1895, SciFi / Aliens / FTL / Telepathy / Time travel
1950, Scientology
1965, Hare Krishna
1965, Eckankar
1967, Hippie / Anti-Western / New Age / Environmentalism / Vegan / Apocalypse coming

2005-2006 Flying Spaghetti Monster/Pastafarianism

Peak Warming Man said:

mollwollfumble said:

I was asked today when the Baptist religion began, I didn’t know, and neither did the Christians I was with. So I looked it up.

It’s quite interesting really. Many other religions you can pin down to a certain person or a certain date. Baptist is not one of them.

The first Baptist church was started in 1609 in Amsterdam. But it didn’t become popular until the 1730s in America.

While looking it up, I looked at origin dates for some other religions as well, dates are approximate.

Timeline of some major religions

Before 60,000 BC, Witchcraft / Ghosts / Werewolf / Monsters / Teleportation
3,100 BC or before, Pantheism / Norse / Egyptian / Greek / Roman
C 2,000 BC, Hindu / Astrology
1,000 BC, Judaism
Before 550 BC, Zoroastrian
570 BC, Confuscius
C 550 BC, Jain
C 350 BC, Buddhist
C 350 BC, Tao
325 AD, Roman Catholic
610 AD, Islam / Sunni / Sufi / Shia
C 800 AD, Zen
988 AD, Eastern Orthodox
1490, Sikh
1534, Church of England
1609, Baptist (became popular in the 1730s)
1707, Presbyterian
1781, Druidism
1791, Methodist
1830, Latter Day Saints
1844, Bahai
1855, Churches of Christ in Australia
1884, Jehovas Witness
1895, SciFi / Aliens / FTL / Telepathy / Time travel
1950, Scientology
1965, Hare Krishna
1965, Eckankar
1967, Hippie / Anti-Western / New Age / Environmentalism / Vegan / Apocalypse coming
!998 PeterT Ministries.

1995 we created the church of the sixth genesis.

mollwollfumble said:

I was asked today when the Baptist religion began, I didn’t know, and neither did the Christians I was with. So I looked it up.

It’s quite interesting really. Many other religions you can pin down to a certain person or a certain date. Baptist is not one of them.

The first Baptist church was started in 1609 in Amsterdam. But it didn’t become popular until the 1730s in America.

While looking it up, I looked at origin dates for some other religions as well, dates are approximate.

Timeline of some major religions

Before 60,000 BC, Witchcraft / Ghosts / Werewolf / Monsters / Teleportation
3,100 BC or before, Pantheism / Norse / Egyptian / Greek / Roman
C 2,000 BC, Hindu / Astrology
1,000 BC, Judaism
Before 550 BC, Zoroastrian
570 BC, Confuscius
C 550 BC, Jain
C 350 BC, Buddhist
C 350 BC, Tao
325 AD, Roman Catholic
610 AD, Islam / Sunni / Sufi / Shia
C 800 AD, Zen
988 AD, Eastern Orthodox
1490, Sikh
1534, Church of England
1609, Baptist (became popular in the 1730s)
1707, Presbyterian
1781, Druidism
1791, Methodist
1830, Latter Day Saints
1844, Bahai
1855, Churches of Christ in Australia
1884, Jehovas Witness
1895, SciFi / Aliens / FTL / Telepathy / Time travel
1950, Scientology
1965, Hare Krishna
1965, Eckankar
1967, Hippie / Anti-Western / New Age / Environmentalism / Vegan / Apocalypse coming

Environmentalism isn’t religion, it’s engineering.

Veganism isn’t religion either, it’s just an extreme version of applied ethics.

And surely apocalypse coming started way before 1967.

The Rev Dodgson said:

mollwollfumble said:

I was asked today when the Baptist religion began, I didn’t know, and neither did the Christians I was with. So I looked it up.

It’s quite interesting really. Many other religions you can pin down to a certain person or a certain date. Baptist is not one of them.

The first Baptist church was started in 1609 in Amsterdam. But it didn’t become popular until the 1730s in America.

While looking it up, I looked at origin dates for some other religions as well, dates are approximate.

Timeline of some major religions

Before 60,000 BC, Witchcraft / Ghosts / Werewolf / Monsters / Teleportation
3,100 BC or before, Pantheism / Norse / Egyptian / Greek / Roman
C 2,000 BC, Hindu / Astrology
1,000 BC, Judaism
Before 550 BC, Zoroastrian
570 BC, Confuscius
C 550 BC, Jain
C 350 BC, Buddhist
C 350 BC, Tao
325 AD, Roman Catholic
610 AD, Islam / Sunni / Sufi / Shia
C 800 AD, Zen
988 AD, Eastern Orthodox
1490, Sikh
1534, Church of England
1609, Baptist (became popular in the 1730s)
1707, Presbyterian
1781, Druidism
1791, Methodist
1830, Latter Day Saints
1844, Bahai
1855, Churches of Christ in Australia
1884, Jehovas Witness
1895, SciFi / Aliens / FTL / Telepathy / Time travel
1950, Scientology
1965, Hare Krishna
1965, Eckankar
1967, Hippie / Anti-Western / New Age / Environmentalism / Vegan / Apocalypse coming

Environmentalism isn’t religion, it’s engineering.

Veganism isn’t religion either, it’s just an extreme version of applied ethics.

And surely apocalypse coming started way before 1967.

Is Buddhism a religion even?

ChrispenEvan said:

The Rev Dodgson said:

mollwollfumble said:

I was asked today when the Baptist religion began, I didn’t know, and neither did the Christians I was with. So I looked it up.

It’s quite interesting really. Many other religions you can pin down to a certain person or a certain date. Baptist is not one of them.

The first Baptist church was started in 1609 in Amsterdam. But it didn’t become popular until the 1730s in America.

While looking it up, I looked at origin dates for some other religions as well, dates are approximate.

Timeline of some major religions

Before 60,000 BC, Witchcraft / Ghosts / Werewolf / Monsters / Teleportation
3,100 BC or before, Pantheism / Norse / Egyptian / Greek / Roman
C 2,000 BC, Hindu / Astrology
1,000 BC, Judaism
Before 550 BC, Zoroastrian
570 BC, Confuscius
C 550 BC, Jain
C 350 BC, Buddhist
C 350 BC, Tao
325 AD, Roman Catholic
610 AD, Islam / Sunni / Sufi / Shia
C 800 AD, Zen
988 AD, Eastern Orthodox
1490, Sikh
1534, Church of England
1609, Baptist (became popular in the 1730s)
1707, Presbyterian
1781, Druidism
1791, Methodist
1830, Latter Day Saints
1844, Bahai
1855, Churches of Christ in Australia
1884, Jehovas Witness
1895, SciFi / Aliens / FTL / Telepathy / Time travel
1950, Scientology
1965, Hare Krishna
1965, Eckankar
1967, Hippie / Anti-Western / New Age / Environmentalism / Vegan / Apocalypse coming

Environmentalism isn’t religion, it’s engineering.

Veganism isn’t religion either, it’s just an extreme version of applied ethics.

And surely apocalypse coming started way before 1967.

Is Buddhism a religion even?

From my very limited knowledge of Buddhism I’d say that’s a fair question to which I don’t know the answer.

I reckon you could put all of Christianity down as mere offshoots of Zoroastrianism.

ChrispenEvan said:

The Rev Dodgson said:

mollwollfumble said:

I was asked today when the Baptist religion began, I didn’t know, and neither did the Christians I was with. So I looked it up.

It’s quite interesting really. Many other religions you can pin down to a certain person or a certain date. Baptist is not one of them.

The first Baptist church was started in 1609 in Amsterdam. But it didn’t become popular until the 1730s in America.

While looking it up, I looked at origin dates for some other religions as well, dates are approximate.

Timeline of some major religions

Before 60,000 BC, Witchcraft / Ghosts / Werewolf / Monsters / Teleportation
3,100 BC or before, Pantheism / Norse / Egyptian / Greek / Roman
C 2,000 BC, Hindu / Astrology
1,000 BC, Judaism
Before 550 BC, Zoroastrian
570 BC, Confuscius
C 550 BC, Jain
C 350 BC, Buddhist
C 350 BC, Tao
325 AD, Roman Catholic
610 AD, Islam / Sunni / Sufi / Shia
C 800 AD, Zen
988 AD, Eastern Orthodox
1490, Sikh
1534, Church of England
1609, Baptist (became popular in the 1730s)
1707, Presbyterian
1781, Druidism
1791, Methodist
1830, Latter Day Saints
1844, Bahai
1855, Churches of Christ in Australia
1884, Jehovas Witness
1895, SciFi / Aliens / FTL / Telepathy / Time travel
1950, Scientology
1965, Hare Krishna
1965, Eckankar
1967, Hippie / Anti-Western / New Age / Environmentalism / Vegan / Apocalypse coming

Environmentalism isn’t religion, it’s engineering.

Veganism isn’t religion either, it’s just an extreme version of applied ethics.

And surely apocalypse coming started way before 1967.

Is Buddhism a religion even?

Pretty sure that Buddhists aver that it isn’t a relifion.
Baháʼí Faith is not called a religion, they call it a faith. Though wiki reckins it is a religion. When they were trying to talk me into joining they kept telling me it wa faith rather than a religion. I couldn’t tell the difference.

party_pants said:

I reckon you could put all of Christianity down as mere offshoots of Zoroastrianism.

Having done my own research, it certainly sounds pretty similar to the Old Testament stuff, but did they have a Jesus?

The Rev Dodgson said:

party_pants said:

I reckon you could put all of Christianity down as mere offshoots of Zoroastrianism.

Having done my own research, it certainly sounds pretty similar to the Old Testament stuff, but did they have a Jesus?

No Jesus. That was a Jewish thing: the coming messiah who would defeat Israel’s enemies and set up a new kingdom. Must have been kinda tough mentally to live in between two super empires who both had the benefits of being river based agricultural societies, while you were a minor power reliant upon rainfall agriculture.

The Rev Dodgson said:

mollwollfumble said:

I was asked today when the Baptist religion began, I didn’t know, and neither did the Christians I was with. So I looked it up.

It’s quite interesting really. Many other religions you can pin down to a certain person or a certain date. Baptist is not one of them.

The first Baptist church was started in 1609 in Amsterdam. But it didn’t become popular until the 1730s in America.

While looking it up, I looked at origin dates for some other religions as well, dates are approximate.

Timeline of some major religions

Before 60,000 BC, Witchcraft / Ghosts / Werewolf / Monsters / Teleportation
3,100 BC or before, Pantheism / Norse / Egyptian / Greek / Roman
C 2,000 BC, Hindu / Astrology
1,000 BC, Judaism
Before 550 BC, Zoroastrian
570 BC, Confuscius
C 550 BC, Jain
C 350 BC, Buddhist
C 350 BC, Tao
325 AD, Roman Catholic
610 AD, Islam / Sunni / Sufi / Shia
C 800 AD, Zen
988 AD, Eastern Orthodox
1490, Sikh
1534, Church of England
1609, Baptist (became popular in the 1730s)
1707, Presbyterian
1781, Druidism
1791, Methodist
1830, Latter Day Saints
1844, Bahai
1855, Churches of Christ in Australia
1884, Jehovas Witness
1895, SciFi / Aliens / FTL / Telepathy / Time travel
1950, Scientology
1965, Hare Krishna
1965, Eckankar
1967, Hippie / Anti-Western / New Age / Environmentalism / Vegan / Apocalypse coming

Environmentalism isn’t religion, it’s engineering.

Veganism isn’t religion either, it’s just an extreme version of applied ethics.

And surely apocalypse coming started way before 1967.

>>Environmentalism isn’t religion, it’s engineering<<

An opinion that is probably its problem.

ChrispenEvan said:

The Rev Dodgson said:

mollwollfumble said:

I was asked today when the Baptist religion began, I didn’t know, and neither did the Christians I was with. So I looked it up.

It’s quite interesting really. Many other religions you can pin down to a certain person or a certain date. Baptist is not one of them.

The first Baptist church was started in 1609 in Amsterdam. But it didn’t become popular until the 1730s in America.

While looking it up, I looked at origin dates for some other religions as well, dates are approximate.

Timeline of some major religions

Before 60,000 BC, Witchcraft / Ghosts / Werewolf / Monsters / Teleportation
3,100 BC or before, Pantheism / Norse / Egyptian / Greek / Roman
C 2,000 BC, Hindu / Astrology
1,000 BC, Judaism
Before 550 BC, Zoroastrian
570 BC, Confuscius
C 550 BC, Jain
C 350 BC, Buddhist
C 350 BC, Tao
325 AD, Roman Catholic
610 AD, Islam / Sunni / Sufi / Shia
C 800 AD, Zen
988 AD, Eastern Orthodox
1490, Sikh
1534, Church of England
1609, Baptist (became popular in the 1730s)
1707, Presbyterian
1781, Druidism
1791, Methodist
1830, Latter Day Saints
1844, Bahai
1855, Churches of Christ in Australia
1884, Jehovas Witness
1895, SciFi / Aliens / FTL / Telepathy / Time travel
1950, Scientology
1965, Hare Krishna
1965, Eckankar
1967, Hippie / Anti-Western / New Age / Environmentalism / Vegan / Apocalypse coming

Environmentalism isn’t religion, it’s engineering.

Veganism isn’t religion either, it’s just an extreme version of applied ethics.

And surely apocalypse coming started way before 1967.

Is Buddhism a religion even?

Yes. Yes it is.

Witty Rejoinder said:

ChrispenEvan said:

The Rev Dodgson said:

Environmentalism isn’t religion, it’s engineering.

Veganism isn’t religion either, it’s just an extreme version of applied ethics.

And surely apocalypse coming started way before 1967.

Is Buddhism a religion even?

Yes. Yes it is.

well, there are views that say it isn’t because they have no gods so it is a philosophy.

Scientology is a cult

ChrispenEvan said:

Witty Rejoinder said:

ChrispenEvan said:

Is Buddhism a religion even?

Yes. Yes it is.

well, there are views that say it isn’t because they have no gods so it is a philosophy.

Same could be said of Confucianism and Daoism in their stricted forms. For me Buddhists believing in reincarnation and of striving to attain nirvana in paradise qualifies them as religious believers.

Witty Rejoinder said:

ChrispenEvan said:

Witty Rejoinder said:

Yes. Yes it is.

well, there are views that say it isn’t because they have no gods so it is a philosophy.

Same could be said of Confucianism and Daoism in their stricted forms. For me Buddhists believing in reincarnation and of striving to attain nirvana in paradise qualifies them as religious believers.

there is no “paradise” in buddhism.

Arts said:

Scientology is a cult

^

Arts said:

Scientology is a cult

It is a religious cult. I think religious cults are a subset of religion.

PermeateFree said:

The Rev Dodgson said:

mollwollfumble said:

I was asked today when the Baptist religion began, I didn’t know, and neither did the Christians I was with. So I looked it up.

It’s quite interesting really. Many other religions you can pin down to a certain person or a certain date. Baptist is not one of them.

The first Baptist church was started in 1609 in Amsterdam. But it didn’t become popular until the 1730s in America.

While looking it up, I looked at origin dates for some other religions as well, dates are approximate.

Timeline of some major religions

Before 60,000 BC, Witchcraft / Ghosts / Werewolf / Monsters / Teleportation
3,100 BC or before, Pantheism / Norse / Egyptian / Greek / Roman
C 2,000 BC, Hindu / Astrology
1,000 BC, Judaism
Before 550 BC, Zoroastrian
570 BC, Confuscius
C 550 BC, Jain
C 350 BC, Buddhist
C 350 BC, Tao
325 AD, Roman Catholic
610 AD, Islam / Sunni / Sufi / Shia
C 800 AD, Zen
988 AD, Eastern Orthodox
1490, Sikh
1534, Church of England
1609, Baptist (became popular in the 1730s)
1707, Presbyterian
1781, Druidism
1791, Methodist
1830, Latter Day Saints
1844, Bahai
1855, Churches of Christ in Australia
1884, Jehovas Witness
1895, SciFi / Aliens / FTL / Telepathy / Time travel
1950, Scientology
1965, Hare Krishna
1965, Eckankar
1967, Hippie / Anti-Western / New Age / Environmentalism / Vegan / Apocalypse coming

Environmentalism isn’t religion, it’s engineering.

Veganism isn’t religion either, it’s just an extreme version of applied ethics.

And surely apocalypse coming started way before 1967.

>>Environmentalism isn’t religion, it’s engineering<<

An opinion that is probably its problem.

Its problem is that few people accept that statement, in spite of its obvious truth.

ChrispenEvan said:

Witty Rejoinder said:

ChrispenEvan said:

well, there are views that say it isn’t because they have no gods so it is a philosophy.

Same could be said of Confucianism and Daoism in their stricted forms. For me Buddhists believing in reincarnation and of striving to attain nirvana in paradise qualifies them as religious believers.

there is no “paradise” in buddhism.

Depends on what branch of Buddhism you’re talking about. Mahāyāna Buddhism in its various forms believes in a great many mystical things.

party_pants said:

Arts said:

Scientology is a cult

It is a religious cult. I think religious cults are a subset of religion.

—-

Unfortunately in Australia, the High Court has ruled it is a religion.

19 shillings said:

party_pants said:

Arts said:

Scientology is a cult

It is a religious cult. I think religious cults are a subset of religion.

—-

Unfortunately in Australia, the High Court has ruled it is a religion.

I have no problem with it being called a religion.

The Rev Dodgson said:

PermeateFree said:

The Rev Dodgson said:

Environmentalism isn’t religion, it’s engineering.

Veganism isn’t religion either, it’s just an extreme version of applied ethics.

And surely apocalypse coming started way before 1967.

>>Environmentalism isn’t religion, it’s engineering<<

An opinion that is probably its problem.

Its problem is that few people accept that statement, in spite of its obvious truth.

What truth?

I am surprised that nobody has mentioned economics, it being the biggest religion as most people worship money.

Arts said:

Scientology is a cult

Scientology is a pyramid structure serving itself for no reason other than making money for those, who then prey on others for financial vulnerability using pseudoscience, it is destructive to families.

It needs to be shut down.

As an organisation it is social destructive.

Tau.Neutrino said:

Arts said:

Scientology is a cult

Scientology is a pyramid structure serving itself for no reason other than making money for those, who then prey on others for financial vulnerability using pseudoscience, it is destructive to families.

It needs to be shut down.

As an organisation it is social destructive.

As an organisation, it is socially destructive.

The judgement of why scientology is a religion was one of paying tax..

https://www8.austlii.edu.au/cgi-bin/viewdoc/au/cases/cth/HCA/1983/40.html

Regardless of whether the members of the applicant are gullible or misled or whether the practices of Scientology are harmful or objectionable, the evidence, in our view, establishes that Scientology must, for relevant purposes, be accepted as “a religion” in Victoria. That does not, of course, mean either that the practices of the applicant or its rules are beyond the control of the law of the State or that the applicant or its members are beyond its taxing powers. (at p176)

19 shillings said:

The judgement of why scientology is a religion was one of paying tax..

https://www8.austlii.edu.au/cgi-bin/viewdoc/au/cases/cth/HCA/1983/40.html

Regardless of whether the members of the applicant are gullible or misled or whether the practices of Scientology are harmful or objectionable, the evidence, in our view, establishes that Scientology must, for relevant purposes, be accepted as “a religion” in Victoria. That does not, of course, mean either that the practices of the applicant or its rules are beyond the control of the law of the State or that the applicant or its members are beyond its taxing powers. (at p176)

Scientology must, for relevant purposes, be accepted so that it can make money for people, from financially abusing individual and families using pseudoscience.

Tau.Neutrino said:

19 shillings said:

The judgement of why scientology is a religion was one of paying tax..

https://www8.austlii.edu.au/cgi-bin/viewdoc/au/cases/cth/HCA/1983/40.html

Regardless of whether the members of the applicant are gullible or misled or whether the practices of Scientology are harmful or objectionable, the evidence, in our view, establishes that Scientology must, for relevant purposes, be accepted as “a religion” in Victoria. That does not, of course, mean either that the practices of the applicant or its rules are beyond the control of the law of the State or that the applicant or its members are beyond its taxing powers. (at p176)

Scientology must, for relevant purposes, be accepted so that it can make money for people, from financially abusing individual and families using pseudoscience.

maybe

Scientology as a pyramid cult must, for relevant purposes, be accepted as a religion so that it can make money for people, from financially abusing individuals and families using pseudoscience.

Tau.Neutrino said:

Tau.Neutrino said:

19 shillings said:

The judgement of why scientology is a religion was one of paying tax..

https://www8.austlii.edu.au/cgi-bin/viewdoc/au/cases/cth/HCA/1983/40.html

Regardless of whether the members of the applicant are gullible or misled or whether the practices of Scientology are harmful or objectionable, the evidence, in our view, establishes that Scientology must, for relevant purposes, be accepted as “a religion” in Victoria. That does not, of course, mean either that the practices of the applicant or its rules are beyond the control of the law of the State or that the applicant or its members are beyond its taxing powers. (at p176)

Scientology must, for relevant purposes, be accepted so that it can make money for people, from financially abusing individual and families using pseudoscience.

maybe

Scientology as a pyramid cult must, for relevant purposes, be accepted as a religion so that it can make money for people, from financially abusing individuals and families using pseudoscience.

Is there a list of relevant purposes ?

Tau.Neutrino said:

Tau.Neutrino said:

Tau.Neutrino said:

Scientology must, for relevant purposes, be accepted so that it can make money for people, from financially abusing individual and families using pseudoscience.

maybe

Scientology as a pyramid cult must, for relevant purposes, be accepted as a religion so that it can make money for people, from financially abusing individuals and families using pseudoscience.

Is there a list of relevant purposes ?

Using pseudoscience which damages peoples perception and judgements creating destructive financial behaviour.

Things changed for religion after 1895.

Tau.Neutrino said:

Tau.Neutrino said:

Tau.Neutrino said:

maybe

Scientology as a pyramid cult must, for relevant purposes, be accepted as a religion so that it can make money for people, from financially abusing individuals and families using pseudoscience.

Is there a list of relevant purposes ?

Using pseudoscience which damages peoples perception and judgements creating destructive financial behaviour.

__

Tau, go the link i provided and read the full summary, it’s amazing how our laws work.

mollwollfumble said:

I was asked today when the Baptist religion began, I didn’t know, and neither did the Christians I was with. So I looked it up.

It’s quite interesting really. Many other religions you can pin down to a certain person or a certain date. Baptist is not one of them.

The first Baptist church was started in 1609 in Amsterdam. But it didn’t become popular until the 1730s in America.

While looking it up, I looked at origin dates for some other religions as well, dates are approximate.

Timeline of some major religions

Before 60,000 BC, Witchcraft / Ghosts / Werewolf / Monsters / Teleportation
3,100 BC or before, Pantheism / Norse / Egyptian / Greek / Roman
C 2,000 BC, Hindu / Astrology
1,000 BC, Judaism
Before 550 BC, Zoroastrian
570 BC, Confuscius
C 550 BC, Jain
C 350 BC, Buddhist
C 350 BC, Tao
325 AD, Roman Catholic
610 AD, Islam / Sunni / Sufi / Shia
C 800 AD, Zen
988 AD, Eastern Orthodox
1490, Sikh
1534, Church of England
1609, Baptist (became popular in the 1730s)
1707, Presbyterian
1781, Druidism
1791, Methodist
1830, Latter Day Saints
1844, Bahai
1855, Churches of Christ in Australia
1884, Jehovas Witness
1895, SciFi / Aliens / FTL / Telepathy / Time travel
1950, Scientology
1965, Hare Krishna
1965, Eckankar
1967, Hippie / Anti-Western / New Age / Environmentalism / Vegan / Apocalypse coming

Nutter before 60,000 BC, Witchcraft / Ghosts / Werewolf / Monsters / Teleportation.

Nutters after 1895 AD, SciFi / Aliens / FTL / Telepathy / Time travel Scientology, Hare Krishna, Eckankar, Hippie / Anti-Western / New Age / Environmentalism / Vegan / Apocalypse coming.

Nutters between 3,100 BC and 1884 AD.

Nothings changed.

Still around 74,223,975 Trump voters too.

party_pants said:

Arts said:

Scientology is a cult

It is a religious cult. I think religious cults are a subset of religion.

“Religion” and “cult” are synonyms.

The Rev Dodgson said:

PermeateFree said:

The Rev Dodgson said:

Environmentalism isn’t religion, it’s engineering.

An opinion that is probably its problem.

Its problem is that few people accept that statement, in spite of its obvious truth.

It is simply engineering that seeks to improve life in decades rather than years. Most people can’t see that far.

becklefreckle said:

party_pants said:

Arts said:

Scientology is a cult

It is a religious cult. I think religious cults are a subset of religion.

“Religion” and “cult” are synonyms.

An opinion that is probably its problem.

Its problem is that few people accept that statement, in spite of its obvious truth.

It is simply engineering that seeks to improve life in decades rather than years. Most people can’t see that far.

Engineering is planned and implemented. That is not how nature and the environment work.

19 shillings said:

Tau.Neutrino said:

Tau.Neutrino said:

Is there a list of relevant purposes ?

Using pseudoscience which damages peoples perception and judgements creating destructive financial behaviour.

__

Tau, go the link i provided and read the full summary, it’s amazing how our laws work.

50 judgments were delivered the went on to financially abuse thousands of individual and families.

50 judgments that lead to social damage.

What sort of people do that to others ?

PermeateFree said:

becklefreckle said:

party_pants said:

Its problem is that few people accept that statement, in spite of its obvious truth.

It is simply engineering that seeks to improve life in decades rather than years. Most people can’t see that far.

Engineering is planned and implemented. That is not how nature and the environment work.

Must have placed my reply in the wrong place to make it flow with another poster. My comment is the single last line.

Tau.Neutrino said:

19 shillings said:

Tau.Neutrino said:

Using pseudoscience which damages peoples perception and judgements creating destructive financial behaviour.

__

Tau, go the link i provided and read the full summary, it’s amazing how our laws work.

50 judgments were delivered the went on to financially abuse thousands of individual and families.

50 judgments that lead to social damage.

What sort of people do that to others ?

Scientology = pseudo-tology

I see Scientology as a destructive cult.

IMO, Scientology should be listed a threat.

PermeateFree said:

becklefreckle said:

It is simply engineering that seeks to improve life in decades rather than years. Most people can’t see that far.

Engineering is planned and implemented. That is not how nature and the environment work.

But we’re talking about the human endeavour of environmentalism. That looks to help nature but is not the same as it.

Tau.Neutrino said:

I see Scientology as a destructive cult.

IMO, Scientology should be listed a threat.

Well, you know… judaism, christianity and islam aren’t exactly benign either.

Tau.Neutrino said:

I see Scientology as a destructive cult.

IMO, Scientology should be listed a threat.

Without the cult/religion shield -

Scientology is a pyramid running a scam to con people.

becklefreckle said:

Tau.Neutrino said:

I see Scientology as a destructive cult.

IMO, Scientology should be listed a threat.

Well, you know… judaism, christianity and islam aren’t exactly benign either.

Nutters abound throughout history.

becklefreckle said:

PermeateFree said:

becklefreckle said:

It is simply engineering that seeks to improve life in decades rather than years. Most people can’t see that far.

Engineering is planned and implemented. That is not how nature and the environment work.

But we’re talking about the human endeavour of environmentalism. That looks to help nature but is not the same as it.

Humans helping nature is a very interesting concept I have never seriously considered. Probably because the results are so very much against such a relationship realistically occurring.

Trump has as cult as 74,223,975 followers.

That’s an extraordinary number of nutters following someone really unstable.

mollwollfumble said:

I was asked today when the Baptist religion began, I didn’t know, and neither did the Christians I was with. So I looked it up.

It’s quite interesting really. Many other religions you can pin down to a certain person or a certain date. Baptist is not one of them.

The first Baptist church was started in 1609 in Amsterdam. But it didn’t become popular until the 1730s in America.

While looking it up, I looked at origin dates for some other religions as well, dates are approximate.

Timeline of some major religions

Before 60,000 BC, Witchcraft / Ghosts / Werewolf / Monsters / Teleportation
3,100 BC or before, Pantheism / Norse / Egyptian / Greek / Roman
C 2,000 BC, Hindu / Astrology
1,000 BC, Judaism
Before 550 BC, Zoroastrian
570 BC, Confuscius
C 550 BC, Jain
C 350 BC, Buddhist
C 350 BC, Tao
325 AD, Roman Catholic
610 AD, Islam / Sunni / Sufi / Shia
C 800 AD, Zen
988 AD, Eastern Orthodox
1490, Sikh
1534, Church of England
1609, Baptist (became popular in the 1730s)
1707, Presbyterian
1781, Druidism
1791, Methodist
1830, Latter Day Saints
1844, Bahai
1855, Churches of Christ in Australia
1884, Jehovas Witness
1895, SciFi / Aliens / FTL / Telepathy / Time travel
1950, Scientology
1965, Hare Krishna
1965, Eckankar
1967, Hippie / Anti-Western / New Age / Environmentalism / Vegan / Apocalypse coming

Your list has God prevalent between 3,100 BC and 1884 AD and instability before and after those dates.

sarahs mum said:

Arts said:

Scientology is a cult

^

It really can’t be called anything else.

PermeateFree said:

I am surprised that nobody has mentioned economics, it being the biggest religion as most people worship money.

Well people revere the motor car and build great monuments to it.

becklefreckle said:

party_pants said:

Arts said:

Scientology is a cult

It is a religious cult. I think religious cults are a subset of religion.

“Religion” and “cult” are synonyms.

An opinion that is probably its problem.

Its problem is that few people accept that statement, in spite of its obvious truth.

It is simply engineering that seeks to improve life in decades rather than years. Most people can’t see that far.

Exactly.

The definition of engineering is the use of natural resources to improve the quality of lifes of humanity.

Humanity obviously includes future generations, so by definition engineering is environmentalism.

party_pants said:

I reckon you could put all of Christianity down as mere offshoots of Zoroastrianism.

I think the three wise men were purported to be followers of Zoro

becklefreckle said:

party_pants said:

Arts said:

Scientology is a cult

It is a religious cult. I think religious cults are a subset of religion.

“Religion” and “cult” are synonyms.

An opinion that is probably its problem.

I disagree… there are cults that don’t involve theism .. a cult is something that has a financial burden to enter and stay, a sense of permanency (where leaving becomes difficult due to social pressure and financial inability), and a sense of secrecy within it. Now while some religions might cover some of these aspects.. a cult is far more collective and restrictive and doesn’t have layers of acceptance – you are either in or out.

The Rev Dodgson said:

becklefreckle said:

party_pants said:

Its problem is that few people accept that statement, in spite of its obvious truth.

It is simply engineering that seeks to improve life in decades rather than years. Most people can’t see that far.

Exactly.

The definition of engineering is the use of natural resources to improve the quality of lifes of humanity.

Humanity obviously includes future generations, so by definition engineering is environmentalism.

With that definition, just what doesn’t engineering cover? The obvious truth from an engineer. LOL

>> 1781, Druidism

> I thought Druids were around longer than that.

The word “Druid” as a name for a Celtic priest has been around since the start of the Celts. But since there is no information on what they believed, and it died out 100%, we can only date modern Druids from the revival, which started in 1781.

> Environmentalism isn’t religion, it’s engineering.

Yeah, I’ll have to rethink that. There was no one single source for environmentalism, and no definitive religious canon. I’ll think about it and get back to you.

> Veganism isn’t religion either, it’s just an extreme version of applied ethics.

Veganism is straight from the Indian religion of Jain, which is very ancient.

> And surely apocalypse coming started way before 1967.

Did I say that, sorry. One of these days I want to sort apocalypses by date.

> I reckon you could put all of Christianity down as mere offshoots of Zoroastrianism.

LOL. That’s a viewpoint I haven’t seen before. There are connections. Elijah used tools from the religion of Zoroastrianism to arrange the murder the priests of Baal. The gifts given to Jesus from the Magi are straight out of Zoroastrian religion. And I have heard unsubstantiated rumours that Jesus visited the Zoroastrians before beginning his ministry.

> Same could be said of Confucianism and Daoism in their stricted forms.

Yes. Neither of those have any Gods. Furthermore, neither have any supernatural component. Buddhism has the supernatural component of reincarnation.

> “Religion” and “cult” are synonyms.

I’ve used that synonym in creating the list. Much of the information comes from the book “Larson’s new book of cults” in my home library. https://www.amazon.com.au/Larsons-New-Book-Cults-Larson/dp/0842328602 I’m also equating “religion” and “sect”, just for purposes of comparison. So for instance Larson includes Mormon and Bahai as cults along with Witchcraft, Hare Krishna, Eckankar and Scientology.

mollwollfumble said:

> “Religion” and “cult” are synonyms.

I’ve used that synonym in creating the list. Much of the information comes from the book “Larson’s new book of cults” in my home library. https://www.amazon.com.au/Larsons-New-Book-Cults-Larson/dp/0842328602 I’m also equating “religion” and “sect”, just for purposes of comparison. So for instance Larson includes Mormon and Bahai as cults along with Witchcraft, Hare Krishna, Eckankar and Scientology.

Ahhhh, Bob Larson. How much do you know about Larson, mollwollfumble?

ruby said:

mollwollfumble said:

> “Religion” and “cult” are synonyms.

I’ve used that synonym in creating the list. Much of the information comes from the book “Larson’s new book of cults” in my home library. https://www.amazon.com.au/Larsons-New-Book-Cults-Larson/dp/0842328602 I’m also equating “religion” and “sect”, just for purposes of comparison. So for instance Larson includes Mormon and Bahai as cults along with Witchcraft, Hare Krishna, Eckankar and Scientology.

Ahhhh, Bob Larson. How much do you know about Larson, mollwollfumble?

Don’t know about moll, but now I have done my own research, and here are 50% of the things I know about Bob Larson:

Larson has authored numerous books critical of rock music and Satanism.

ruby said:

mollwollfumble said:

> “Religion” and “cult” are synonyms.

I’ve used that synonym in creating the list. Much of the information comes from the book “Larson’s new book of cults” in my home library. https://www.amazon.com.au/Larsons-New-Book-Cults-Larson/dp/0842328602 I’m also equating “religion” and “sect”, just for purposes of comparison. So for instance Larson includes Mormon and Bahai as cults along with Witchcraft, Hare Krishna, Eckankar and Scientology.

Ahhhh, Bob Larson. How much do you know about Larson, mollwollfumble?

Was he the chap that wrote “far side” cartoons? Just kidding, I don’t know anything about Larson. I don’t care. It’s a great book, heavily tongue in cheek, extremely informative.

It’s hard to pin down a timeline for environmentalism. It evolved rather than was created. A brainstorming mind map for Environmentalism comes up with:

Where did “Environmentalism” come from?

Luddite – anti-industry – anti-corporate
Hindu – Jain – Hippie – counter-culture
Great strink – river fire – pollution controls 1970 – Minamata – Love canal – Torrey canyon
Exponential curve – population explosion – Malthus – Club of Rome
Sustainability – permaculture
Bushwalkers lobby group – anti-dams – anti-bushfire-reduction – anti-mining
Smog – photochemical smog – leaded petrol – acid rain
Anti-logging
WWI chemical warfare – anti-chemicals – chemtrails
Six pack holders – anti-plastic
Anti-nuclear-weapons – anti-nuclear-waste – Three mile island – Chernobyl – Fukushima
Daoism – anti-change
Sea level rise – Al Gore’s “collapse” and “refugees” – tipping point
Ozone hole
Great Pacific garbage patch
The J curve – the IPCC – carbon dioxide – anti-coal
Worship of deity Nature
Greenpeace losing it’s “peace” to give us “green”
Garden of Eden – belief in a perfect pre-industrial world
Belief in the existence of an extinction domino effect
Biblical apocalypse – we live in the end times

The Rev Dodgson said:

ruby said:

mollwollfumble said:

> “Religion” and “cult” are synonyms.

I’ve used that synonym in creating the list. Much of the information comes from the book “Larson’s new book of cults” in my home library. https://www.amazon.com.au/Larsons-New-Book-Cults-Larson/dp/0842328602 I’m also equating “religion” and “sect”, just for purposes of comparison. So for instance Larson includes Mormon and Bahai as cults along with Witchcraft, Hare Krishna, Eckankar and Scientology.

Ahhhh, Bob Larson. How much do you know about Larson, mollwollfumble?

Don’t know about moll, but now I have done my own research, and here are 50% of the things I know about Bob Larson:

Larson has authored numerous books critical of rock music and Satanism.

Yes. Looking into Bob Larson was interesting. Some of the things I learnt…tele evangelist, believes in demonic possession, didn’t think exorcism should be something that people pay money for, but now asks for money for his exorcisms. He has a website……

mollwollfumble said:

ruby said:

mollwollfumble said:

> “Religion” and “cult” are synonyms.

I’ve used that synonym in creating the list. Much of the information comes from the book “Larson’s new book of cults” in my home library. https://www.amazon.com.au/Larsons-New-Book-Cults-Larson/dp/0842328602 I’m also equating “religion” and “sect”, just for purposes of comparison. So for instance Larson includes Mormon and Bahai as cults along with Witchcraft, Hare Krishna, Eckankar and Scientology.

Ahhhh, Bob Larson. How much do you know about Larson, mollwollfumble?

Was he the chap that wrote “far side” cartoons? Just kidding, I don’t know anything about Larson. I don’t care. It’s a great book, heavily tongue in cheek, extremely informative.

No, the cartoonist is Gary Larson.

(I’m pretty sure I have dementia. The rate at which my mental facilities are declining is frightening. Anyhow …)

Checking Google science search for papers related to protection of the environment.
No science articles before 1970.

1968 – The book “The population bomb” is published
1970 – USA developed an “environmental policy”
1971 – First mention of “protection of the environment”
1972 – “Methods to expedite environment protection: International ecostandards”
1973 – The Stockholm declaration on “preservation and enhancement of the environment”
1973 – “The premise that man resides within a bounded and closed natural environment”
1973 – “Persistent pesticides in the environment”
1974 – “Biological cycles for toxic elements in the environment”
1975 – predicted destruction of atmospheric ozone by CFCs released into the environment

All this is pure science or politics. There was no religious content of environmental preservation in these early days.

mollwollfumble said:

(I’m pretty sure I have dementia. The rate at which my mental facilities are declining is frightening. Anyhow …)

Checking Google science search for papers related to protection of the environment.
No science articles before 1970.

1968 – The book “The population bomb” is published
1970 – USA developed an “environmental policy”
1971 – First mention of “protection of the environment”
1972 – “Methods to expedite environment protection: International ecostandards”
1973 – The Stockholm declaration on “preservation and enhancement of the environment”
1973 – “The premise that man resides within a bounded and closed natural environment”
1973 – “Persistent pesticides in the environment”
1974 – “Biological cycles for toxic elements in the environment”
1975 – predicted destruction of atmospheric ozone by CFCs released into the environment

All this is pure science or politics. There was no religious content of environmental preservation in these early days.

Hmm. I would have thought that Silent Spring should possibly have been mentioned because basically before that the only environmental acting organisations were those which caused the origin of the National Parks. Which at first were wilderness parks.

Though such things were originally reserves and later wilderness parks from as early as 1776, it wasn’t until 1969 that the IUCN declared a national park to be a relatively large area with the following defining characteristics:

One or several ecosystems not materially altered by human exploitation and occupation, where plant and animal species, geomorphological sites and habitats are of special scientific, educational, and recreational interest or which contain a natural landscape of great beauty; Highest competent authority of the country has taken steps to prevent or eliminate exploitation or occupation as soon as possible in the whole area and to effectively enforce the respect of ecological, geomorphological, or aesthetic features which have led to its establishment; and Visitors are allowed to enter, under special conditions, for inspirational, educative, cultural, and recreative purposes.

In 1971, these criteria were further expanded upon leading to more clear and defined benchmarks to evaluate a national park. These include:

Minimum size of 1,000 hectares within zones in which protection of nature takes precedence Statutory legal protection Budget and staff sufficient to provide sufficient effective protection Prohibition of exploitation of natural resources (including the development of dams) qualified by such activities as sport, hunting, fishing, the need for management, facilities, etc.

Then the the 1964 Wilderness Act.

roughbarked said:

Then the the 1964 Wilderness Act.

I missed that. What was that about? (Checks web)
“1964, it created the National Wilderness Preservation System. The initial statutory wilderness areas comprised 9.1 million acres (37,000 km²) of national forest wilderness areas in the United States of America previously protected by administrative orders. The current amount of areas designated by the NWPS as wilderness totals 757 areas encompassing 109.5 million acres of federally owned land in 44 states and Puerto Rico. … The Wilderness Act allows certain uses that existed before the land became wilderness may continue to take place although the area that was designated as wilderness typically would not allow new examples of such uses. Specifically, mining, grazing, water uses, or any other uses that do not significantly impact the majority of the area may remain.”

So. No dams?

————

I’m just going to drop this chart in here. Search terms related to environmentalism from 2004 to 2023.

Interest in Logging, for example, has dropped off.
Interest in Permaculture has held steady.
Interest in Microplastics has boomed.