Could the universe be both?

Sometimes the universe feels non determined.

Sometimes it feels predetermined.

If it were both, how would that work?

It’s clearly both, in that the information required for many vast chains of complex determined events doesn’t come into being until the universe itself becomes sufficiently complex.

Tau.Neutrino said:

Could the universe be both?

Sometimes the universe feels non determined.

Sometimes it feels predetermined.

If it were both, how would that work?

How does it “feel” one way or the other?

And how could we possibly know?

But I don’t think predetermined works according to conventional science.

Bubblecar said:

It’s clearly both, in that the information required for many vast chains of complex determined events doesn’t come into being until the universe itself becomes sufficiently complex.

What are these “determined” events of which you speak?

The Rev Dodgson said:

Bubblecar said:

It’s clearly both, in that the information required for many vast chains of complex determined events doesn’t come into being until the universe itself becomes sufficiently complex.

What are these “determined” events of which you speak?

Fings what ‘appen as a consequence of uvver fings ‘appening, guv.

The Rev Dodgson said:

Tau.Neutrino said:

Could the universe be both?

Sometimes the universe feels non determined.

Sometimes it feels predetermined.

If it were both, how would that work?

How does it “feel” one way or the other?

And how could we possibly know?

But I don’t think predetermined works according to conventional science.

Imagine a missiles trajectory, atomic particles change position each moment in time, the missile is affected by time and space and others particles around it.

Imagine driving a car through each moment in time.

A random universe is impossible.

Tau.Neutrino said:

The Rev Dodgson said:

Tau.Neutrino said:

Could the universe be both?

Sometimes the universe feels non determined.

Sometimes it feels predetermined.

If it were both, how would that work?

How does it “feel” one way or the other?

And how could we possibly know?

But I don’t think predetermined works according to conventional science.

Imagine a missiles trajectory, atomic particles change position each moment in time, the missile is affected by time and space and others particles around it.

Imagine driving a car through each moment in time.

A random universe is impossible.

In a way we are connected to the rest of the universe because we are within it existing as particles moving through other particles.

Bubblecar said:

The Rev Dodgson said:

Bubblecar said:

It’s clearly both, in that the information required for many vast chains of complex determined events doesn’t come into being until the universe itself becomes sufficiently complex.

What are these “determined” events of which you speak?

Fings what ‘appen as a consequence of uvver fings ‘appening, guv.

Like life is what goes on while you are thinking of other things?

The Rev Dodgson said:

Tau.Neutrino said:

Could the universe be both?

Sometimes the universe feels non determined.

Sometimes it feels predetermined.

If it were both, how would that work?

How does it “feel” one way or the other?

And how could we possibly know?

But I don’t think predetermined works according to conventional science.

Every atomic particle in the universe is gravitationally bound to every other atomic particle in the universe.
Therefore the past is also bound to the future.

All three, space, time and particles are each bound to each other.

Tau.Neutrino said:

The Rev Dodgson said:

Tau.Neutrino said:

Could the universe be both?

Sometimes the universe feels non determined.

Sometimes it feels predetermined.

If it were both, how would that work?

How does it “feel” one way or the other?

And how could we possibly know?

But I don’t think predetermined works according to conventional science.

Every atomic particle in the universe is gravitationally bound to every other atomic particle in the universe.
Therefore the past is also bound to the future.

All three, space, time and particles are each bound to each other.

Try explaining that to those who think they are individuals.

Tau.Neutrino said:

The Rev Dodgson said:

Tau.Neutrino said:

Could the universe be both?

Sometimes the universe feels non determined.

Sometimes it feels predetermined.

If it were both, how would that work?

How does it “feel” one way or the other?

And how could we possibly know?

But I don’t think predetermined works according to conventional science.

Every atomic particle in the universe is gravitationally bound to every other atomic particle in the universe.
Therefore the past is also bound to the future.

All three, space, time and particles are each bound to each other.

The more information you have, the more you know about how to make predictions, like the weather or how a galaxy rotates in relation to other galaxies also rotating around it.

In space, virtual particles popping in and out of existence are also gravitationally bound to what are around them.

roughbarked said:

Tau.Neutrino said:

The Rev Dodgson said:

How does it “feel” one way or the other?

And how could we possibly know?

But I don’t think predetermined works according to conventional science.

Every atomic particle in the universe is gravitationally bound to every other atomic particle in the universe.
Therefore the past is also bound to the future.

All three, space, time and particles are each bound to each other.

Try explaining that to those who think they are individuals.

Every one on the planet is more connected to space time than what they think.

Some might get a real shock.

Every atomic particle in their body is connected to every other atomic particle by being gravitationally bound and also electromagnetically / electrochemicaly bound.

Tau.Neutrino said:

roughbarked said:

Tau.Neutrino said:

Every atomic particle in the universe is gravitationally bound to every other atomic particle in the universe.
Therefore the past is also bound to the future.

All three, space, time and particles are each bound to each other.

Try explaining that to those who think they are individuals.

Every one on the planet is more connected to space time than what they think.

Some might get a real shock.

Every atomic particle in their body is connected to every other atomic particle by being gravitationally bound and also electromagnetically / electrochemicaly bound.

Those that detach from nature are foolish.

I wonder about the amount of information required for each order of scale.

I wonder about the reasons why many people disconnect from nature.

Tau.Neutrino said:

I wonder about the reasons why many people disconnect from nature.

Are you back on the pot?

Tau.Neutrino said:

I wonder about the reasons why many people disconnect from nature.

Possession.
Nature isn’t why we are here. It is a possession for us to take from and use as we see fit. God told us we could.

Witty Rejoinder said:

Tau.Neutrino said:

I wonder about the reasons why many people disconnect from nature.

Are you back on the pot?

In alternate universes I smoke less and in others I smoke more, yet in other alternative universes I smoke nothing.

Tau.Neutrino said:

Witty Rejoinder said:

Tau.Neutrino said:

I wonder about the reasons why many people disconnect from nature.

Are you back on the pot?

In alternate universes I smoke less and in others I smoke more, yet in other alternative universes I smoke nothing.

Didn’t you get a prescription?

roughbarked said:

Tau.Neutrino said:

I wonder about the reasons why many people disconnect from nature.

Possession.
Nature isn’t why we are here. It is a possession for us to take from and use as we see fit. God told us we could.

If there weren’t pyramid robberies then The Great Pyramid of Giza
the tomb of pharaoh Khufu would still have all of his possessions in it, 4593 years later.

Thus proving that you can’t take your possessions with you.

Tau.Neutrino said:

roughbarked said:

Tau.Neutrino said:

I wonder about the reasons why many people disconnect from nature.

Possession.
Nature isn’t why we are here. It is a possession for us to take from and use as we see fit. God told us we could.

If there weren’t pyramid robberies then The Great Pyramid of Giza
the tomb of pharaoh Khufu would still have all of his possessions in it, 4593 years later.

Thus proving that you can’t take your possessions with you.

They are still waiting like Khufu is.

roughbarked said:

Tau.Neutrino said:

Witty Rejoinder said:

Are you back on the pot?

In alternate universes I smoke less and in others I smoke more, yet in other alternative universes I smoke nothing.

Didn’t you get a prescription?

In some universes, I can get a prescription.

In others, it’s off the shelf, you don’t have to wait in a queue to get a prescription.

Tau.Neutrino said:

roughbarked said:

Tau.Neutrino said:

In alternate universes I smoke less and in others I smoke more, yet in other alternative universes I smoke nothing.

Didn’t you get a prescription?

In some universes, I can get a prescription.

In others, it’s off the shelf, you don’t have to wait in a queue to get a prescription.

Strange how people can’t get it off the shelf for themselves, strange that.

Tau.Neutrino said:

roughbarked said:

Tau.Neutrino said:

I wonder about the reasons why many people disconnect from nature.

Possession.
Nature isn’t why we are here. It is a possession for us to take from and use as we see fit. God told us we could.

If there weren’t pyramid robberies then The Great Pyramid of Giza
the tomb of pharaoh Khufu would still have all of his possessions in it, 4593 years later.

Thus proving that you can’t take your possessions with you.

There’s no towbar on the hearse but that isn’t what captivates people. It is more about gathering as much as you can into your coffers and WGAF about who is suffering to make you ever more comfortable with tissue pillows?

roughbarked said:

Tau.Neutrino said:

roughbarked said:

Possession.
Nature isn’t why we are here. It is a possession for us to take from and use as we see fit. God told us we could.

If there weren’t pyramid robberies then The Great Pyramid of Giza
the tomb of pharaoh Khufu would still have all of his possessions in it, 4593 years later.

Thus proving that you can’t take your possessions with you.

There’s no towbar on the hearse but that isn’t what captivates people. It is more about gathering as much as you can into your coffers and WGAF about who is suffering to make you ever more comfortable with tissue pillows?

there’s only one destination in the final taxi!

Tau.Neutrino said:

Tau.Neutrino said:

roughbarked said:

Didn’t you get a prescription?

In some universes, I can get a prescription.

In others, it’s off the shelf, you don’t have to wait in a queue to get a prescription.

Strange how people can’t get it off the shelf for themselves, strange that.

A friend asked me, why do you want a prescription now after more than half a century of not bothering?
What I see as the problem is this.
These days, a legitimate user needs to have a prescription to pass the roadside test, er; after parliament gets off their arse and allows this to go through.
If you are legitimately using it for pain then you do need a prescription.
Because one day sooner or later a roadside test could put one into serious trouble.

> Could the universe be both?

> Sometimes the universe feels non determined.

Quantum mechanics

> Sometimes it feels predetermined.

General relativity

> If it were both, how would that work?

Unification of Quantum mechanics and General relativity.

Next question.