Date: 30/05/2024 15:22:23
From: Tau.Neutrino
ID: 2159730
Subject: A Passive Heating System.

I have this simple idea for a passive heating system.

It would only work in sunlight, so a sunny day would be ideal.

It would (hopefully) warm up a small room or a caravan.

The system would comprise 4 glass panels or more, arranged in a layer, each panel measures 2 meters by 2 meters or more, each panel separated by 20cm or so. A solar powered fan would push the heated air out from the glass layers into a tube and into the caravan or small room.

The glass panels could be any size, with any number of layers. The very bottom panel could be a metal heat bank.

Thoughts?

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Date: 30/05/2024 15:31:03
From: Bubblecar
ID: 2159737
Subject: re: A Passive Heating System.

Draw us a diagram so we have a clearer idea of what you propose.

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Date: 30/05/2024 15:31:30
From: fsm
ID: 2159738
Subject: re: A Passive Heating System.

Get a solar-powered split system air conditioner. Then you can be cool in the summer and warm in the winter.

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Date: 30/05/2024 15:38:17
From: Tau.Neutrino
ID: 2159741
Subject: re: A Passive Heating System.

fsm said:


Get a solar-powered split system air conditioner. Then you can be cool in the summer and warm in the winter.

Ok, I didn’t realise they made them, jolly good.

https://www.ecoworld.com.au/product-page/solar-hybrid-air-conditioner-with-solar-panel-kit

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Date: 30/05/2024 15:41:18
From: Tau.Neutrino
ID: 2159742
Subject: re: A Passive Heating System.

Bubblecar said:


Draw us a diagram so we have a clearer idea of what you propose.

You can imagine 4 glass windows sandwiched together each separated by an air layer, facing the sun.

That’s all it is, with a solar powered fan pushing the warm air out.

Simple.

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Date: 30/05/2024 15:47:37
From: Tau.Neutrino
ID: 2159745
Subject: re: A Passive Heating System.

Tau.Neutrino said:


Bubblecar said:

Draw us a diagram so we have a clearer idea of what you propose.

You can imagine 4 glass windows sandwiched together each separated by an air layer, facing the sun.

That’s all it is, with a solar powered fan pushing the warm air out.

Simple.

But it won’t work on very cloudy days or rainy days or night time.

Only when it’s sunny or a hazy day.

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Date: 30/05/2024 15:50:40
From: Tau.Neutrino
ID: 2159746
Subject: re: A Passive Heating System.

I wonder if a combined passive heating system and glass house would work?

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Date: 30/05/2024 16:49:42
From: The Rev Dodgson
ID: 2159759
Subject: re: A Passive Heating System.

Tau.Neutrino said:


Tau.Neutrino said:

Bubblecar said:

Draw us a diagram so we have a clearer idea of what you propose.

You can imagine 4 glass windows sandwiched together each separated by an air layer, facing the sun.

That’s all it is, with a solar powered fan pushing the warm air out.

Simple.

But it won’t work on very cloudy days or rainy days or night time.

Only when it’s sunny or a hazy day.

The trouble is, glass and air being transparent absorb very little electromagnetic radiation.

OTOH you could certainly put a black metal sheet with black pipes running through it up on the roof, and transfer the heat captured by the metal into the water.

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Date: 30/05/2024 17:38:25
From: Dark Orange
ID: 2159765
Subject: re: A Passive Heating System.

Wouldn’t the inclusion of a fan negate the “Passive” nature?

Two simple means of decreasing cost and increasing efficiency:

Use a single layer of glass enclosing a cavity with black poly-pipe. Sunlight heats up the pipe, and the glass helps insulates it from the cold external air. Air is pushed through the pipe.

Replace the air with water (much greater thermal capacity) and pump it to a radiator that has a fan blowing through it. This allows the water to be a closed system and will be probably be more efficient.

You could also make the primary solar heat exchanger out of an old solar water heater :)

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Date: 30/05/2024 18:48:15
From: party_pants
ID: 2159803
Subject: re: A Passive Heating System.

Dark Orange said:

Wouldn’t the inclusion of a fan negate the “Passive” nature?

Two simple means of decreasing cost and increasing efficiency:

Use a single layer of glass enclosing a cavity with black poly-pipe. Sunlight heats up the pipe, and the glass helps insulates it from the cold external air. Air is pushed through the pipe.

Replace the air with water (much greater thermal capacity) and pump it to a radiator that has a fan blowing through it. This allows the water to be a closed system and will be probably be more efficient.

You could also make the primary solar heat exchanger out of an old solar water heater :)

Step 2 – replace water with palm oil or something like that. Water freezes at 0C, palm oil around -30C. You don’t want water freezing and bursting pipes.

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Date: 30/05/2024 19:17:52
From: SCIENCE
ID: 2159816
Subject: re: A Passive Heating System.

Before the development of greenhouses, agricultural practices were constrained to weather conditions. According to the climatic zone of communities, people were limited to a select range of species and time of the year in which they could grow plants. Yet around 30 CE, the Roman Empire built the first recorded attempt of an artificial environment. Due to emperor Tiberius’s declining health, the royal physicians recommended that the emperor eat one cucumber a day. Cucumbers, however, are quite tender plants and do not grow easily year-round. Therefore, the Romans designed an artificial environment, like a greenhouse, to have cucumbers available for the emperor all year. Cucumbers were planted in wheeled carts which were put in the sun daily, then taken inside to keep them warm at night. The cucumbers were stored under frames or in cucumber houses glazed with either oiled cloth known as specularia or with sheets of selenite (a.k.a. lapis specularis), according to the description by Pliny the Elder.

The next biggest breakthrough in greenhouse design came from Korea in the 15th century during the Joseon dynasty. In the 1450s, Soon ui Jeon described the first artificially heated greenhouse in his manuscript called Sangayorok. Soon ui Jeon was a physician to the royal family, and Sangayorok was intended to provide the nobility with important agricultural and housekeeping knowledge. Within the section of agricultural techniques, Soon ui Jeon wrote how to build a greenhouse that was able to cultivate vegetables and other plants in the winter. The Korean design adds an ondol system to the structure. An ondol is a Korean heating system used in domestic spaces, which runs a flue pipe from a heat source underneath the flooring. In addition to the ondol, a cauldron filled with water was also heated to create steam and increase the temperature and humidity in the greenhouse. These Korean greenhouses were the first active greenhouses that controlled temperature, rather than only relying on energy from the sun. The design still included passive heating methods, such as semi-transparent oiled hanji windows to capture light and cob walls to retain heat, but the furnace provided extra control over the artificial environment. The Annals of the Joseon Dynasty confirm that greenhouse-like structures incorporating ondol were constructed to provide heat for mandarin orange trees during the winter of 1438.

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Date: 30/05/2024 19:24:46
From: Dark Orange
ID: 2159827
Subject: re: A Passive Heating System.

party_pants said:


Dark Orange said:

Wouldn’t the inclusion of a fan negate the “Passive” nature?

Two simple means of decreasing cost and increasing efficiency:

Use a single layer of glass enclosing a cavity with black poly-pipe. Sunlight heats up the pipe, and the glass helps insulates it from the cold external air. Air is pushed through the pipe.

Replace the air with water (much greater thermal capacity) and pump it to a radiator that has a fan blowing through it. This allows the water to be a closed system and will be probably be more efficient.

You could also make the primary solar heat exchanger out of an old solar water heater :)

Step 2 – replace water with palm oil or something like that. Water freezes at 0C, palm oil around -30C. You don’t want water freezing and bursting pipes.

That’s why the good lord allowed us to invent glycol.

Speaking of glycol, the SDS states: “Ingestion: Do not induce vomiting. Seek medical attention immediately. If person is fully conscious give 1 cup or 8 ounces (240 ml) of water. If medical advice is delayed and if an adult has swallowed several ounces of chemical, then give 3-4 ounces (1/3-1/2 Cup) (90-120 ml) of hard liquor such as 80 proof whiskey.”

I have been arguing the need to carry Johnny Walker around in the glove box at work with little success.

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Date: 30/05/2024 19:31:43
From: party_pants
ID: 2159828
Subject: re: A Passive Heating System.

Dark Orange said:


party_pants said:

Dark Orange said:

Wouldn’t the inclusion of a fan negate the “Passive” nature?

Two simple means of decreasing cost and increasing efficiency:

Use a single layer of glass enclosing a cavity with black poly-pipe. Sunlight heats up the pipe, and the glass helps insulates it from the cold external air. Air is pushed through the pipe.

Replace the air with water (much greater thermal capacity) and pump it to a radiator that has a fan blowing through it. This allows the water to be a closed system and will be probably be more efficient.

You could also make the primary solar heat exchanger out of an old solar water heater :)

Step 2 – replace water with palm oil or something like that. Water freezes at 0C, palm oil around -30C. You don’t want water freezing and bursting pipes.

That’s why the good lord allowed us to invent glycol.

Speaking of glycol, the SDS states: “Ingestion: Do not induce vomiting. Seek medical attention immediately. If person is fully conscious give 1 cup or 8 ounces (240 ml) of water. If medical advice is delayed and if an adult has swallowed several ounces of chemical, then give 3-4 ounces (1/3-1/2 Cup) (90-120 ml) of hard liquor such as 80 proof whiskey.”

I have been arguing the need to carry Johnny Walker around in the glove box at work with little success.

Generally speaking, vegetable oils are non-toxic.

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