Probably most of you have heard the short-term weather forecast “Red sky at night, shepherds delight. Red sky morning, shepherds warning.” or some variation thereof.
I there any statistical correlation between sunsets/sunrises and the weather of the following day? If so, why/what’s happening?
esselte said:
Probably most of you have heard the short-term weather forecast “Red sky at night, shepherds delight. Red sky morning, shepherds warning.” or some variation thereof.I there any statistical correlation between sunsets/sunrises and the weather of the following day? If so, why/what’s happening?
At night the cloud cover prevents damaging frosts. At dawn it implies it is going to be a shit of a day.
It seems to me the old saying is more genralised than a warning about frost. A spectacular sunset indicates fine clear weather the following day; a spectacular sunrise indicates rain and storms and wind.
It is an English saying. It refers to many temperate climates, where the weather comes from the west.
“Red sky at night, shepherds delight” This portion of the saying indicates the end of the cloud band coming from the west (that may have brought snow or similar) is near the horizon. Tomorrow might be a sunny day. Pretty sunset.
“Red sky in the morning, shepherds warning.” This indicates the start of cloud coming from the west. Possible rain or snow, blizzards or similar. Pretty sunrise.
Michael V said:
It is an English saying. It refers to many temperate climates, where the weather comes from the west.“Red sky at night, shepherds delight” This portion of the saying indicates the end of the cloud band coming from the west (that may have brought snow or similar) is near the horizon. Tomorrow might be a sunny day. Pretty sunset.
“Red sky in the morning, shepherds warning.” This indicates the start of cloud coming from the west. Possible rain or snow, blizzards or similar. Pretty sunrise.
A work colleague posed the question to me yesterday.
He claims to have observed over a period of 30+ years, that the saying holds true here in Australia generally, and particularly those parts of Australia with a Mediterranean climate
Michael V said:
It is an English saying. It refers to many temperate climates, where the weather comes from the west.“Red sky at night, shepherds delight” This portion of the saying indicates the end of the cloud band coming from the west (that may have brought snow or similar) is near the horizon. Tomorrow might be a sunny day. Pretty sunset.
“Red sky in the morning, shepherds warning.” This indicates the start of cloud coming from the west. Possible rain or snow, blizzards or similar. Pretty sunrise.
A work colleague posed the question to me yesterday.
He claims to have observed over a period of 30+ years, that the saying holds true here in Australia generally, and particularly those parts of Australia with a Mediterranean climate
Also, does the sky colour actually have any correlation to the presence of clouds? My impression is, from confidently trying and ultimately failing to answer the question to my work colleague, that the colour of sunsets and sunrises is not necessarily tied to cloud cover.
esselte said:
Also, does the sky colour actually have any correlation to the presence of clouds? My impression is, from confidently trying and ultimately failing to answer the question to my work colleague, that the colour of sunsets and sunrises is not necessarily tied to cloud cover.
true but in general the more clouds the redder the sky.
esselte said:
.
Also, does the sky colour actually have any correlation to the presence of clouds? My impression is, from confidently trying and ultimately failing to answer the question to my work colleague, that the colour of sunsets and sunrises is not necessarily tied to cloud cover.
Hence these special shows are noted.
Is the Sunset/Sunrise phenomenon solely related to cloud cover?
That is initially what I thought, when the question was asked.
I faltered in my answer because I’m not sure that any cloud is required to make the saying a truthful observation.
My observations indicate that one doesn’t get spectacular sunsets/sunrises without clouds.
But what happens when there’s a death of clouds?
:-)
Michael V said:
My observations indicate that one doesn’t get spectacular sunsets/sunrises without clouds.
That is my observation also.
But my colleague managed to convince me that the correlation between colour of sunsets and sunrises was independent of cloud cover, but related to other “atmospheric phenomenon”
I understand the “cloud cover” argument, but I am not convinced that clouds are the primary or exclusive motivation for “Oh, wow” sunsets and sunrises, nor for the weather preceding these clouds.
You can also get pretty colours from smoke haze or other crap in the atmosphere.
Divine Angel said:
But what happens when there’s a death of clouds?:-)
Black sky in the morning, Zarkies warning.
Black sky at night, she’ll be right.
Sailors also have a similar saying.
I’d imagine the two became intertwined at ports where sailors would talk with the shepherd’s at the Taverna at somewhere like Troy or some such ancient port city.
I’d imagine the discussions would be very robust as the night progressed, could have ended up in fights or even killings.
It’s Red Sky
BULLSHIT
It’s Rainbow, and it’s in the morning.
Peak Warming Man said:
Sailors also have a similar saying.
I’d imagine the two became intertwined at ports where sailors would talk with the shepherd’s at the Taverna at somewhere like Troy or some such ancient port city.
I’d imagine the discussions would be very robust as the night progressed, could have ended up in fights or even killings.It’s Red Sky
BULLSHIT
It’s Rainbow, and it’s in the morning.
Whilst your imaginings are always entertaining, I think you should keep the “rainbow connection” stuff to your self. :)
Yarrrrr…
it remind me, it do, of what i lurnd when i were a boy, at sea, and all agog at the world:
“if the rain before the wind
then yer tops’ls ye must mind/
If the wind before the rain
fear nought, and hoist ‘em out again”
Yarrr.
captain_spalding said:
Yarrrrr…it remind me, it do, of what i lurnd when i were a boy, at sea, and all agog at the world:
“if the rain before the wind
then yer tops’ls ye must mind/
If the wind before the rain
fear nought, and hoist ‘em out again”
Yarrr.
This kind of wisdom is widespread. It be what i be asking about. What’s the science behind it? Yarr!
Hang about while I find a link or something, but ‘our’ Steve (the weatherman) is setting up some research on this. I was reading it in the Skeptic magazine an hour ago.
It’s not the featured article. Here is the link for the featured article this quarter. I’ll go and get my copy and give you the contact details.
http://www.skeptics.com.au/wordpress/wp-content/uploads/theskeptic/2013/2_Cover.pdf
buffy said:
Hang about while I find a link or something, but ‘our’ Steve (the weatherman) is setting up some research on this. I was reading it in the Skeptic magazine an hour ago.
I’m an important person with things to do. Steve (and yourself) needs to get his act together and be here now… I demand satisfaction!
Failing that, I’d be very interested in any comments r something from him or you :)
Last couple of paragraphs:
“YOUR HELP IN A STUDY
To this end, we return to the subtitle of this piece, “A Modest Proposal For Finding the Truth About Red Skies”.
What I would like people to do is to keep an eye on the sky and the weather. I do not expect people to get up at dawn day after day to check the colour of the sky (if you want to, please do, but it is not expected). But I would ask those who are up and about at that hour to help. And those viewing sunsets could help to. What is needed is a series of observations from different parts of the country taken over specific periods.
We need to know the colour of the sky at sunrise and sunset and the ensuing weather. Rain of itself is not bad weather for farmers or sailors but a combination of rain and wind can cause difficulties for ships and shepherds. It is that combination,or just high winds which is the weather we are looking for.
If you are willing to take part, the information I need is:
Location
Do you have a good view of the horizon to the east or west or both. If not good, is it “reasonable”?
Date
Time of day (sunrise/sunset)
Sky colour – red: yes/no
Weather in the next 12 hours.
Storms, high winds, wind/rain combination, otherwise “not significant”
If you could keep your records for two fortnights during the year, say one in August and one in February I would collate the data and see what we come up with. I may need more data but that would be a good preliminary set and should not be too onerous on those taking part. If you would like to take part, please email me at redskystudy@outlook.com and we’ll go from there.
Anyone want to be involved?
It’s not only clouds for the redness though. Some years ago when Pinatubo (sp?) went up, we had speccy sunsets for some time. We also get them when there are bushfires and grassfires around.