What would it take to bring Mars and Venus into orbits closer to Earth’s(no particular time frame)?

Riff-in-Thyme said:

What would it take to bring Mars and Venus into orbits closer to Earth’s(no particular time frame)?

you’d need to slow down mars and speed up venus

Riff-in-Thyme said:

What would it take to bring Mars and Venus into orbits closer to Earth’s(no particular time frame)?

Not much, a laser shoting a beam of photon at timed intervals should do the trick.

Stealth said:

Riff-in-Thyme said:

What would it take to bring Mars and Venus into orbits closer to Earth’s(no particular time frame)?

Not much, a laser shoting a beam of photon at timed intervals should do the trick.

where would these lasers be positioned?

Riff-in-Thyme said:

Stealth said:

Riff-in-Thyme said:

What would it take to bring Mars and Venus into orbits closer to Earth’s(no particular time frame)?

Not much, a laser shoting a beam of photon at timed intervals should do the trick.

where would these lasers be positioned?

Riff-in-Thyme said:

Stealth said:

Riff-in-Thyme said:

What would it take to bring Mars and Venus into orbits closer to Earth’s(no particular time frame)?

Not much, a laser shoting a beam of photon at timed intervals should do the trick.

where would these lasers be positioned?

On Earth or on the planet, doesn’t matter much.

wookiemeister said:

Riff-in-Thyme said:

What would it take to bring Mars and Venus into orbits closer to Earth’s(no particular time frame)?

you’d need to slow down mars and speed up venus

You sure about that?
[I wonder if tables still work here…]
According to Wikipedia:

Planet	Average orbital speed
Venus	35.02 km/s
Earth	29.78 km/s
Mars	24.077 km/s

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cb88 to the forum, paging cb to the forum, PM is testing you again…

Riff-in-Thyme said:

What would it take to bring Mars and Venus into orbits closer to Earth’s(no particular time frame)?

A lot of energy.

PM 2Ring said:

Riff-in-Thyme said:

What would it take to bring Mars and Venus into orbits closer to Earth’s(no particular time frame)?

A lot of energy.

I had a red bull?

A lot of energy.
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Not so sure…

If you could transfer some of he energy from one planet to the other they would both move closer to Earth.

Mr Ironic said:

A lot of energy.
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Not so sure…

If you could transfer some of he energy from one planet to the other they would both move closer to Earth.

Soitanly! But how do you propose doing that?

But how do you propose doing that?
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Well firstly by using a lot of energy….

But its ,mostly,not lost so the sum is not far off zero.

I mean you could pelt rocks at Venus to slow it down…

You can move it slightly closer very easily…

dv said:

You can move it slightly closer very easily…

I, and my family, will not be jumping at your command!

dv said:

You can move it slightly closer very easily…

Go on then.

e.g., you can affect the mean orbital diameter by a few yoctometres just by landing a spacecraft on it…

There’s a nice relationship between the potential & kinetic energy of an orbiting body.
This page http://physics.ucsc.edu/~josh/6A/book/gravity/node15.html shows the result for circular orbits, but the result is also true for elliptical orbits, if we use the semi-major axis of the ellipse (the mean orbital radius (sort of)) in place of the circle’s radius.

The potential energy U of an orbit is (conventionally) given as a negative number.
The kinetic energy K is positive, with K = -U / 2
So the total (potential + kinetic) energy E is also negative, with E = U / 2

E = -GMm/ 2a
where G is the universal gravitational constant,
M is the central mass,
m is the orbiting mass,
a is the semi-major axis.

Here’s a list of total orbital energies in joules, for the planets mentioned in the OP, using scientific notation:
Venus -2.98458e+33
Earth -2.64896e+33
Mars -1.86022e+32

If we change the orbital radii of Venus & Mars to equal that of Earth, we get
Venus -2.15882e+33
Mars -2.83437e+32

The energy differences are
Venus 8.25762e+32
Mars -9.74148e+31

That’s quite a lot of energy, as I said earlier. Note that according to E = mc², 1.0e+32 joules is equivalent to around 1.0e+15 kg. And it’s still a lot if we spread it out over time. An energy source capable of putting out 3.17e+15 watts would take around a billion years to produce 1.0e+32 joules.

Of course, we don’t want to move Venus & Mars into Earth’s orbit, that could get messy. :) But these calculations give you an idea of the scale of energies involved.

dv said:

e.g., you can affect the mean orbital diameter by a few yoctometres just by landing a spacecraft on it…

I was just thinking about that, and I’m not sure the situation I’m thinking about fits or applies. If a planet loses a mass asymmetrically, but without the mass having a resultant vector, and my physics is rusty here, it may introduce a wobble, but no resultant movement away or towards the sun.

The situation I’m musing about is the coming rapture. Whilst the amount of matter lost to the earth is going to be miniscule in the scheme of things, the vast majority will be lost from the central regions of the North American continent. Now, not knowing the ming of god, I can only assume that the rapture will be a vector less operation. Does the resultant loss of mass produce even a wobble in the earth’s orbit?

PM 2Ring said:

There’s a nice relationship between the potential & kinetic energy of an orbiting body.
This page http://physics.ucsc.edu/~josh/6A/book/gravity/node15.html shows the result for circular orbits, but the result is also true for elliptical orbits, if we use the semi-major axis of the ellipse (the mean orbital radius (sort of)) in place of the circle’s radius.

The potential energy U of an orbit is (conventionally) given as a negative number.
The kinetic energy K is positive, with K = -U / 2
So the total (potential + kinetic) energy E is also negative, with E = U / 2

E = -GMm/ 2a
where G is the universal gravitational constant,
M is the central mass,
m is the orbiting mass,
a is the semi-major axis.

Here’s a list of total orbital energies in joules, for the planets mentioned in the OP, using scientific notation:
Venus -2.98458e+33
Earth -2.64896e+33
Mars -1.86022e+32

If we change the orbital radii of Venus & Mars to equal that of Earth, we get
Venus -2.15882e+33
Mars -2.83437e+32

The energy differences are
Venus 8.25762e+32
Mars -9.74148e+31

That’s quite a lot of energy, as I said earlier. Note that according to E = mc², 1.0e+32 joules is equivalent to around 1.0e+15 kg. And it’s still a lot if we spread it out over time. An energy source capable of putting out 3.17e+15 watts would take around a billion years to produce 1.0e+32 joules.

Of course, we don’t want to move Venus & Mars into Earth’s orbit, that could get messy. :) But these calculations give you an idea of the scale of energies involved.

So what is that in sydharbs per household?

when I lose mass I get less wobbly

The situation I’m musing about is the coming rapture.
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Sorry buddy but you missed that train. Party over.

Only fools are left to post.

Mr Ironic said:

The situation I’m musing about is the coming rapture.
———————————————

Sorry buddy but you missed that train. Party over.

Only fools are left to post.

Shouldn’t you be off implanting electrodes in your brain?

Kingy said:

PM 2Ring said:

That’s quite a lot of energy, as I said earlier. Note that according to E = mc², 1.0e+32 joules is equivalent to around 1.0e+15 kg.

So what is that in sydharbs per household?

Actually, I should’ve said 1.0e+32 joules is equivalent to around 1.11e+15 kg, but what’s 1.1e+14 kg among friends. :)

1 sydharb is (approx) 500 gigalitres, or 5.0e11 kg of water. So you’d need to totally convert around ten thousand sydharbs of water to energy to generate 1.0e+32 joules. One way to do that would be to annihilate 5000 sydharbs of water with 5000 sydharbs of antimatter water.

PM 2Ring said:

Kingy said:

PM 2Ring said:

That’s quite a lot of energy, as I said earlier. Note that according to E = mc², 1.0e+32 joules is equivalent to around 1.0e+15 kg.

So what is that in sydharbs per household?

Actually, I should’ve said 1.0e+32 joules is equivalent to around 1.11e+15 kg, but what’s 1.1e+14 kg among friends. :)

1 sydharb is (approx) 500 gigalitres, or 5.0e11 kg of water. So you’d need to totally convert around ten thousand sydharbs of water to energy to generate 1.0e+32 joules. One way to do that would be to annihilate 5000 sydharbs of water with 5000 sydharbs of antimatter water.

So a couple of more sydharbs to get them both to Alpha Centuri.

PM 2Ring said:

Kingy said:

PM 2Ring said:

That’s quite a lot of energy, as I said earlier. Note that according to E = mc², 1.0e+32 joules is equivalent to around 1.0e+15 kg.

So what is that in sydharbs per household?

Actually, I should’ve said 1.0e+32 joules is equivalent to around 1.11e+15 kg, but what’s 1.1e+14 kg among friends. :)

1 sydharb is (approx) 500 gigalitres, or 5.0e11 kg of water. So you’d need to totally convert around ten thousand sydharbs of water to energy to generate 1.0e+32 joules. One way to do that would be to annihilate 5000 sydharbs of water with 5000 sydharbs of antimatter water.

Wouldn’t that disrupt traffic on the Bridge?

You’d need a permit.

Shouldn’t you be off implanting electrodes in your brain?
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No i’m OK, I’m right to post…

The moon can be removed from earth orbit by exploding a nuclear waste dump on one side of it. (it happened in 1999 aparantly)

maybe you could slow a planet down by using the magnetic flux of the sun

you build lots of conductors to harness the sun’s magnetic field to produce electricity

as mars moves through flux lines it induces current in the conductors

maybe you could speed a planet up by doing the opposite?