Date: 18/10/2013 18:08:07
From: Ian
ID: 415917
Subject: Kenwood Car CD Problem

Anyhoo, thought I’d change the CD in the car player (KDC-X9533U) (Joe Cocker was starting to sound like he was damaging his delicate vocal folds) for the first time in ages. Ejected a relieved Joe and put in the new CD. The machine groaned and farted a few times before jamming with head unit sticking out.. it said TOC error. The other functions still worked goodly.

When I got home from the long trip I read the manual and found out that there is a reset button.. pressed that and it lowered the front panel but attempts to eject the CD only resulted in the same performance as above.

Help? Anyone?

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Date: 18/10/2013 18:11:01
From: bob(from black rock)
ID: 415918
Subject: re: Kenwood Car CD Problem

Ian said:


Anyhoo, thought I’d change the CD in the car player (KDC-X9533U) (Joe Cocker was starting to sound like he was damaging his delicate vocal folds) for the first time in ages. Ejected a relieved Joe and put in the new CD. The machine groaned and farted a few times before jamming with head unit sticking out.. it said TOC error. The other functions still worked goodly.

When I got home from the long trip I read the manual and found out that there is a reset button.. pressed that and it lowered the front panel but attempts to eject the CD only resulted in the same performance as above.

Help? Anyone?

Chainsaw?

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Date: 18/10/2013 18:15:54
From: Bubblecar
ID: 415920
Subject: re: Kenwood Car CD Problem

Looks like you’re not the only one:

Kenwood MP3 HU – Whats a “TOC error”?

http://www.talkaudio.co.uk/ipb/index.php/topic/90170-kenwood-mp3-hu-whats-a-toc-error/

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Date: 18/10/2013 18:28:21
From: Ian
ID: 415929
Subject: re: Kenwood Car CD Problem

Bubblecar said:


Looks like you’re not the only one:

Kenwood MP3 HU – Whats a “TOC error”?

http://www.talkaudio.co.uk/ipb/index.php/topic/90170-kenwood-mp3-hu-whats-a-toc-error/

Yeah, I found threads like that one.. mostly going on about bad reads etc.

One suggested undoing four screws and very carefully releasing CD??

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Date: 18/10/2013 23:07:38
From: Ian
ID: 416147
Subject: re: Kenwood Car CD Problem

Until someone comes along (hopefully) with some ideas for freeing my trapped CD maybe we could make this a (mad dog) Joe Cocker thread instead..

Not without difficulty, I recently got hold of a copy of the DVD of the video of the film of the legendary tour, Mad Dogs & Englishmen..

Despite the somewhat poor audio and video quality (needs digital clean up) and the excessive use of split screens (OK for flies) this film is a prime example of the genre IMO..

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Date: 18/10/2013 23:08:05
From: Ian
ID: 416148
Subject: re: Kenwood Car CD Problem

With a name from Noel Coward’s famed song, “Mad Dogs and Englishmen” the famed concert tour kicked off the 70’s and set a standard in live rock for decades to come. The rag-tag troupe of 40 rock vagabonds featured 21 singers and musicians, a total unheard of at the time. Joe Cocker’s album “With a Little Help from My Friends” had reached #1 in the UK (11/68) but stirred little excitement in the US. It was his legendary performance at Woodstock that attracted international recognition and shortly thereafter his rendition of Leon Russell’s “Delta Lady” was soaring up the charts. His second album, creatively titled “Joe Cocker” was released in November 1969 and immediately went gold in the US. First album sales soon followed and he enjoyed back-to-back million sellers. Sales were also boosted by another hit single, his cover of the Boxtops’ hit “The Letter”.
Joe had been touring continuously with his Grease Band led by Chris Stainton. He arrived in Los Angeles in March of 1970 for a little rest and relaxation with the intention of forming a new band. Unbeknownst to him his management company had retained Leon Russell as his new Music Director and had instructed Leon to assemble a new line-up. Over the prior two months, coinciding with Cocker’s meteoric rise in popularity, they had conceived and organized a grand plan to add an appendage to Joe’s tour, aptly titled “Mad Dogs and Englishmen”. A personal jet had been chartered for the touring entourage and the plan was to record the following extravaganza for both a live album and a feature film. The tour was scheduled for 48 cities in 56 days, beginning in Detroit in just 8 days. Following only four 10 plus hour rehearsals, the new group was sent off to make rock and roll history.

Leon Russell had assembled a stellar cast of musicians for the project. He first went to his old pals Delaney & Bonnie who had just completed their extensive European tour and gleaned the nucleus of their band. He chose bassist Carl Radle, Bobby Whitlock as a third keyboard player, sax man Bobby Keys, and their original drummer Jim Keltner as well as his replacement for the tour, Jim Gordon. Keys was augmented with the legendary Rolling Stones sideman, Jim Price, providing 2 horns that sounded like a 10-piece section. He hired guitarist Don Preston another D & B vet who had been a legend in the LA studio circuit for decades. He also added another of D & B’s famed “Friends”, Rita Coolidge, to pair with back-up greats Claudia Linnear and Kathi McDonald, and eventually ended up with a total of 10 singers. The ensemble was now capable of recreating the sound of the entire Ray Charles Orchestra (as well as the Raelettes) and went out to set the world on fire.

By the time the scruffy gang arrived for their 4 shows at the famed Fillmore East in New York (March 27-28, 1970) they were really tight on all levels and ready to record what would become Joe Cocker’s 3rd consecutive gold album. It is still recognized as one of the greatest live albums of all time. In addition to the live album, the concerts were filmed for a motion picture which documented this truly historic moment in rock music.

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Date: 18/10/2013 23:11:19
From: party_pants
ID: 416152
Subject: re: Kenwood Car CD Problem

I have no experience with Kenwood machines. Only thing I can suggest is to see if there is a pin hole some near where the CD goes in. Sometimes you can stick a pin down there which will release a catch that’s holding your CD in.

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Date: 18/10/2013 23:14:16
From: Skunkworks
ID: 416154
Subject: re: Kenwood Car CD Problem

You might find if you go to one of those auto audio joints it is a well known problem and they can fix it in a jiffy for just a few dollars. Orrrr you might be stuffed.

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Date: 19/10/2013 00:39:22
From: Ian
ID: 416196
Subject: re: Kenwood Car CD Problem

Skunkworks said:


You might find if you go to one of those auto audio joints it is a well known problem and they can fix it in a jiffy for just a few dollars. Orrrr you might be stuffed.

Might be limited to what I can fit in the USB port :)

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Date: 19/10/2013 00:42:59
From: Ian
ID: 416198
Subject: re: Kenwood Car CD Problem

The phenomenon known as Joe Cocker’s Mad Dogs & Englishmen turned 35 years old in 2005. A six-disc limited edition box set, Mad Dogs & Englishmen—The Complete Fillmore East Concerts, was released to commemorate the anniversary, and documents all four shows performed by the band at New York’s Fillmore East Auditorium on March 27th and 28th, 1970. Released concurrently were the two-disc Mad Dogs & Englishmen—The Deluxe Edition and a remastered DVD of the original concert movie.

http://www.allaboutjazz.com/php/article.php?id=23212

Bugger!

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Date: 19/10/2013 00:43:35
From: wookiemeister
ID: 416200
Subject: re: Kenwood Car CD Problem

Skunkworks said:


You might find if you go to one of those auto audio joints it is a well known problem and they can fix it in a jiffy for just a few dollars. Orrrr you might be stuffed.

+1

I tried prising my old radio out with some dedicated tongs

didn’t work

when the car was serviced I asked them to take it out

the thing was buggered anyway so I threw it in the bin and now theres just a gaping hole – listen to music through headphones in the car anyway so I ditched 1kg of radio and save money on fuel

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Date: 19/10/2013 00:48:13
From: Skunkworks
ID: 416203
Subject: re: Kenwood Car CD Problem

wookiemeister said:


Skunkworks said:

You might find if you go to one of those auto audio joints it is a well known problem and they can fix it in a jiffy for just a few dollars. Orrrr you might be stuffed.

+1

Not exactly what I had in mind. And funny the way things turn, a bloke in town used to be a used car salesmen and he recalled the back of his office being full of radios cos they would pull them out and replace with radio cassette recorders. This town hosts lots of bike and car events almost every weekend and he is kicking himself. All of those valueless radios now have worth for people restoring cars back to standard.

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Date: 19/10/2013 18:49:39
From: Aquila
ID: 416541
Subject: re: Kenwood Car CD Problem

TOC = Table Of Contents
The TOC is the first bit of data read by the laser when a new disc is loaded, in this case it just sounds like a generic fault code, ie: the disc cannot be “read”.
TOC is just digital information at the start of the disc containing track numbers and track times.

Your problem could be one of a few things, the drive for the loading mechanism has a problem, a gear jammed, tooth worn/damaged jamming the mechanism, if it uses a small rubber drive belt on a pulley to drive the load mech. it may be slipping.

Or probably…If it has one of those ‘flip down’ front facias on a hinge which hide the slot where the disc is inserted, well they use a ‘ribbon connector’ between the main unit and the front facia electronics.
The ribbon connector is a flat flexible plastic strip containing a number of ‘flat copper wires’
similar to the orange thing in this image: if they are under flex stress, over time they can crack and open circuit one of the copper tracks:

In the past I’ve cut my lunch, working on car audio as a service tech.

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Date: 20/10/2013 08:31:21
From: Ian
ID: 416765
Subject: re: Kenwood Car CD Problem

Thanks Aquilla..

Yes it’s one of those ‘flip down’ front facias on a hinge which hide the slot where the disc is inserted. But I don’t think it’s a broken wire or worn mechanism problem (hardly ever used since it has USB).

It was pre-dawn when I shoved the disk in. It’s possible that I put it in the drive up-side down.

It is coming out of the slot about 5mm momentarily on pressing eject… I was wondering about taping the ends of some forceps and trying to grab hold of it.

Otherwise, how tricky is it to open up the drive?

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Date: 20/10/2013 13:25:23
From: Aquila
ID: 416873
Subject: re: Kenwood Car CD Problem

If the loading motor uses a small pulley with a rubber drive belt for the loading mechanism, it doesn’t have to even be used for the rubber drive belt to deteriorate, (slip, crack & break, turn to oil – yes I’ve actually seen rubber drive belts turn to goo).

Without a bo-peep inside, or a bench test, it’s difficult to give an accurate diagnosis, as for pulling it apart yourself, I wouldn’t recommend it, might get yourself into a pickle.

You can leave it as is, get some pliers to grip the end of the disc and gently pull it out or leave it and just use it for the radio / USB input, or take it to a service centre.

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Date: 20/10/2013 14:06:02
From: Ian
ID: 416889
Subject: re: Kenwood Car CD Problem

Yep. Sound like good advise Aquila.

I’ll try giving it a gentle tug (with suitable 4 letter word encouragement) and then see the doctor if necessary.

Cheers

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Date: 20/10/2013 14:28:53
From: transition
ID: 416898
Subject: re: Kenwood Car CD Problem

Promise never to play joe again, on knees, prayer-style hands together, be sincere, really mean it, apologize, thing’ll probably bounce back to life. The disc has formed an attachment with its nearest abuser, proxy.

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Date: 20/10/2013 14:52:41
From: dv
ID: 416901
Subject: re: Kenwood Car CD Problem

transition said:


Promise never to play joe again, on knees, prayer-style hands together, be sincere, really mean it, apologize, thing’ll probably bounce back to life. The disc has formed an attachment with its nearest abuser, proxy.

Nonsensical seemed to be the consensus.

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Date: 20/10/2013 14:52:50
From: transition
ID: 416902
Subject: re: Kenwood Car CD Problem

May want to lift the lid make sure nothing in there that shouldn’t be, jamming it. Give it a little hand moving outward gently while moving that direction if that looks easy. Check any belt drive if it has one, the belts go dry stretched or even super stretch glue-like sometimes. If it has a laser poking in your direction don’t put your eyes over it, just in case it is operating.

The load mech may have switches or a mode switch that senses where the load mech should be during operations, and if it fails to get there or switch something in some given time it may pull the disc back in or stall to some fault indication.

If it’s got lot of dust maybe give it some air, clean it out some first, something short of 200psi should do it (be a bit gentle in other words).

If the laser looks dirty after the blow job and after you’ve fixed the problem maybe clean it, gentle, someone here will know what fluid etc to use for that.

If you brave getting the lid off for an inspection try not to drop anything metal on any exposed circuit boards, that might form some novel circuit for a moment that changes the way the rest of the machine works permanently.

Don’t suppose it’s a single disc player with a second disc jammed in there.

Personally hate car audio, got a job to get me under a dash to replace a fuse.

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Date: 20/10/2013 15:07:13
From: Ian
ID: 416907
Subject: re: Kenwood Car CD Problem

transition said:


Promise never to play joe again, on knees, prayer-style hands together, be sincere, really mean it, apologize, thing’ll probably bounce back to life. The disc has formed an attachment with its nearest abuser, proxy.

No way seelly perrrsonn! It spat out the Joe quite happily.

Besides, me and Joe go way back.. One of the first times I realized the combination of cannabis and music.. in the pupose-built uni private listening lounge.

…seen more Joe concerts in more different states of mind.. old Horden Pavlova.. right up against RH speaker stack for finale (ooooo my ears still ache!) with “Little Help” etc off me fkn tits (maann)! Who else interprets something like that nondescript Beatles ballad by replacing the original line with “WAAARRRWRRRR YEEEAAAHHH!!”?

Just now interrupted another viewing of MDAE…..

:)

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Date: 20/10/2013 15:13:30
From: transition
ID: 416911
Subject: re: Kenwood Car CD Problem

>:)

yeah he’s ok, shit stirring ya. But, you know good music may not require chemical enhancements ….. (don’t want to be encouraging such things in the younger generation do we…..).

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Date: 20/10/2013 15:25:01
From: Ian
ID: 416915
Subject: re: Kenwood Car CD Problem

transition said:


>:)

yeah he’s ok, shit stirring ya. But, you know good music may not require chemical enhancements ….. (don’t want to be encouraging such things in the younger generation do we…..).

I don’t need those “enhancements” these days but at the time….

Besides, I don’t think “the younger generation” is very well represented here.

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