There Have been claims by some that the act of drinking alcohol causes dehydration in humans. It is a well known fact!

We had this out on the old SSSF many years ago. It seems that discussion didn’t put the idea to bed and it needs to be thrashed out once more.

The main article put up against for the case seems to lie with an article by Dr Karl http://www.abc.net.au/science/articles/2012/02/28/3441707.htm

So if you drink 200 millilitres of beer, the end result is 200 millilitres of water. But you don’t urinate just 200 millilitres of urine. No! You urinate a total of about 320 millilitres of urine.

So in general, each shot of alcohol makes you urinate an extra 120 millilitres of urine on top of your normal urine output.

OK. Let’s just look at that.

I’ve been away for the last ten days. I’ve drank a slab of beer every two days. That’s 9 litres a day, so by Karl’s calcs I’ve pissed about 14.4 litres of urine a day. So I need to replace this 54 kg over the 10 days. I drink 2 mugs of coffee in the morn and eaten about a kilo of food a day. So, excluding the alcohol I drank, my intake was about 2 kg a day, and to make it maybe fair let’s make it a roundabout 3 kg a day.

So I’ve got 30 odd kg (no body metabolism taken into account) in versus 54 kg out.

How come I’m still a fat bastard?

Should I have done the 20 day live by the Murray and drink piss weight loss programm?

sibeen said:

There Have been claims by some that the act of drinking alcohol causes dehydration in humans. It is a well known fact!

We had this out on the old SSSF many years ago. It seems that discussion didn’t put the idea to bed and it needs to be thrashed out once more.

The main article put up against for the case seems to lie with an article by Dr Karl http://www.abc.net.au/science/articles/2012/02/28/3441707.htm

So if you drink 200 millilitres of beer, the end result is 200 millilitres of water. But you don’t urinate just 200 millilitres of urine. No! You urinate a total of about 320 millilitres of urine.

So in general, each shot of alcohol makes you urinate an extra 120 millilitres of urine on top of your normal urine output.

OK. Let’s just look at that.

I’ve been away for the last ten days. I’ve drank a slab of beer every two days. That’s 9 litres a day, so by Karl’s calcs I’ve pissed about 14.4 litres of urine a day. So I need to replace this 54 kg over the 10 days. I drink 2 mugs of coffee in the morn and eaten about a kilo of food a day. So, excluding the alcohol I drank, my intake was about 2 kg a day, and to make it maybe fair let’s make it a roundabout 3 kg a day.

So I’ve got 30 odd kg (no body metabolism taken into account) in versus 54 kg out.

How come I’m still a fat bastard?

Should I have done the 20 day live by the Murray and drink piss weight loss programm?

There are many things you are not considering. Too many to put in one post. Suffice to say, they are many.

roughbarked said:

There are many things you are not considering. Too many to put in one post. Suffice to say, they are many.

Just one or two will do. You know, something evidence based. I don’t ask much.

sibeen said:

roughbarked said:

There are many things you are not considering. Too many to put in one post. Suffice to say, they are many.

Just one or two will do. You know, something evidence based. I don’t ask much.

http://tokyo3.org/forums/holiday/posts/470074/

roughbarked said:

sibeen said:

roughbarked said:

There are many things you are not considering. Too many to put in one post. Suffice to say, they are many.

Just one or two will do. You know, something evidence based. I don’t ask much.

http://tokyo3.org/forums/holiday/posts/470074/

Oh, grouse, you’ve found a paper from 1963 which morrie found for you.

Yeeha.

sibeen said:

roughbarked said:

sibeen said:

Just one or two will do. You know, something evidence based. I don’t ask much.

http://tokyo3.org/forums/holiday/posts/470074/

Oh, grouse, you’ve found a paper from 1963 which morrie found for you.

Yeeha.

No.. it is about me peeing in the empty stubby. I’ve drunk one and a half over how many hours since I mentioned the Kingfisher and apart from previous pisses before we started talking measurements, since I announced that I was peeing in a bottle I have now filled four times the empty stubby.. sorry.. as I said, I was busting.

That makes five stubbies of pee from two stubbies drank. and I haven’t gone to bed yet..

6. was only half full but I’ll bet I’m up again soon.

When you work it all out let me know what % alcohol in water a non drinker (person that typically drinks very little) can consume in typical Australian conditions for extended periods that doesn’t have significant effects on quantities/replacement of fluids needed or behaviour or health. For a person doing regular busy days, including manual work.

I’d guess it would be somewhat under the maximum natural fermentation can achieve, which is 3% I believe?(could be less than that, been while since read anything about it).

As I understand it stored drinks(wines I suppose) this way have been used for thousands, perhaps ten thousand years or more, because way back it was a way of storing beverages that tended to kill pathogens?

It’s not the water making you fat…

And of say something like jam, does this have a a little bit of alcohol in it?

My impression is that the real problems with alcohol really only started when drinks started to exceed what would be arrived at through natural fermentation. Then later there were distillation, which put rocket fuel in a bottle.

I did this experiment over a longweekend, drank nothing but beer and black coffee. Didn’t end up dehydrated.

Skunkworks said:

I did this experiment over a longweekend, drank nothing but beer and black coffee. Didn’t end up dehydrated.

How did you measure that?

You had an energy intake of ~7000 kJ per day from the EtOH(Assuming drinking XXXX Gold at 3.3% EtOH (~234g EtOH)) , I assume you were still eating food too, I could be wrong though I suppose. So, you’re still fat coz you have a colossal excess of energy intake…

Hope I got the units right in that little calc…

poikilotherm said:

Skunkworks said:

I did this experiment over a longweekend, drank nothing but beer and black coffee. Didn’t end up dehydrated.

How did you measure that?

I didn’t feel dehydrated. 3 days of pissing out more than I take in should have seen me dead.

Skunkworks said:

poikilotherm said:

Skunkworks said:

I did this experiment over a longweekend, drank nothing but beer and black coffee. Didn’t end up dehydrated.

How did you measure that?

I didn’t feel dehydrated. 3 days of pissing out more than I take in should have seen me dead.

Did you measure what you pissed out? Is what I was getting at, would have been a good experiment.

can i add an anecdote? when i drink cascade i wake up during the night with a really dry mouth, doesn’t happen with other beers i drink. it is only, maybe, 3 beers, don’t drink a real lot these days.

poikilotherm said:

Skunkworks said:

poikilotherm said:

How did you measure that?

I didn’t feel dehydrated. 3 days of pissing out more than I take in should have seen me dead.

Did you measure what you pissed out? Is what I was getting at, would have been a good experiment.

Ok scratch experiment, call it an exercise.

Back to the water stuff, hopefully something from the 90’s is more shebs thing.

http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/2361644

Healthy male volunteers drank neat whisky in amounts corresponding to 0.51, 0.68, or 0.85 g ethanol/kg body weight in 15-25 min after an overnight (10 h) fast. Urine was collected immediately before drinking and then at 60 min intervals for 7-8 h after intake. The volumes of urine voided were measured and the concentrations of alcohol (UAC) were determined by an enzymatic method. Ethanol-induced diuresis showed large inter-subject variations. The flow of urine was maximum between 60 and 120 min post-drinking when the median rates of production were 117 ml/h (range 55-335), 113 ml/h (range 41-453) and 373 ml/h (range 215-485) for 0.51, 0.68, and 0.85 g ethanol/kg respectively. The output of urine returned to normal (30-60 ml/h) after the peak UAC had passed despite an elevated blood alcohol concentration (BAC). The average amount of alcohol excreted in urine was 0.29 g (S.D. 0.119), 0.44 g (S.D. 0.246), and 1.00 g (S.D. 0.427) after the consumption of 0.51, 0.68 and 0.85 g ethanol/kg respectively. Neither peak diuresis nor the amount of alcohol excreted depended on a subject’s age between 20 and 60 years. This work shows that after drinking a moderate dose of alcohol, only 0.7-1.5% of the amount consumed is excreted unchanged in urine. Ethanol-induced diuresis is most pronounced for the first 1-2 h after drinking (rising BAC). The production of urine returns to normal during the post-absorptive state.

And for something perhaps a little more practically oriented – but including a neat summary of research and a link to another interesting paper….ref 21 – alcohol and exercise:

http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC3257708/

bump

:)

burp

You get a lot of water from food.

Also, there is a point beyond which the Kidneys ignore the body. You might recall Dr. Karl saying that on the old forum.

Rule 303 said:

You get a lot of water from food.

Also, there is a point beyond which the Kidneys ignore the body. You might recall Dr. Karl saying that on the old forum.

Mentioned in dispatches, Dave :)

sibeen said:

bump

:)

Go away. I’m not going to piss in a bottle.