It’s seemingly a common thing for tourettes sufferers to swear as part of their tic-behaviour.

Is that because the swearing is a “naughty” word and therefore reaction provoking? If tourettes sufferers didn’t know any “swear words” what would they say instead?

I know that growling and “barking” can be part of the behaviour, so is perhaps swearing are more “articulate” way of doing that?

SqueezeBabe said:

It’s seemingly a common thing for tourettes sufferers to swear as part of their tic-behaviour.

Is that because the swearing is a “naughty” word and therefore reaction provoking? If tourettes sufferers didn’t know any “swear words” what would they say instead?

I know that growling and “barking” can be part of the behaviour, so is perhaps swearing are more “articulate” way of doing that?

Actually, the swearing thing in Tourette’s syndrome is quite rare.

Interesting Q.

I’m tempted toward viewing much as maintained so through inhibitory goings on, but don’t know that gets near even a starting point regards the behaviours.

poikilotherm said:

SqueezeBabe said:

It’s seemingly a common thing for tourettes sufferers to swear as part of their tic-behaviour.

Is that because the swearing is a “naughty” word and therefore reaction provoking? If tourettes sufferers didn’t know any “swear words” what would they say instead?

I know that growling and “barking” can be part of the behaviour, so is perhaps swearing are more “articulate” way of doing that?

Actually, the swearing thing in Tourette’s syndrome is quite rare.

common from the point of view that it’s the bit that gets reported the most.

SqueezeBabe said:

poikilotherm said:

SqueezeBabe said:

It’s seemingly a common thing for tourettes sufferers to swear as part of their tic-behaviour.

Is that because the swearing is a “naughty” word and therefore reaction provoking? If tourettes sufferers didn’t know any “swear words” what would they say instead?

I know that growling and “barking” can be part of the behaviour, so is perhaps swearing are more “articulate” way of doing that?

Actually, the swearing thing in Tourette’s syndrome is quite rare.

common from the point of view that it’s the bit that gets reported the most.

If it is rare, how does it get ‘reported the most’? Or are you referring to ‘in movies and other such shows the most’?

poikilotherm said:

SqueezeBabe said:

poikilotherm said:

Actually, the swearing thing in Tourette’s syndrome is quite rare.

common from the point of view that it’s the bit that gets reported the most.

If it is rare, how does it get ‘reported the most’? Or are you referring to ‘in movies and other such shows the most’?

SBS is doing a doco about a teenager that is undergoing some rather “radical” surgery because his tourettes is rather violent.

Ask the average person what “tourettes” is and a majority of them will come up with the swearing bit as the most identifiable thing about it.

Regardless of if it’s common or uncommon, or whatever the fuck it is, it is not answering the original question.

Tourette’s was once considered a rare and bizarre syndrome, most often associated with the exclamation of obscene words or socially inappropriate and derogatory remarks (coprolalia), but this symptom is present in only a small minority of people with Tourette’s. Tourette’s is no longer considered a rare condition, but it is not always correctly identified because most cases are mild and the severity of tics decreases for most children as they pass through adolescence. Between 0.4% and 3.8% of children ages 5 to 18 may have Tourette’s; the prevalence of other tic disorders in school-age children is higher, with the more common tics of eye blinking, coughing, throat clearing, sniffing, and facial movements. Extreme Tourette’s in adulthood is a rarity, and Tourette’s does not adversely affect intelligence or life expectancy.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Tourette_syndrome

>If it is rare, how does it get ‘reported the most’? Or are you referring to ‘in movies and other such shows the most’?

Verbal tics are probably more amusing, or interesting in that the transient loss of inhibitory control reveals something more interesting.

So a minority is somewhere between 1 and 49%.

What portion of this is a small minority?

Most vocal tics associated with TS are abstract. Hooting, squealing, that sort of thing.

I knew a bloke for many years and he had tourettes and I never knew. One time we were having a few beers and sorting out the world and he muttered something that sounded like Nintendo, I said what? He said what? I said what did you just say? He then said he must have had a seizure. It happened occasionally but it was subtle enough that people glossed over it or thought he had sneezed or something.

What’s the link between tourettes and vaccinations?

Peak Warming Man said:

What’s the link between tourettes and vaccinations?

Simple: all people suffering tourette’s syndrome have either been vaccinated or not been vaccinated.

Ring Meryl.

A former friend’s mother had it. The most common tic would be just a sharp yelp or a yah! sort of noise. Every now and again she would swear but it was rare enough to be remarked on by the rest of the family.

Sooooooo….

I’m going to hazard a guess that the brains trust isn’t present to answer the question…

Many people with mild TS (as I had in my youth) are able to keep the tic behaviour completely private. With me it was mostly repetitive sounding of the word “Good!” in increasingly distorted ways, when I was excited or absorbed in something. At its worst I’d be virtually screaming the word, but luckily I was living in the middle of nowhere :)

I eventually completely grew out of it.

Bubblecar said:

Many people with mild TS (as I had in my youth) are able to keep the tic behaviour completely private. With me it was mostly repetitive sounding of the word “Good!” in increasingly distorted ways, when I was excited or absorbed in something. At its worst I’d be virtually screaming the word, but luckily I was living in the middle of nowhere :)

I eventually completely grew out of it.

Good.

>Is that because the swearing is a “naughty” word and therefore reaction provoking?

Swearing isn’t really a common TS symptom, and many TS people only “do” their tics in private, or very quietly in public. They’re not looking for a reaction from other people.

SqueezeBabe said:

I’m going to hazard a guess that the brains trust isn’t present to answer the question…

I’m here!

NFI, sorry.

Bubblecar said:

>Is that because the swearing is a “naughty” word and therefore reaction provoking?

Swearing isn’t really a common TS symptom, and many TS people only “do” their tics in private, or very quietly in public. They’re not looking for a reaction from other people.

But ask the average person…

I’m gonna be blunt here…

No one has actually answered the question – you’ve all picked apart the bits of the question you don’t like, jumped up and down and told me that the bits I want to know about are “wrong” in some way or the other, and offered anecdotal evidence (which some of it is admittedly informative and amusing)

Regardless of HOW I asked the question – I still don’t have an answer for the bits I want, so I’ll break it down into little words:

WHY swearing (you’ll need to answer that bit before you can answer the next bit)

And if the person doesn’t KNOW any naughty words, then what words would they use instead.

I’d suggest it’s just random which words are used. As it is involuntary, the words are not chosen for effect socially. At a guess, swear words are noticed more by onlookers.

SqueezeBabe said:

WHY swearing (you’ll need to answer that bit before you can answer the next bit)

And if the person doesn’t KNOW any naughty words, then what words would they use instead.

I don’t know.

I have no idea.

SqueezeBabe said:

I’m gonna be blunt here…

No one has actually answered the question – you’ve all picked apart the bits of the question you don’t like, jumped up and down and told me that the bits I want to know about are “wrong” in some way or the other, and offered anecdotal evidence (which some of it is admittedly informative and amusing)

Regardless of HOW I asked the question – I still don’t have an answer for the bits I want, so I’ll break it down into little words:

WHY swearing (you’ll need to answer that bit before you can answer the next bit)

And if the person doesn’t KNOW any naughty words, then what words would they use instead.

Squeezy, i think you really need to find a more specialized forum where you could get those answers from…
here it’s a bit like asking a DR a veterinary question, they may have an idea, but not good enough to confirm your question

And for the second part……I’d think the brain would just choose any random word that it knows and use that.

>WHY swearing

Nobody knows. There might be some theories out there, but generally speaking people with Coprolalia (compulsive sounding of taboo words etc) have no idea why they utter those particular words, and usually would rather not (especially in public).

Here’s the Wiki entry on it:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Coprolalia

NIH information:

http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmedhealth/PMH0001744/

Bubblecar said:

>WHY swearing

Nobody knows. There might be some theories out there, but generally speaking people with Coprolalia (compulsive sounding of taboo words etc) have no idea why they utter those particular words, and usually would rather not (especially in public).

Here’s the Wiki entry on it:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Coprolalia

ok… in the absence of knowing any “taboo” words, would they then say words that they feel are “taboo” or would it go undiagnosed until they learnt some?*

• Pure speculation on my part, for opening up discussion; again, not expecting anybody to know the answer.

http://www.tourette.org.au/

From that page. It seems to be associated with more serious neurological problems:

An international, multi-site database of 3,500 individuals with Tourette syndrome drawn from clinical samples found 14% of patients with Tourette’s accompanied by comorbid conditions had coprolalia, while only 6% of those with uncomplicated (“pure”) Tourette’s had coprolalia. The same study found that the chance of having coprolalia increased linearly with the number of comorbid conditions: patients with four or five other conditions—in addition to tics—were four to six times more likely to have coprolalia than persons with only Tourette’s. One study of a general pediatric practice found an 8% rate of coprolalia in children with Tourette syndrome, while another study found 60% in a tertiary referral center (where typically more severe cases are referred). A more recent Brazilian study of 44 patients with Tourette syndrome found a 14% rate of coprolalia; a Costa Rican study of 85 subjects found 20% had coprolalia; a Chilean study of 70 patients found an 8.5% rate of coprolalia; older studies in Japan reported a 4% incidence of coprolalia; and a still older clinical study in Brazil found 28% of 32 patients had coprolalia. Considering the methodological issues affecting all of these reports, the consensus of the Tourette Syndrome Association is that the actual number is below 15 percent.

and thank you to Buffy and Bubblecar, I appreciate the information you’ve linked me to.

>From that page. It seems to be associated with more serious neurological problems:

Coprolalia, that is. TS isn’t necessarily a serious problem.

Bubblecar said:

>From that page. It seems to be associated with more serious neurological problems:

Coprolalia, that is. TS isn’t necessarily a serious problem.

So you can have Coprolalia without necessarily having “Tourettes”?

SqueezeBabe said:

Bubblecar said:

>From that page. It seems to be associated with more serious neurological problems:

Coprolalia, that is. TS isn’t necessarily a serious problem.

So you can have Coprolalia without necessarily having “Tourettes”?

Yes:

Coprolalia is not unique to tic disorders; it is also a rare symptom of other neurological disorders. It may occur after injuries to the brain such as stroke and encephalitis; in other neurological conditions such as choreoacanthocytosis, seizures, and Lesch–Nyhan syndrome; and rarely in persons with dementia or obsessive–compulsive disorder in the absence of tics.

>ok… in the absence of knowing any “taboo” words, would they then say words that they feel are “taboo” or would it go undiagnosed until they learnt some?*

This is a complex question involving mechanisms of mental or brain function, doubtful neuroscience has cracked it.

It raises the question of what would be an inappropriate grunt from a monkey, for example, and applied to humans it raises the question of if our higher language is possible without inappropriate grunts existing. If a lot of brain function were inhibitory, and verbalizing involves drives from intention, which no doubt it must, some thought through, some not maybe, then part of some field of inhibitory aspects if transiently lost might result in verbalizations that don’t have running control of while being sounded.

I thought it was something to do with swearing’s status a kind of habitual response in times of acute pain or stress, rather than a processed language response.

And that there is overlap or clustering of neuro type things doesn’t surprise me at all.

I’m not sure if it’s relevant, but a couple of times I have had hiccups for several hours and by the second hour I was getting so pissed off with it that I would mutter an angry “fuck!” each time because I couldn’t stop it and was getting frustrated that I couldn’t control my own body.

Perhaps it’s a similar frustration on the part of the tourettes sufferer that results in the outburst.

Kingy said:

I’m not sure if it’s relevant, but a couple of times I have had hiccups for several hours and by the second hour I was getting so pissed off with it that I would mutter an angry “fuck!” each time because I couldn’t stop it and was getting frustrated that I couldn’t control my own body.

Perhaps it’s a similar frustration on the part of the tourettes sufferer that results in the outburst.

So…. if you didn’t know the word “fuck” (or any other swear word) could you speculate on what kind of word you would use instead?

SqueezeBabe said:

Kingy said:

I’m not sure if it’s relevant, but a couple of times I have had hiccups for several hours and by the second hour I was getting so pissed off with it that I would mutter an angry “fuck!” each time because I couldn’t stop it and was getting frustrated that I couldn’t control my own body.

Perhaps it’s a similar frustration on the part of the tourettes sufferer that results in the outburst.

So…. if you didn’t know the word “fuck” (or any other swear word) could you speculate on what kind of word you would use instead?

Cad, blighter, nincompoop, etc.

PermeateFree said:

SqueezeBabe said:

Kingy said:

I’m not sure if it’s relevant, but a couple of times I have had hiccups for several hours and by the second hour I was getting so pissed off with it that I would mutter an angry “fuck!” each time because I couldn’t stop it and was getting frustrated that I couldn’t control my own body.

Perhaps it’s a similar frustration on the part of the tourettes sufferer that results in the outburst.

So…. if you didn’t know the word “fuck” (or any other swear word) could you speculate on what kind of word you would use instead?

Cad, blighter, nincompoop, etc.

Jesus.

Tamb said:

PermeateFree said:

SqueezeBabe said:

So…. if you didn’t know the word “fuck” (or any other swear word) could you speculate on what kind of word you would use instead?

Cad, blighter, nincompoop, etc.

Jesus.

Bounder.

PermeateFree said:

Tamb said:

PermeateFree said:

Cad, blighter, nincompoop, etc.

Jesus.

Bounder.

Abbott.

(hic)antidisestablishmen(hic)tarianism!

“The entertainment industry has been criticized for depicting those with Tourette syndrome as social misfits whose only tic is coprolalia, which has furthered stigmatization and the public’s misunderstanding of those with Tourette’s. The coprolalic symptoms of Tourette’s are also fodder for radio and television talk shows in the US and in the British media.”

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Tourette_syndrome

Tamb said:

PermeateFree said:

Tamb said:

Jesus.

Bounder.

Abbott.

Man! You could go on forever!

I think Sibeen has Tourettes when he watches the cricket.

I don’t believe they fully understand why. The involuntary reactions maybe more likely while stressed ….from memory. Presumably the words must have been heard and learned prior to being repeated though.

> I know that growling and “barking” can be part of the behaviour, so is perhaps swearing are more “articulate” way of doing that?

According to Billy Connolley that’s the case. I know, he’s not a particularly reliable source. He says that people with Tourettes start off barking and only later in the development of the disorder do those barks turn into swear words.

In one TV program about Tourettes, it is easy to tell the difference between swearing as part of the disorder and deliberate swearing.