Had a mate drop in last evening. He has a 24 year old daughter who has suffered from mental disorders for quite a long time and had been diagnosed as bipolar. Cutting long story short, it now appears that she has been diagnosed with Lyme disease, although she has never been outside the country. The diagnosing doctor believes that the Lyme disease was causing the majority of the mental issues. There also appeared to be quite a reasonable amount of woo involved in the description, albeit that Gary was a tad under the weather at 1 am.

So I’ve just had a look around and discovered this site:

http://www.drmayne.com/Lyme.htm?gclid=CPeC3KqxyL0CFYWXvQodJqAAYw

Lots of colours, so perhaps the woo factor can be discounted (sic).

Any of you medical types wish to comment?

Another site:

http://www.lymedisease.org.au/

I listened to this interesting piece about Lyme disease ages ago, well worth a listen.

http://www.abc.net.au/radionational/programs/backgroundbriefing/2013-05-12/4675072

Hard to find anything about the case against Lyme disease on that site, sibeen, so I did a little hunting and came up with this from the Lancet.

http://www.thelancet.com/journals/laninf/article/PIIS1473-3099(11)70034-2/fulltext

Seems to be a lot of controversy out there.

Mostly Woo, but a faint possibility. IIRC, most of the reported ‘tests’ weren’t up to int. standards.

http://medent.usyd.edu.au/fact/lyme%20disease.htm

https://www.mja.com.au/journal/2012/196/5/first-report-human-babesiosis-australia

Good grief, now there is ‘Lyme denialism’, only this time it is the mainstream medical establishment who are accused of being deniers.

Chronic Lyme Disease: Liberation from Lyme Denialism

The view from the IDSA to the Senate Committee

Much of the controversy seems to be about the nature of the chronic effects.

My mate mentioned that he had to have his daughter’s blood sample tested in Germany as Australian labs refused to test for Lyme disease.

I found that passing strange.

bump for the ‘tard.

What poik said, pretty much.

There’s always a first time for everything, so just because something’s never been proved, doesn’t mean it aint possible. Although authochthonous* transmission of Lyme in Australia would be pretty crap.

*Originating where found, ie caught and detected in Australia, rather than being caught OS and detected here

Feck.

*autochthonous

If we look at uptodate, “Literature review current through: Mar 2014”, we have
The presence of endemic Lyme disease and plague has not been proven in Australia or New Zealand.

The people who want treatment have a huge medical bill as the medications are not supported with the PBS system in Australia.

ratty one said:

The people who want treatment have a huge medical bill as the medications are not supported with the PBS system in Australia.

Don’t think the taxpayer would like funding every fruit loops delusion about infection with LD.

ratty one said:

The people who want treatment have a huge medical bill as the medications are not supported with the PBS system in Australia.

These are all available and cheap-as.

Dosing of antibiotics for early Lyme disease is as follows (table 1):

●Doxycycline – 100 mg orally twice daily for adults; 2 mg/kg twice daily (maximum 100 mg dose) for children ≥8 years of age

●Amoxicillin – 500 mg three times daily for adults; 50 mg/kg per day in three divided doses (maximum 500 mg per dose) for children

●Cefuroxime axetil – 500 mg twice daily for adults; 30 mg/kg per day in two divided doses (maximum 500 mg per dose) for children

poikilotherm said:

ratty one said:

The people who want treatment have a huge medical bill as the medications are not supported with the PBS system in Australia.

Don’t think the taxpayer would like funding every fruit loops delusion about infection with LD.

There are also a few fruit loop Doctors who think Lyme disease exists in Australia.

One of quite a list of infections that can fuck a person up, for a while, even a long while, sometimes permanently. Some infections I guess tend dysregulation of endocrine function, immune function etc, after some period changes in the typical equilibrium of broader aspects of CNS function too are probably altered, which may be causes by emotional or psychological stressors (in response to physiological stressors). I think infections of various sorts have an (shared perhaps) interest in dysregulation of this sort, weakening the host,

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Lyme_disease_controversy

PermeateFree said:

poikilotherm said:

ratty one said:

The people who want treatment have a huge medical bill as the medications are not supported with the PBS system in Australia.

Don’t think the taxpayer would like funding every fruit loops delusion about infection with LD.

There are also a few fruit loop Doctors who think Lyme disease exists in Australia.

Probably.

Ooh, one of my more, um, odd patients has recently told me about this and how she can’t afford to have the tests done overseas and she is sure she has it.

OCDC said:

ratty one said:

The people who want treatment have a huge medical bill as the medications are not supported with the PBS system in Australia.

These are all available and cheap-as.

Dosing of antibiotics for early Lyme disease is as follows (table 1):

●Doxycycline – 100 mg orally twice daily for adults; 2 mg/kg twice daily (maximum 100 mg dose) for children ≥8 years of age

●Amoxicillin – 500 mg three times daily for adults; 50 mg/kg per day in three divided doses (maximum 500 mg per dose) for children

●Cefuroxime axetil – 500 mg twice daily for adults; 30 mg/kg per day in two divided doses (maximum 500 mg per dose) for children

Good news if effective treatments.

Some people had symptoms that resulted in motor neurone complications from memory with impaired and impeded the person’s ability to perform their daily activities and work duties.

Apparently the delay in treatment was alleged to be part of the reason for the complications.

PermeateFree said:

poikilotherm said:

ratty one said:

The people who want treatment have a huge medical bill as the medications are not supported with the PBS system in Australia.

Don’t think the taxpayer would like funding every fruit loops delusion about infection with LD.

There are also a few fruit loop Doctors who think Lyme disease exists in Australia.

Denier!

morrie said:

PermeateFree said:

poikilotherm said:

Don’t think the taxpayer would like funding every fruit loops delusion about infection with LD.

There are also a few fruit loop Doctors who think Lyme disease exists in Australia.

Denier!

You alright morrie? Haven’t been working too hard I hope.

I particularly liked the fact that my patient’s Lyme disease was diagnosed by her naturopath…

buffy said:

I particularly liked the fact that my patient’s Lyme disease was diagnosed by her naturopath…

The good Dr. Swan on Radio National had a program on this very subject. There were those who thought it a load of tosh, whilst others (equally qualified) thought Lyme disease was in Australia, but poorly diagnosed.

buffy said:

I particularly liked the fact that my patient’s Lyme disease was diagnosed by her naturopath…

Do you know if any of your crazier patients see iridologists?

Possibly, although I don’t think we have anyone in town at the moment doing that. The ‘health’ shop about 4 up from my practice had a psychic in there in February. I’m not sure what the chiros are doing at present. I did see one of them as a patient a couple of years ago…I may have told him that I was prepared to give iridology the benefit of the doubt – but not when different practitioners use different iris maps. I have also been known to ask someone who asks me about iridology if they would be prepared to consider that all parts of the body were somehow mapped onto their calf muscle. The iris is, after all, just a sphincter.

Maybe all parts of the body are somehow mapped onto other sphincters….

Unfortunately we don’t yet have any actual evidence that Lyme disease is present in Australia.

Hypothetical: what happens if sibeen’s mate’s daughter’s blood test in Germany comes back positive for Lyme?

Divine Angel said:

Hypothetical: what happens if sibeen’s mate’s daughter’s blood test in Germany comes back positive for Lyme?

Then we would:
a) do a different test (sometimes things cross-react)
b) discuss with our colleagues
c) present at grand rounds
d) publish a paper.

Divine Angel said:

Hypothetical: what happens if sibeen’s mate’s daughter’s blood test in Germany comes back positive for Lyme?

It did, apparently; but this is where the woo began to set in. To cure it you need antibiotics – but not too heavy a dose – followed by naturopathy – then followed by more antibiotics – more naturopathy – repeat dose.

My mate was fairly pissed, and he’s been putting up with a mentally ill daughter for ten years or so, so I wasn’t about to start scoffing aloud.

sibeen said:

Divine Angel said:

Hypothetical: what happens if sibeen’s mate’s daughter’s blood test in Germany comes back positive for Lyme?

It did, apparently; but this is where the woo began to set in. To cure it you need antibiotics – but not too heavy a dose – followed by naturopathy – then followed by more antibiotics – more naturopathy – repeat dose.

My mate was fairly pissed, and he’s been putting up with a mentally ill daughter for ten years or so, so I wasn’t about to start scoffing aloud.

Ah, so they ‘sent the sample to Germany’…

OCDC said:

Unfortunately we don’t yet have any actual evidence that Lyme disease is present in Australia.

That is where the controversy begins, as apparently the views it is not here are so strong that acquiring the evidence has more than its share of problems.

PermeateFree said:

morrie said:

PermeateFree said:

There are also a few fruit loop Doctors who think Lyme disease exists in Australia.

Denier!

You alright morrie? Haven’t been working too hard I hope.

Not really, but I have finished the ironing now, so I can kick back and relax.

morrie said:

PermeateFree said:

morrie said:

Denier!

You alright morrie? Haven’t been working too hard I hope.

Not really, but I have finished the ironing now, so I can kick back and relax.

It’s a bitch isn’t it, but fortunately I haven’t had need to use one for years.

Hi i’m Jackie Arnold world series baseball pro 2020.

It took hard work to get to the top of my game but i couldn’t have done it without “SaneApse” Tm.

I was a kid that dreamed of becoming a pro baseballer, then around 13 something went wrong i started becoming withdrawn and suffering delusions that worried my friends and parents. This was the start of a serious medical condition – Schizophrenia or “Bi-Polar” as it is commonly called.

There was an answer – “SaneApse” Tm.

“SaneApse” Tm is a totally safe prescription solution available from your health provider – today.

Thanks to medical research scientists discovered that “Bi-Polar” was caused by a genetic/ biochemical disturbance and transmitted by some mosquitoes, for years the only answer were powerful drugs that caused lethargy and a disrupted quality of lifestyle, all with no real cure.

Today “SaneApse” Tm is the doctor preferred one, two, three step programme administered by your own health provider that should clear bi polar within 4 weeks and get your life back on track.

Step one requires an intial consult with your doctor priming the brain for the second step. Step one primes the brain using a combination of stem cell technology and anti virals this intial consult should last around 2 hours. In the following weeks you should notice some small differences – your thinking will become clearer as the mind starts rebuilding new connections and aquiring a chemical balance – in this period you should not feel worried, this is totally normal.
Another visit to your health provider the further week involves a short second dose of the primer to help you gain lifestyle balance.

Step two is the oral dose (holds pills to the camera) requiring the user to take 2 easy to swallow pills every morning and evening. By the following two weeks you will notice clear differences, you will be able to think clearly and not suffer from the common signs of bi polar.

Step three is a final quick consult with your healthcare practioner.

The “SaneApse” Tm one, two, three programme is still the number one preferred programme for clearing “Bi-Polar”. I recommend “SaneApse” Tm it helped me, it will help you too, take back your confidence, contact your local health provider for further details – and hit a home run!

wookiemeister said:

Hi i’m Jackie Arnold world series baseball pro 2020.

It took hard work to get to the top of my game but i couldn’t have done it without “SaneApse” Tm.

I was a kid that dreamed of becoming a pro baseballer, then around 13 something went wrong i started becoming withdrawn and suffering delusions that worried my friends and parents. This was the start of a serious medical condition – Schizophrenia or “Bi-Polar” as it is commonly called.

There was an answer – “SaneApse” Tm.

“SaneApse” Tm is a totally safe prescription solution available from your health provider – today.

Thanks to medical research scientists discovered that “Bi-Polar” was caused by a genetic/ biochemical disturbance and transmitted by some mosquitoes, for years the only answer were powerful drugs that caused lethargy and a disrupted quality of lifestyle, all with no real cure.

Today “SaneApse” Tm is the doctor preferred one, two, three step programme administered by your own health provider that should clear bi polar within 4 weeks and get your life back on track.

Step one requires an intial consult with your doctor priming the brain for the second step. Step one primes the brain using a combination of stem cell technology and anti virals this intial consult should last around 2 hours. In the following weeks you should notice some small differences – your thinking will become clearer as the mind starts rebuilding new connections and aquiring a chemical balance – in this period you should not feel worried, this is totally normal.
Another visit to your health provider the further week involves a short second dose of the primer to help you gain lifestyle balance.

Step two is the oral dose (holds pills to the camera) requiring the user to take 2 easy to swallow pills every morning and evening. By the following two weeks you will notice clear differences, you will be able to think clearly and not suffer from the common signs of bi polar.

Step three is a final quick consult with your healthcare practioner.

The “SaneApse” Tm one, two, three programme is still the number one preferred programme for clearing “Bi-Polar”. I recommend “SaneApse” Tm it helped me, it will help you too, take back your confidence, contact your local health provider for further details – and hit a home run!

That’s worth it at any price.

I think it must be a word play on synapse and sane

Since when has schizophrenia been called bipolar?

Divine Angel said:

Since when has schizophrenia been called bipolar?

Schizophrenia and bipolar disorder are mental diseases (used interchangeably with disorder) in the Diagnostic and Statistical Manual of Mental Disorders fourth edition (DSM IV). Schizophrenia is a psychotic disorder, and bipolar disorder is a mood disorder. However, because of their very similar symptoms, differentiating between the two tends to be difficult. Specific aspects of each disease makes the diagnosis clearer to the psychiatrist.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Comparison_of_bipolar_disorder_and_schizophrenia

it was just my musings one night that this sort of thing could be caused by a disease carried by mosquitoes

Divine Angel said:

Since when has schizophrenia been called bipolar?

Since people don’t know what they are.

Divine Angel said:

Since when has schizophrenia been called bipolar?

Since teh wak went to teh wik.

wookiemeister said:

it was just my musings one night that this sort of thing could be caused by a disease carried by mosquitoes

And what have we told you about musing?

Witty Rejoinder said:

wookiemeister said:

it was just my musings one night that this sort of thing could be caused by a disease carried by mosquitoes

And what have we told you about musing?

It’s cruel.

poikilotherm said:

Divine Angel said:

Since when has schizophrenia been called bipolar?

Since teh wak went to teh wik.

Medical care is 3rd leading cause of death in U.S.
http://chriskresser.com/medical-care-is-the-3rd-leading-cause-of-death-in-the-us

Australian woman delivers her own baby alone in hospital and even has to use painkillers from her handbag

Read more: http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-2282386/Australian-woman-delivers-baby-hospital-use-painkillers-handbag.html#ixzz2y0FY4VYA
Follow us: @MailOnline on Twitter | DailyMail on Facebook

I’m sure there was something about someone being turned away by a hospital in Sydney (?) last week???

the problem with the medicos is that they approach everything from the position that they know everything and no one can know more than them.

historically the medical profession has maligned and ignored some of the greatest discoveries in human health

my approach is this – if you are suspicious that the doctor knows bugger all and has some mental block go somewhere else or find another one, its just like any other trade – some are good – some are bad – some will kill you.

wookiemeister said:

– some are good – some are bad – some will kill you.

And then there’s Alex.

Logical leaps from Lyme disease.

Divine Angel said:

wookiemeister said:

– some are good – some are bad – some will kill you.

And then there’s Alex.

watch the GPs they can be the shoddiest of the lot

GPs can be the ones that never specialised

an empty waiting room can be a good sign that something is wrong – for whatever reason no one wants to go there

its half the reason they keep you waiting – they need people in the waiting room to make the place look as if lots of people want to use the place. the other reason is that doctors tend to buggerise around between their patients

Yea, there’s no exam or anything to be a GP, you just finish uni and bang, you’re GP.

wookiemeister said:

poikilotherm said:

Divine Angel said:

Since when has schizophrenia been called bipolar?

Since teh wak went to teh wik.

Medical care is 3rd leading cause of death in U.S.
http://chriskresser.com/medical-care-is-the-3rd-leading-cause-of-death-in-the-us

Australian woman delivers her own baby alone in hospital and even has to use painkillers from her handbag

Read more: http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-2282386/Australian-woman-delivers-baby-hospital-use-painkillers-handbag.html#ixzz2y0FY4VYA
Follow us: @MailOnline on Twitter | DailyMail on Facebook

I’m sure there was something about someone being turned away by a hospital in Sydney (?) last week???

the problem with the medicos is that they approach everything from the position that they know everything and no one can know more than them.

historically the medical profession has maligned and ignored some of the greatest discoveries in human health

my approach is this – if you are suspicious that the doctor knows bugger all and has some mental block go somewhere else or find another one, its just like any other trade – some are good – some are bad – some will kill you.

Don’t think it only applies to medicos, but with many professions. Often people have their own little patch of turf, were interlopers are not encouraged, then of course you have “my qualifications are bigger than yours.”

Don’t even need to finish uni to be a Kweenzland GP.

look out for the “superclinics”

it will have cost them lots of money to put the place together as a private interest

they will normally cut costs on the basic equipment such as sphygmomanometers and other stuff they can get away with

somewhere using some dodgy heart monitor from the ark is another sign they don’t want to spend money, generally practice managers HATE spending money. oh yes so you go to the doctor and you tell him about your jaw pain and arm pain, they put you on the heart monitor and everything is fine and the GP sends you away with everything fine… go to the hospital, only a specialist can determine this, given the signs they should investigate, one testing session isn’t enough to know for sure.

how a clinic runs is actually down to the practice manager and how they have interpreted the rules

Need something to stop the shit.

poikilotherm said:

Need something to stop the shit.

LOL

poikilotherm said:

Need something to stop the shit.

What does one recommend for verbal diarrhea?

Saddest though that I recognise the molecule sans link…

OCDC said:

Saddest though that I recognise the molecule sans link…

I haven’t got a clue, and feeling left out.

party_pants said:

OCDC said:

Saddest though that I recognise the molecule sans link…

I haven’t got a clue, and feeling left out.

loperamide, for diarrhoea.

http://besthealth.com.au/drugs-and-medical-errors-killing-one-of-every-five-australians/

I·at·ro·gen·ic Show IPA

adjective
(of a medical disorder) caused by the diagnosis, manner, or treatment of a physician.

To be convinced i’d have to see test results, that showed whole pathogen, or fragments, or/and antibodies that similarly reliably are known to be specific of Lyme disease.

OCDC said:

What poik said, pretty much.

There’s always a first time for everything, so just because something’s never been proved, doesn’t mean it aint possible. Although autochthonous* transmission of Lyme in Australia would be pretty crap.

*Originating where found, ie caught and detected in Australia, rather than being caught OS and detected here

being caught OS and detected here

Do you medical types use allochthonous?

Michael V said:

OCDC said:

What poik said, pretty much.

There’s always a first time for everything, so just because something’s never been proved, doesn’t mean it aint possible. Although autochthonous* transmission of Lyme in Australia would be pretty crap.

*Originating where found, ie caught and detected in Australia, rather than being caught OS and detected here

being caught OS and detected here

Do you medical types use allochthonous?

No, but I’ll try to, just for you.

OCDC said:

Michael V said:

OCDC said:

What poik said, pretty much.

There’s always a first time for everything, so just because something’s never been proved, doesn’t mean it aint possible. Although autochthonous* transmission of Lyme in Australia would be pretty crap.

*Originating where found, ie caught and detected in Australia, rather than being caught OS and detected here

being caught OS and detected here

Do you medical types use allochthonous?

No, but I’ll try to, just for you.

Oh, goody!

:)