ChrispenEvan (post: 556200) in chat this morning, put this up:

how wealth breeds narcissism

“Call it the asshole effect. That is the term coined by US psychologist Paul Piff after he did some stunning new research into the effects of wealth and inequality on people’s attitudes.

As we ponder Joe Hockey’s budget and his division of the world into “leaners” and “lifters”, as we learn from Oxfam that the richest 1% of Australians now own the same wealth as the bottom 60%, we would do well to consider the implications of Piff’s studies. He found that as people grow wealthier, they are more likely to feel entitled, to become meaner and be more likely to exploit others, even to cheat.

Piff conducted a series of revealing experiments. One was remarkably simple. Researchers positioned themselves at crossroads. They watched out for aggressive, selfish behaviour among drivers, and recorded the make and model of the car. Piff found drivers of expensive, high-status vehicles behave worse than those sputtering along in battered Toyota Corollas.

They were four times more likely to cut off drivers with lower status vehicles. As a pedestrian looking carefully left and right before using a crossing, you should pay attention to the kind of car bearing down on you. Drivers of high-status vehicles were three times as likely to fail to yield at pedestrian crossings. In contrast, all the drivers of the least expensive type of car gave way to pedestrians.”

Fascinated by these results,…

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CE’s reference was a newspaper article, summarised from a book, by the author of that book, seemingly as a book sales document.

http://www.theguardian.com/commentisfree/2014/jul/08/the-age-of-entitlement-how-wealth-breeds-narcissism?CMP=soc_567

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However, despite my cynicism, there is quite a bit of research literature about this topic with more to find, I’m sure:

Review article:

http://www.scientificamerican.com/article/how-wealth-reduces-compassion/

Abstracts for primary papers:

http://www.pnas.org/content/109/11/4086.short

http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/22148992

http://pss.sagepub.com/content/21/11/1716.abstract

http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/19076316

And a newspaper commentary article written by the primary authors of these papers:

http://www.nytimes.com/roomfordebate/2012/03/15/does-morality-have-a-place-on-wall-street/greed-on-wall-street-prevents-good-from-happening

Anecdote alert: The rudest customers are consistently the rich businessmen types. Although, the Doughnut Thrower was a tradie.

I’d go further. Some of the nicest, quietest, politest people I see are the Old Rich. Families who have been here for over a hundred years, are settled in their wealth and are not ostentatious. This group also contains some wonderful eccentrics. One in particular is the most invisible philanthropist you could imagine. Until quite recently very few people knew just what large sums of money he donated to various causes.

Some of the hardest to get along with are what you might call Nouveau Riche. Recent money, intending to show everyone how much superior they are. I have some people that I know that no matter what I prescribe, it will be wrong, and they will complain so that I have to change it (usually by a miniscule amount) at least once. It happens every time, year after year. I’m not that bad at my job. These people just need to show you that you don’t know best.

buffy said:

I’d go further. Some of the nicest, quietest, politest people I see are the Old Rich. Families who have been here for over a hundred years, are settled in their wealth and are not ostentatious. This group also contains some wonderful eccentrics. One in particular is the most invisible philanthropist you could imagine. Until quite recently very few people knew just what large sums of money he donated to various causes.

Some of the hardest to get along with are what you might call Nouveau Riche. Recent money, intending to show everyone how much superior they are. I have some people that I know that no matter what I prescribe, it will be wrong, and they will complain so that I have to change it (usually by a miniscule amount) at least once. It happens every time, year after year. I’m not that bad at my job. These people just need to show you that you don’t know best.

there is quite often a large difference in attitudes between those who worked hard for their riches and those who inherited their wealth

The nicest people in the world are the poor.

well this subject is covered extensively in tragedy

someone of position and no doubt wealth goes too far and brings their world crashing down

narcissism , entitlement, greed , hubris and normally not mentioned – fanaticism etc normally pre empts murder, treachery. cause and effect.

AwesomeO said:

The nicest people in the world are the poor.

I’m not sure

you can have money and be a very nice person I’m sure but poverty itself I don’t think really equates to being nice

the other thing about being nice is that you can be nice to lots of people but be a complete arsehole to some other people

AwesomeO said:

The nicest people in the world are the poor.

Might not hold in The Congo.

Michael V said:

Researchers positioned themselves at crossroads. They watched out for aggressive, selfish behaviour among drivers, and recorded the make and model of the car. Piff found drivers of expensive, high-status vehicles behave worse than those sputtering along in battered Toyota Corollas.

Yep.

if I had my way I’d ban money, its very divisive

if everyone worked a small amount of time a day everyone would have a job, everyone could go on holiday, everyone could have a car

maybe you need a system that caps the amount of money that anyone can earn (not tax)

OCDC said:

Michael V said:

Researchers positioned themselves at crossroads. They watched out for aggressive, selfish behaviour among drivers, and recorded the make and model of the car. Piff found drivers of expensive, high-status vehicles behave worse than those sputtering along in battered Toyota Corollas.

Yep.

Narcissistic?

Glad they’re social population-based studies.

The nicest people in the world are those who are the nicest people in the world

If you spread the wealth evenly across everyone, in a few years you’d still find a division between poor and rich, which would keep getting wider. Some people are financially savvy, some aren’t.

wookiemeister said:

AwesomeO said:

The nicest people in the world are the poor.

I’m not sure

you can have money and be a very nice person I’m sure but poverty itself I don’t think really equates to being nice

the other thing about being nice is that you can be nice to lots of people but be a complete arsehole to some other people

I need to find the TIC key.

CrazyNeutrino said:

The nicest people in the world are those who are the nicest people in the world

And Honda riders.

Divine Angel said:

If you spread the wealth evenly across everyone, in a few years you’d still find a division between poor and rich, which would keep getting wider. Some people are financially savvy, some aren’t.

There are always those people who want other peoples money

like Gina, Liberals, Blind Corporations etc

CrazyNeutrino said:

There are always those people who want other peoples money

like Gina, Liberals, Blind Corporations etc

I think that’s harsh on Gina. She’s got plenty of her own money, she is after more through running a profitable mining business selling ore to foreigners. She isn’t after everyone else’s money, she just doesn’t want to share it with anyone or pay taxes.

I’m a nice person – until you over take me – then I will smite thee with a spiteful vengeance

party_pants said:

CrazyNeutrino said:

There are always those people who want other peoples money

like Gina, Liberals, Blind Corporations etc

I think that’s harsh on Gina. She’s got plenty of her own money, she is after more through running a profitable mining business selling ore to foreigners. She isn’t after everyone else’s money, she just doesn’t want to share it with anyone or pay taxes.

is it true she ate some of her puppies?

wookiemeister said:

party_pants said:

CrazyNeutrino said:

There are always those people who want other peoples money

like Gina, Liberals, Blind Corporations etc

I think that’s harsh on Gina. She’s got plenty of her own money, she is after more through running a profitable mining business selling ore to foreigners. She isn’t after everyone else’s money, she just doesn’t want to share it with anyone or pay taxes.

is it true she ate some of her puppies?

how the hell would I know?

… ask Dropbear.

party_pants said:

wookiemeister said:

party_pants said:

I think that’s harsh on Gina. She’s got plenty of her own money, she is after more through running a profitable mining business selling ore to foreigners. She isn’t after everyone else’s money, she just doesn’t want to share it with anyone or pay taxes.

is it true she ate some of her puppies?

how the hell would I know?

… ask Dropbear.

the one that got away

I approve of the comprehensive effort that seems to have gone into collecting content for the initial post.

I’d probably change
the thread title to

The passion for wealth reduces compassion (breeds greed, narcissism)

Michael V said:

ChrispenEvan (post: 556200) in chat this morning, put this up:

how wealth breeds narcissism

“Call it the asshole effect. That is the term coined by US psychologist Paul Piff after he did some stunning new research into the effects of wealth and inequality on people’s attitudes.

Piff conducted a series of revealing experiments. One was remarkably simple. Researchers positioned themselves at crossroads. They watched out for aggressive, selfish behaviour among drivers, and recorded the make and model of the car. Piff found drivers of expensive, high-status vehicles behave worse than those sputtering along in battered Toyota Corollas.

They were four times more likely to cut off drivers with lower status vehicles. As a pedestrian looking carefully left and right before using a crossing, you should pay attention to the kind of car bearing down on you. Drivers of high-status vehicles were three times as likely to fail to yield at pedestrian crossings. In contrast, all the drivers of the least expensive type of car gave way to pedestrians.”

Fascinated by these results,…

That’s not a measure of “wealth”, it’s a measure of “ostentation: the pretentious or showy display of wealth and luxury, designed to impress.”

I would also hazard a guess that there is no correlation between ostentation and real wealth.

I wear a huge multicoloured plumage when I travel in public

wookiemeister said:

I wear a huge multicoloured plumage when I travel in public

You are a cat.

Ian said:

wookiemeister said:

I wear a huge multicoloured plumage when I travel in public

You are a cat.

I’ve never been a cat in my life

Licks fur furiously

mollwollfumble said:

I would also hazard a guess that there is no correlation between ostentation and real wealth.

If you measure ostentation by the cost of the vehicle being driven I’d suggest that there must be a correlation between wealth and “ostentation”, at least at the lower end of the wealth scale.

The Rev Dodgson said:

mollwollfumble said:

I would also hazard a guess that there is no correlation between ostentation and real wealth.

If you measure ostentation by the cost of the vehicle being driven I’d suggest that there must be a correlation between wealth and “ostentation”, at least at the lower end of the wealth scale.

well given that there are hefty tax concessions related to novated leases of new vehicles I’d argue that there is some sense in driving an expensive car that is not solely related to social status

I’d argue that there is some sense in driving an expensive car that is not solely related to social status
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And vice versa.. Some looxry car owners take their old Corollas into the inner city.

I’d more be inclined to explore the motivationat theory/ies that dominate ideology, the tools at work to make it (ideology) work, those promoted by what we indulge for entertainment also. What people will self-report of their motivation theory/ies.

I’d also explore the tendency of people to rely and contrast, comparison and relative views, what they are willing to self-report of these. I believe there are forms of absolutism sublimated and dissembled presenting as (adjusted, adaptive) relative positions. Of thiis latter thing science and statistical approaches have somewhat encouraged them.

Culture has increasingly become machine-like. The state apparatus (ideological apparatus inclusive) has outsourced to machines.

What dominates ideology is money and clocks/time, more so I think than ever previous in the history of man, of which it isn’t all bad, but some of it is a bit fascist, though guns and SS uniforms have been replaced with other things.