iron ore prices tumble

coal prices tumble

why not process the cheap iron ore here using cheap coal into a product that can be sold processed instead of it being shipped individually to china?

instead of needing two ships to ship the iron ore and coal, why not process the iron ore here, send it to china as a processed product that only needs to be remelted and impurities added to make alloys?

this way you would only need to use one ship that could carry far more of the useable product?

iron ore could be transported from the ore fields to the coal fields and a smelter waiting for it there – right on the edge of the coal pit.

square metal slugs could be transported by train straight to the port

instead of using two trains to go all the way to the port you use one train to take the coal to the iron ore or vica versa and one train to take the highly processed and far more valuable product straight to the port – less trains needed to do the same job that adds value to the product being sold.

the people being travelling to the mines could travel on the train instead of using aircraft

if you had a sleeper arrangement people could travel to the mines overnight on the empty trains

all of the diesel used by the trains could also be made from plain old coal and diesel also be produced at the same place as where the coal is dug out

a special light weight sleeper car could be used to house the workers and this would be their home for the 7 days say
instead of building lots of houses to houses workers that live near the mine , ship houses that can be carried on the trains and make the entire operation fully transportable ?

all of the diesel used by the trains could also be made from plain old coal and diesel also be produced at the same place as where the coal is dug out
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I costed this about 10 years ago. The plant then was around ten billion dollars to construct, and probably half that again to tune up and get running correctly over the next 4-odd years. And the internal cost of mining the coal and producing the diesel worked out around 0.9 cents per litre less than the then pump price of diesel, without amortising the plant.

Need to sell a lot of diesel to make the economics work. A greater than infinite amount, really.

On a train line where some of the biggest players in the industry are already suing the arse off each other to get access to just a few more minutes of track time so they can run one more train-load of ore per day? Yeah… Good luck with that….

Other countries we sell to have either banned or discourage the importation of iron and steel. It is one of the foundations of an industrialised economy, and they prefer to import raw materials and make their own.

1. Because China don’t want steel, that would cost too much. Sort of like buying a cake from a patesserie or making one at home. It’s far cheaper to buy the raw ingredients and do it yourself.

2. Because people who live on the East coast don’t want to spend several days on a train going to a job site in the Pilbara?

Oh, and our iron ore and cola are on opposite sides of the country, and there is no rail connection between them. There is no rail connection between the iron ore and Perth even.

party_pants said:

Oh, and our iron ore and cola are on opposite sides of the country, and there is no rail connection between them. There is no rail connection between the iron ore and Perth even.

How do you access cola then?

what a load of glass half empty mob you lot are.

;-)

ChrispenEvan said:

what a load of glass half empty mob you lot are.

;-)

You got 15 billion dollars? Build me a coal-to-liquids plant, then.

if i had 15 billion i’d be opening one of them cola mines.

Michael V said:

party_pants said:

Oh, and our iron ore and cola are on opposite sides of the country, and there is no rail connection between them. There is no rail connection between the iron ore and Perth even.

How do you access cola then?

Mr V, you need to learn to respond to what I mean, not what I type :p

ChrispenEvan said:

if i had 15 billion i’d be opening one of them cola mines.

Good idea. Mix it with water and fizz, add caffeine and phosphoric acid, put the black liquid in a strange-shaped bottle, and people the world over will get addicted and pay handsomely to get more.

I reckon you could be onto a winner.

Mmmmmm Cola….

I might go an get one.

And mix a little Bourbon into it.

:)

Cola must be coking coal

party_pants said:

Michael V said:

party_pants said:

Oh, and our iron ore and cola are on opposite sides of the country, and there is no rail connection between them. There is no rail connection between the iron ore and Perth even.

How do you access cola then?

Mr V, you need to learn to respond to what I mean, not what I type :p

Where’s the fun in that? Most of what you mean is quite sensible.

ChrispenEvan said:

if i had 15 billion i’d be opening one of them cola mines.

Gee, another mine*. How excitement. Just what we need. Oh, fricking joy. How about one right in the middle of Sydney Harbour?











*I know….it’s okay…don’t worry.

you’d just have to drill bore holes and drop some menthos down em, and whoosher, up from the ground comes a bubbling ….

kii said:

ChrispenEvan said:

if i had 15 billion i’d be opening one of them cola mines.

Gee, another mine*. How excitement. Just what we need. Oh, fricking joy. How about one right in the middle of Sydney Harbour?











*I know….it’s okay…don’t worry.

Well, there was the Balmain Colliery…

Michael V said:

party_pants said:

Michael V said:

How do you access cola then?

Mr V, you need to learn to respond to what I mean, not what I type :p

Where’s the fun in that? Most of what you mean is quite sensible.

I’m saving that to quote later.

Rule 303 said:

On a train line where some of the biggest players in the industry are already suing the arse off each other to get access to just a few more minutes of track time so they can run one more train-load of ore per day? Yeah… Good luck with that….

well you’d need less trains to do the same job

one train goes to the smelter/ iron ore mine, it then picks up the same weight but delivers a much more valuable product, so you need vastly less trains to deliver a much bigger payoff

This isn’t the cartoon I was thinking of, but it’ll do…same sentiment.

I keep telling people here that if they want to visit Australia, they had better hurry, soon it’ll just be a big hole in the ocean..

Here ya go…

i suppose you could ship the coal by boat to WA if railways were out of the question

the idea is you keep the coal mines working even when the coal industry has fallen over

i guess its whatever is the most effective to ship and where the final product is going

but heres another idea you could use the diesel to run the ships taking the final product to wherevever (though a low grade bunker oil is normally used so ive been told)

you could use the heat of the sun to vaporise the coal instead of the valuable product itself

you could make plastics from it as well

wookiemeister said:

you could use the heat of the sun to vaporise the coal instead of the valuable product itself

you could make plastics from it as well

I’m sure that one day using our famous Australian ingenuity they’ll be able to turn coal in to FOOD! Then a show like MKR or whatever can showcase it!

you could make plastics from it as well
—-
Yes you could, but it’s a different back end to the diesel-producing plant. Add another $7 billion.

You could also make pharmaceuticals and fertilisers. Again, different back ends to the plant.

You’re racking up the costs there, Mr wookie.

I say we flood the interior of the continent with desalinated water and grow algae for oil on a vast scale. Process that into diesel and the coal can stay in the ground.

kii said:

wookiemeister said:

you could use the heat of the sun to vaporise the coal instead of the valuable product itself

you could make plastics from it as well

I’m sure that one day using our famous Australian ingenuity they’ll be able to turn coal in to FOOD! Then a show like MKR or whatever can showcase it!

soap

my solution for the expenses part would be to have one plant vaporising the coal and then having the gas separated into different products

you then sell this vapour or liquid via a pipe to each respective industry that needs a particular product

a plastics manufacturer would build his plant nearby to use the specific vapour or liquid coming out of that pipe

the fertiliser industry would build their plant nearby with the particular raw material they need

the oil industry would build their plant nearby to turn the raw material they get from the main plant to make diesel

so you see the actual costs are spread across each industry that needs the raw product

the initial kick starter would be the plant that takes the coal, vaporises it and separates the sublimated product and feeds it to each respective industry that can take that processed product and turn it into something useful

I thought there weren’t silly questions, but there were silly people who asked questions.

bob(from black rock) said:

I thought there weren’t silly questions, but there were silly people who asked questions.

And usually too many questions as well, but provided they are just asking questions, and not taking any silly actions this should minimise most harmful results?

doesn’t really matter anyway , its too hard for Australia to do much of anything these days

its too hard to even do much with the stuff in the ground

> instead of needing two ships to ship the iron ore and coal, why not process the iron ore here, send it to china as a processed product that only needs to be remelted and impurities added to make alloys?

Just do it.

mollwollfumble said:

> instead of needing two ships to ship the iron ore and coal, why not process the iron ore here, send it to china as a processed product that only needs to be remelted and impurities added to make alloys?

Just do it.

dunno

they say it’s a geographical problem, the coal fields are too far away from the iron ore

wookiemeister said:

mollwollfumble said:

> instead of needing two ships to ship the iron ore and coal, why not process the iron ore here, send it to china as a processed product that only needs to be remelted and impurities added to make alloys?

Just do it.

dunno

they say it’s a geographical problem, the coal fields are too far away from the iron ore

It’s a labour problem. Australians won’t work for peanuts wages. Chinese will.

However, under the the terms of the China FTA, ‘substantially-Chinese-owned’ companies can bring to Australia all the labour they want, at any skill level. So, we’ll be seeing a lot more work done here. Just not by Australians, or for Australian pay and conditions.

captain_spalding said:

However, under the the terms of the China FTA, ‘substantially-Chinese-owned’ companies can bring to Australia all the labour they want, at any skill level. So, we’ll be seeing a lot more work done here. Just not by Australians, or for Australian pay and conditions.

I think local pay and conditions will be applied AFAICT.

Witty Rejoinder said:

captain_spalding said:

However, under the the terms of the China FTA, ‘substantially-Chinese-owned’ companies can bring to Australia all the labour they want, at any skill level. So, we’ll be seeing a lot more work done here. Just not by Australians, or for Australian pay and conditions.

I think local pay and conditions will be applied AFAICT.

We’ll see. The Chinese have lot of sway with Australian governments, whether L/NP or ALP. Concessions will certainly be sought, and gradually and assuredly won.