Date: 7/06/2016 11:52:40
From: ChrispenEvan
ID: 903915
Subject: Chicken hatched outside of shell experiment.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=OA_7fXKdLSk
thread title says it.
QI and a different experiment.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=OA_7fXKdLSk
thread title says it.
QI and a different experiment.
ChrispenEvan said:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=OA_7fXKdLSkthread title says it.
QI and a different experiment.
Very interesting.
Give me a buzz when they do it with a mammal!
http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC3185626/
They claimed it was “novel”…
SCIENCE said:
http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC3185626/They claimed it was “novel”…
> Early embryos can be cultured for a short time on filter paper rings
That’s interesting.
> Studying advanced developmental processes such as cardiac morphogenesis are traditionally performed through a window of the eggshell
I’ve seen a picture of this, many decades ago now.
> Eggs were cracked onto a hammock created by a polyurethane membrane (cling wrap) affixed circumferentially to a plastic cup partially filled with sterile water.
All you need is cling wrap on a plastic cup!
Amazing.
> We demonstrate the ability to culture embryos in this way for at least 14 days without morphogenic defect or delay and employ this system in several microsurgical and imaging applications.
14 days. How does that compare to the hatching time? Hatching time is about 21 days. Not quite there yet.
> Give me a buzz when they do it with a mammal!
It would be easiest with a kangaroo, perhaps.
I would guess that it’s easier to do with a platypus than with a chicken, given that the platypus egg is a more primitive creation.
Next step Axlotl tanks
mollwollfumble said:
SCIENCE said:
http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC3185626/They claimed it was “novel”…
> Journal of Visualized Experiments
Can I get that home-delivered?> Early embryos can be cultured for a short time on filter paper rings
That’s interesting.> Studying advanced developmental processes such as cardiac morphogenesis are traditionally performed through a window of the eggshell
I’ve seen a picture of this, many decades ago now.> Eggs were cracked onto a hammock created by a polyurethane membrane (cling wrap) affixed circumferentially to a plastic cup partially filled with sterile water.
All you need is cling wrap on a plastic cup!
Amazing.> We demonstrate the ability to culture embryos in this way for at least 14 days without morphogenic defect or delay and employ this system in several microsurgical and imaging applications.
14 days. How does that compare to the hatching time? Hatching time is about 21 days. Not quite there yet.
> Give me a buzz when they do it with a mammal!
It would be easiest with a kangaroo, perhaps.
I would guess that it’s easier to do with a platypus than with a chicken, given that the platypus egg is a more primitive creation.
Birds and bird eggs have been around far longer than the platypus and they are certainly not more primitive.
PermeateFree said:
mollwollfumble said:
SCIENCE said:
http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC3185626/They claimed it was “novel”…
> Journal of Visualized Experiments
Can I get that home-delivered?> Early embryos can be cultured for a short time on filter paper rings
That’s interesting.> Studying advanced developmental processes such as cardiac morphogenesis are traditionally performed through a window of the eggshell
I’ve seen a picture of this, many decades ago now.> Eggs were cracked onto a hammock created by a polyurethane membrane (cling wrap) affixed circumferentially to a plastic cup partially filled with sterile water.
All you need is cling wrap on a plastic cup!
Amazing.> We demonstrate the ability to culture embryos in this way for at least 14 days without morphogenic defect or delay and employ this system in several microsurgical and imaging applications.
14 days. How does that compare to the hatching time? Hatching time is about 21 days. Not quite there yet.
> Give me a buzz when they do it with a mammal!
It would be easiest with a kangaroo, perhaps.
I would guess that it’s easier to do with a platypus than with a chicken, given that the platypus egg is a more primitive creation.Birds and bird eggs have been around far longer than the platypus and they are certainly not more primitive.
Should have expressed better that the platypus eggs are not more primitive.
PermeateFree said:
:-) I’m being deliberately provocative here, thank you for responding.
Birds and bird eggs have been around far longer than the platypus and they are certainly not more primitive.
Soft shelled eggs like those of the platypus and lizards have been around since the Permian. Hard-shelled eggs like those of the birds and some dinosaurs first appeared in the Triassic or Jurassic.
The current taxonomic scheme has the sauropsida (reptiles, dinosaurs and birds) as descendents of the mammals rather than the other way around. So birds are descended from theropods are descended from Crocodylia are descended from lizards are descended from tortoises are descended from mammals. And the platypus is about the most primitive mammal we have. I noticed recently that the legs of the platypus are splayed outwards like those of lizards, rather than downwards like those of the birds.
I wonder if they could 3D print an egg shape that’s clear and fragile like an egg and pour the embryo into it then glue the cap onto it. The idea being it more perfectly imitates the egg rather than a plastic bag. Or you injection mound a thin clear plastic that can be cracked by a beak
So are those small spots you sometimes see in yolks actually chicks ?
mollwollfumble said:
PermeateFree said::-) I’m being deliberately provocative here, thank you for responding.
Birds and bird eggs have been around far longer than the platypus and they are certainly not more primitive.
Soft shelled eggs like those of the platypus and lizards have been around since the Permian. Hard-shelled eggs like those of the birds and some dinosaurs first appeared in the Triassic or Jurassic.
The current taxonomic scheme has the sauropsida (reptiles, dinosaurs and birds) as descendents of the mammals rather than the other way around. So birds are descended from theropods are descended from Crocodylia are descended from lizards are descended from tortoises are descended from mammals. And the platypus is about the most primitive mammal we have. I noticed recently that the legs of the platypus are splayed outwards like those of lizards, rather than downwards like those of the birds.
I think you confuse the Clade of Sauropsida, which includes birds and currently living reptiles (many of which produce soft shelled eggs), with Synapsida, which include the mammals and from which via evolution, the outer protection of eggs would have been extremely variable. Outer egg structure is far from being a distinguishing feature between reptiles and mammals, as types of reproduction vary considerably.
It is incorrect to describe one method of reproduction as primitive against another, especially when they are from other clades; each evolved to suit the conditions of their environment and as they managed to reproduce (many to this day) they were all successful and not inferior or primitive to another. However some methods evolved later than others, with mammals and internal gestation being one of the latest, so it cannot be regarded (even of monotremes) as being more primitive or older in evolution terms than birds and present day reptiles.
As for “(reptiles, dinosaurs and birds) as descendents of the mammals,” this is clearly not correct.