Stage One:

The site of Torbruk Apartments situated at the peak of Highgate Hill in Brisbane is a heritage listed site and redevelopment is not expected in the near future. It’s greatest feature is not it’s sagging architecture but the real estate it sit’s atop.

If one has had the occasion to enter Torbruk from it’s carpark you will have had the opportunity to view this land feature from the best vantage point. From there it is obvious that Torbruk is built on the core plug of an old volcano and it’s carpark is situated beneath the erosion that has been facilitated by the river it now sit’s over. This provides it’s real estate with even greater natural value as a commodity of science.

Halfway down the erosion slipway that leads to Brisbane river Vulture st. runs across the site of the cities premier public high school. The development I would propose would be to remove the Torbruk structure and replace it with a more soundly concieved high rise building to be dedicated to providing Brisbane State High School with an expanded senior years facility and science department. The intervening real-estate might be bridged for staff and students by a subterranean tunnel and the current car-park developed for the science and trade requirements.

This plan provides the opportunity to open B.S.H.S. to a greater proportion of the community and a motivational component to the education dept’s curricular that is competitive with the south pacific’s foreseeable future. The seniors classroom facililties being set aloft with the outstanding views of brisbane that Torbruk has till now only afforded a small proportion of the community would be set aside to allow the cream of Brisbane’s future the depth of vision that is required to inspire the greatest performance.

<
<
< Not sure if I’d venture beyond providing this one particular development proposal to the local members but I thought it at least worth passing by you folk for an opinion………..

Torbruk?

dv said:

Torbruk?

It was the first high rise apartment building in brisbane and it is heritage listed though it has had to have significant repairs to keep it upright.

dv said:

Torbruk?

Lots of rats there

Postpocelipse said:

dv said:

Torbruk?

It was the first high rise apartment building in brisbane and it is heritage listed though it has had to have significant repairs to keep it upright.

Looks like shit.

dv said:

Postpocelipse said:

dv said:

Torbruk?

It was the first high rise apartment building in brisbane and it is heritage listed though it has had to have significant repairs to keep it upright.

Looks like shit.

My thought’s exactly but the views are freakin monumental…………..

Postpocelipse said:

dv said:

Postpocelipse said:

It was the first high rise apartment building in brisbane and it is heritage listed though it has had to have significant repairs to keep it upright.

Looks like shit.

My thought’s exactly but the views are freakin monumental…………..

Well that’s no reason to heritage list it. You could knock it down and build something better and still have the views.

There is, very fortunately, a park that also I believe is heritage listed so isn’t going anywhere. Fortunate because the last of the old houses that sat beside it have just been turned into high rise apartments.

Anyway, what’s the view of? Brisbane, probably.

dv said:

Postpocelipse said:

dv said:

Looks like shit.

My thought’s exactly but the views are freakin monumental…………..

Well that’s no reason to heritage list it. You could knock it down and build something better and still have the views.

As the local city leading high school is so close I think it is a perfect opportunity to think ahead in a greater than investor pocket sentiment.

dv said:

Anyway, what’s the view of? Brisbane, probably.

From the viewing tower at the top I imagine you could see most of south east qld but I’ve only been half way up where the views are still outstanding.

dv said:

Anyway, what’s the view of? Brisbane, probably.

It overlooks Southbank and Brisbane City

diddly-squat said:

dv said:

Anyway, what’s the view of? Brisbane, probably.

It overlooks Southbank and Brisbane City

I believe with the correctly lofted building you could probably see Mt Tibrogargan from it which is situated 70 km’s to the north.

There is a block of flats similar to this one in Brisbane overlooking Melbourne’s botanical gardens in South Yarra. One of the first apartment buildings in Melbourne and for this reason will never be demolished despite how unattractive it is.

It is also a very exclusive address despite the small size of the apartments. Sir Ninian Stephens was a resident.

Like much brutalist architecture I think there is a valid case for the preservation of these building despite simple aethetics.

Phil_C said:

There is a block of flats similar to this one in Brisbane overlooking Melbourne’s botanical gardens in South Yarra. One of the first apartment buildings in Melbourne and for this reason will never be demolished despite how unattractive it is.

It is also a very exclusive address despite the small size of the apartments. Sir Ninian Stephens was a resident.

Like much brutalist architecture I think there is a valid case for the preservation of these building despite simple aethetics.

Not sure conservatism will satisfy the requirements of Brisbane’s growth in this case.

slice a big chunk off highgate hill and build a massive high rise for 50,000 government housing recipients with another 50,000 refugees

wookiemeister said:

slice a big chunk off highgate hill and build a massive high rise for 50,000 government housing recipients with another 50,000 refugees

Australia’s population is expected to grow to 40 million by 2050. The pollies and big business all look forward to this rapid growth, as it will produce higher figures for them without raising a finger, it will mean more houses, food production, clothes and additional infrastructure to accommodate them. Oh yes, and stuff the environment as it is non-productive.

PermeateFree said:

wookiemeister said:

slice a big chunk off highgate hill and build a massive high rise for 50,000 government housing recipients with another 50,000 refugees

Australia’s population is expected to grow to 40 million by 2050. The pollies and big business all look forward to this rapid growth, as it will produce higher figures for them without raising a finger, it will mean more houses, food production, clothes and additional infrastructure to accommodate them. Oh yes, and stuff the environment as it is non-productive.

it’s a house of cards

wookiemeister said:

PermeateFree said:

wookiemeister said:

slice a big chunk off highgate hill and build a massive high rise for 50,000 government housing recipients with another 50,000 refugees

Australia’s population is expected to grow to 40 million by 2050. The pollies and big business all look forward to this rapid growth, as it will produce higher figures for them without raising a finger, it will mean more houses, food production, clothes and additional infrastructure to accommodate them. Oh yes, and stuff the environment as it is non-productive.

it’s a house of cards

True, this drive for continual growth has to stop sometime. It is a pity it cannot be sooner than later to preserve the good bits we still have.

PermeateFree said:

wookiemeister said:

PermeateFree said:

Australia’s population is expected to grow to 40 million by 2050. The pollies and big business all look forward to this rapid growth, as it will produce higher figures for them without raising a finger, it will mean more houses, food production, clothes and additional infrastructure to accommodate them. Oh yes, and stuff the environment as it is non-productive.

it’s a house of cards

True, this drive for continual growth has to stop sometime. It is a pity it cannot be sooner than later to preserve the good bits we still have.

I guess we’ll have to work with what we’ve got.

Postpocelipse said:

PermeateFree said:

wookiemeister said:

it’s a house of cards

True, this drive for continual growth has to stop sometime. It is a pity it cannot be sooner than later to preserve the good bits we still have.

I guess we’ll have to work with what we’ve got.

457 visas and unsustainable debt

I’m just riding this train till the wheels fall off then I’m gone

wookiemeister said:

Postpocelipse said:

PermeateFree said:

True, this drive for continual growth has to stop sometime. It is a pity it cannot be sooner than later to preserve the good bits we still have.

I guess we’ll have to work with what we’ve got.

457 visas and unsustainable debt

I’m just riding this train till the wheels fall off then I’m gone

You going to then move to another sinking ship?

wookiemeister said:

I’m just riding this train till the wheels fall off then I’m gone

This one’s got those super-conducting mag-lev whosajiggys wooks. Where we going we don’t need wheels…….

PermeateFree said:

True, this drive for continual growth has to stop sometime. It is a pity it cannot be sooner than later to preserve the good bits we still have.

Growf and jobs
jobsan growf

Most of the people who made these jobs from growth, should have been hung from the yardarm centuries past.

I’m quite furious with our council right now because of their lack of appreciation of the need to increase road speeds to match predictable growth. Traffic = const. * Population / Speed. Every reduction in road speed makes Melbourne’s traffic worse. Authorities around hare are reducing road speeds even faster than population is growing, making traffic exponentially worse with each passing year.

Road speed reductions don’t even make roads safer. To first order, Danger = const. * Traffic * Speed = const. * Population / Speed * Speed = const. * Population. So to first order, the danger on roads is INDEPENDENT of road speed. All speed reductions do is to move traffic accidents from one location to another.

mollwollfumble said:

I’m quite furious with our council right now because of their lack of appreciation of the need to increase road speeds to match predictable growth. Traffic = const. * Population / Speed. Every reduction in road speed makes Melbourne’s traffic worse. Authorities around hare are reducing road speeds even faster than population is growing, making traffic exponentially worse with each passing year.

Road speed reductions don’t even make roads safer. To first order, Danger = const. * Traffic * Speed = const. * Population / Speed * Speed = const. * Population. So to first order, the danger on roads is INDEPENDENT of road speed. All speed reductions do is to move traffic accidents from one location to another.

Cars should be able to cope with higher speeds and avoid accidents with all the safety features built in assuming the drivers themselves aren’t morons.

Cymek said:

mollwollfumble said:

I’m quite furious with our council right now because of their lack of appreciation of the need to increase road speeds to match predictable growth. Traffic = const. * Population / Speed. Every reduction in road speed makes Melbourne’s traffic worse. Authorities around hare are reducing road speeds even faster than population is growing, making traffic exponentially worse with each passing year.

Road speed reductions don’t even make roads safer. To first order, Danger = const. * Traffic * Speed = const. * Population / Speed * Speed = const. * Population. So to first order, the danger on roads is INDEPENDENT of road speed. All speed reductions do is to move traffic accidents from one location to another.

Cars should be able to cope with higher speeds and avoid accidents with all the safety features built in assuming the drivers themselves aren’t morons.

More stringent and more regular tests should be done on vehicles.
some states have checks done if changing numberplates. It needs to be an annual check, or at least every couple of years. Keep cars roadworthy and up to dealing with road conditions

an annual assessment of drivers would save more lives. add a basic car maintenance test so people know what to watch for in vehicle safety.

mollwollfumble said:

I’m quite furious with our council right now because of their lack of appreciation of the need to increase road speeds to match predictable growth. Traffic = const. * Population / Speed. Every reduction in road speed makes Melbourne’s traffic worse. Authorities around hare are reducing road speeds even faster than population is growing, making traffic exponentially worse with each passing year.

Road speed reductions don’t even make roads safer. To first order, Danger = const. * Traffic * Speed = const. * Population / Speed * Speed = const. * Population. So to first order, the danger on roads is INDEPENDENT of road speed. All speed reductions do is to move traffic accidents from one location to another.

Be patient. Most of these problems will be fixed in 10 years with the rise of driverless cars that drive at speed in convoys.

Brisbane and Australia in general has great universities available which are less than immediately affordable to the local population. Improving secondary education output balances this without having to significantly redress the current funding schemes.

Postpocelipse said:

Brisbane and Australia in general has great universities available which are less than immediately affordable to the local population. Improving secondary education output balances this without having to significantly redress the current funding schemes.

The university loan schemes are just a way of applying a temporary additional tax on those who have been to university, when they get an income where they can afford to pay it. It seems perfectly fair and reasonable to me, and sending the message that young people from low income backgrounds can’t afford to go to university does them no favours at all.

The Rev Dodgson said:

Postpocelipse said:

Brisbane and Australia in general has great universities available which are less than immediately affordable to the local population. Improving secondary education output balances this without having to significantly redress the current funding schemes.

The university loan schemes are just a way of applying a temporary additional tax on those who have been to university, when they get an income where they can afford to pay it. It seems perfectly fair and reasonable to me, and sending the message that young people from low income backgrounds can’t afford to go to university does them no favours at all.

Sure I don’t disagree but it does give foreign students an advantage locals don’t seem to get.

Postpocelipse said:

The Rev Dodgson said:

Postpocelipse said:

Brisbane and Australia in general has great universities available which are less than immediately affordable to the local population. Improving secondary education output balances this without having to significantly redress the current funding schemes.

The university loan schemes are just a way of applying a temporary additional tax on those who have been to university, when they get an income where they can afford to pay it. It seems perfectly fair and reasonable to me, and sending the message that young people from low income backgrounds can’t afford to go to university does them no favours at all.

Sure I don’t disagree but it does give foreign students an advantage locals don’t seem to get.

I think our secondary system could be far more competitive.

The Rev Dodgson said:

Postpocelipse said:

Brisbane and Australia in general has great universities available which are less than immediately affordable to the local population. Improving secondary education output balances this without having to significantly redress the current funding schemes.

The university loan schemes are just a way of applying a temporary additional tax on those who have been to university, when they get an income where they can afford to pay it. It seems perfectly fair and reasonable to me, and sending the message that young people from low income backgrounds can’t afford to go to university does them no favours at all.

My son is at university and we are what most would deem low income, he earn’t himself two separate scholarships which will help pay his way through his study

Postpocelipse said:

The Rev Dodgson said:

Postpocelipse said:

Brisbane and Australia in general has great universities available which are less than immediately affordable to the local population. Improving secondary education output balances this without having to significantly redress the current funding schemes.

The university loan schemes are just a way of applying a temporary additional tax on those who have been to university, when they get an income where they can afford to pay it. It seems perfectly fair and reasonable to me, and sending the message that young people from low income backgrounds can’t afford to go to university does them no favours at all.

Sure I don’t disagree but it does give foreign students an advantage locals don’t seem to get.

I’m not sure I understand the point you are trying to make… International students have to pay all their fees up front.

It was mentioned that a number of Chinese universities have hugely improved their standings in the world market so we could see a reduction in Chinese students attending Australian universities as their own are just as good or better.

Cymek said:

It was mentioned that a number of Chinese universities have hugely improved their standings in the world market so we could see a reduction in Chinese students attending Australian universities as their own are just as good or better.

except that there are literally tens of millions of Chinese youth looking for a university education, many of which are from families that want them to be educated overseas.

Postpocelipse said:

Sure I don’t disagree but it does give foreign students an advantage locals don’t seem to get.

Paying full fees? A strange sort of advantage.

diddly-squat said:

Postpocelipse said:

The Rev Dodgson said:

The university loan schemes are just a way of applying a temporary additional tax on those who have been to university, when they get an income where they can afford to pay it. It seems perfectly fair and reasonable to me, and sending the message that young people from low income backgrounds can’t afford to go to university does them no favours at all.

Sure I don’t disagree but it does give foreign students an advantage locals don’t seem to get.

I’m not sure I understand the point you are trying to make… International students have to pay all their fees up front.

The tall poppy stigma in Australia effects the secondary system in a manner that doesn’t immediately encourage seeking tertiary skills. Being a part of the Asian market we have to compete with their systems which stress the importance of greater learning.

This is not a declaration of war on boganite culture but a facilitation of it’s greater effects.

Postpocelipse said:

diddly-squat said:

Postpocelipse said:

Sure I don’t disagree but it does give foreign students an advantage locals don’t seem to get.

I’m not sure I understand the point you are trying to make… International students have to pay all their fees up front.

The tall poppy stigma in Australia effects the secondary system in a manner that doesn’t immediately encourage seeking tertiary skills. Being a part of the Asian market we have to compete with their systems which stress the importance of greater learning.

It has gotten better in that primary and high school do reward hard working students, but I suppose the problem is how do you convince parents that education for their children is important especially now were you need more and more skills to compete on the job market

Postpocelipse said:

diddly-squat said:

Postpocelipse said:

Sure I don’t disagree but it does give foreign students an advantage locals don’t seem to get.

I’m not sure I understand the point you are trying to make… International students have to pay all their fees up front.

The tall poppy stigma in Australia effects the secondary system in a manner that doesn’t immediately encourage seeking tertiary skills. Being a part of the Asian market we have to compete with their systems which stress the importance of greater learning.

Plus if we don’t stress the important of greater learning it’s our own fault for dumbing down our population

Cymek said:

Postpocelipse said:

diddly-squat said:

I’m not sure I understand the point you are trying to make… International students have to pay all their fees up front.

The tall poppy stigma in Australia effects the secondary system in a manner that doesn’t immediately encourage seeking tertiary skills. Being a part of the Asian market we have to compete with their systems which stress the importance of greater learning.

Plus if we don’t stress the important of greater learning it’s our own fault for dumbing down our population

Something that is a topic in regard the tactics of politicians of late.

I think a landmark of the sort I’ve proposed for the peak of Highgate Hill would supply a very positive impression to the community’s self-image. I think the building should vaguely resemble a Dalek but I’m open to other popular references to be considered.

Postpocelipse said:

diddly-squat said:

Postpocelipse said:

Sure I don’t disagree but it does give foreign students an advantage locals don’t seem to get.

I’m not sure I understand the point you are trying to make… International students have to pay all their fees up front.

The tall poppy stigma in Australia effects the secondary system in a manner that doesn’t immediately encourage seeking tertiary skills. Being a part of the Asian market we have to compete with their systems which stress the importance of greater learning.

what?

I think you’ll find there is a very high emphasis placed on tertiary pathways

diddly-squat said:

Postpocelipse said:

diddly-squat said:

I’m not sure I understand the point you are trying to make… International students have to pay all their fees up front.

The tall poppy stigma in Australia effects the secondary system in a manner that doesn’t immediately encourage seeking tertiary skills. Being a part of the Asian market we have to compete with their systems which stress the importance of greater learning.

what?

I think you’ll find there is a very high emphasis placed on tertiary pathways

Yes I am aware of the education system’s culture. I am referring to the community’s bottom line values.

Postpocelipse said:

diddly-squat said:

Postpocelipse said:

The tall poppy stigma in Australia effects the secondary system in a manner that doesn’t immediately encourage seeking tertiary skills. Being a part of the Asian market we have to compete with their systems which stress the importance of greater learning.

what?

I think you’ll find there is a very high emphasis placed on tertiary pathways

Yes I am aware of the education system’s culture. I am referring to the community’s bottom line values.

I was speaking in general social terms… there is a high community expectation of pursuing a tertiary education.

Postpocelipse said:

diddly-squat said:

Postpocelipse said:

The tall poppy stigma in Australia effects the secondary system in a manner that doesn’t immediately encourage seeking tertiary skills. Being a part of the Asian market we have to compete with their systems which stress the importance of greater learning.

what?

I think you’ll find there is a very high emphasis placed on tertiary pathways

Yes I am aware of the education system’s culture. I am referring to the community’s bottom line values.

For instance the development of west end/south brisbane has been an issue of contention for a considerable time now. Re-zoning the Torbreck land for future use for the local high school provides a token gift of considerable value to the conservative efforts that are thus far losing much of the battle to retain West End’s vibe.

diddly-squat said:

Postpocelipse said:

diddly-squat said:

what?

I think you’ll find there is a very high emphasis placed on tertiary pathways

Yes I am aware of the education system’s culture. I am referring to the community’s bottom line values.

I was speaking in general social terms… there is a high community expectation of pursuing a tertiary education.

I’m sorry but that hasn’t reached far enough from the vantage point I occupy. There a significant demographics that are still minimally included.

Postpocelipse said:

diddly-squat said:

Postpocelipse said:

Yes I am aware of the education system’s culture. I am referring to the community’s bottom line values.

I was speaking in general social terms… there is a high community expectation of pursuing a tertiary education.

I’m sorry but that hasn’t reached far enough from the vantage point I occupy. There a significant demographics that are still minimally included.

Some of these demographics are used to validate West End’s commercial re-development in the ‘get rid of trouble types’ sentiment.

Postpocelipse said:

Postpocelipse said:

diddly-squat said:

what?

I think you’ll find there is a very high emphasis placed on tertiary pathways

Yes I am aware of the education system’s culture. I am referring to the community’s bottom line values.

For instance the development of west end/south brisbane has been an issue of contention for a considerable time now. Re-zoning the Torbreck land for future use for the local high school provides a token gift of considerable value to the conservative efforts that are thus far losing much of the battle to retain West End’s vibe.

west end’s vibe? you mean the hipster paradise cafe culture where it costs $22 for a plate of bacon and eggs or $8 for a pint in the evening… even the produce at the west end markets is stupid expensive…

Don’t get me wrong, I love west end but it’s just not economically sensible to expect that old 70’s split level hovels will remain the norm in what is essentially an inner city suburb that is serviced by arguably the most selective public high school in the state…

Postpocelipse said:

Postpocelipse said:

diddly-squat said:

I was speaking in general social terms… there is a high community expectation of pursuing a tertiary education.

I’m sorry but that hasn’t reached far enough from the vantage point I occupy. There a significant demographics that are still minimally included.

Some of these demographics are used to validate West End’s commercial re-development in the ‘get rid of trouble types’ sentiment.

I’m seriously considering revisiting the Tent Embassy approach at Mowbray Park to campaign for B.S.H.S. to be re-developed as proposed and a significant proportion of it’s future enrolments be set aside for the indigenous community of Queensland.

Does the idea still exist that the wealthy produce smart children and the poor don’t in the minds of those people and society in general.

diddly-squat said:

Postpocelipse said:

Postpocelipse said:

Yes I am aware of the education system’s culture. I am referring to the community’s bottom line values.

For instance the development of west end/south brisbane has been an issue of contention for a considerable time now. Re-zoning the Torbreck land for future use for the local high school provides a token gift of considerable value to the conservative efforts that are thus far losing much of the battle to retain West End’s vibe.

west end’s vibe? you mean the hipster paradise cafe culture where it costs $22 for a plate of bacon and eggs or $8 for a pint in the evening… even the produce at the west end markets is stupid expensive…

Don’t get me wrong, I love west end but it’s just not economically sensible to expect that old 70’s split level hovels will remain the norm in what is essentially an inner city suburb that is serviced by arguably the most selective public high school in the state…

There are demographics that are being entirely ignored that are the genuine tradition of West End. I believe since “Boundary St” is such a prominent piece of the local scenery something should be provided that genuinely addresses who has a right to be where.

Half those spastic hipsters live in Torbreck. They can go feck ‘emselves……..

Postpocelipse said:

Postpocelipse said:

Postpocelipse said:

I’m sorry but that hasn’t reached far enough from the vantage point I occupy. There a significant demographics that are still minimally included.

Some of these demographics are used to validate West End’s commercial re-development in the ‘get rid of trouble types’ sentiment.

I’m seriously considering revisiting the Tent Embassy approach at Mowbray Park to campaign for B.S.H.S. to be re-developed as proposed and a significant proportion of it’s future enrolments be set aside for the indigenous community of Queensland.

you really do speak out of your arse sometimes…

Maybe a better model would be to up fees at the school and then siphon off the excess funds to help bankroll better targeted, and more local, education facilities for lower socio-economic areas.

rollseyes

Cymek said:

Does the idea still exist that the wealthy produce smart children and the poor don’t in the minds of those people and society in general.

not sure about that, but there certainly is a link between socio-economic demographic and the level of education…

Postpocelipse said:

diddly-squat said:

Postpocelipse said:

For instance the development of west end/south brisbane has been an issue of contention for a considerable time now. Re-zoning the Torbreck land for future use for the local high school provides a token gift of considerable value to the conservative efforts that are thus far losing much of the battle to retain West End’s vibe.

west end’s vibe? you mean the hipster paradise cafe culture where it costs $22 for a plate of bacon and eggs or $8 for a pint in the evening… even the produce at the west end markets is stupid expensive…

Don’t get me wrong, I love west end but it’s just not economically sensible to expect that old 70’s split level hovels will remain the norm in what is essentially an inner city suburb that is serviced by arguably the most selective public high school in the state…

There are demographics that are being entirely ignored that are the genuine tradition of West End. I believe since “Boundary St” is such a prominent piece of the local scenery something should be provided that genuinely addresses who has a right to be where.

what a load of bullshit… I understand that there are a lot of renters in the area and that they are being forced out due to increases in the cost of living… but there is no ‘tradition’… other than maybe that created by Expo 88

diddly-squat said:

Postpocelipse said:

diddly-squat said:

west end’s vibe? you mean the hipster paradise cafe culture where it costs $22 for a plate of bacon and eggs or $8 for a pint in the evening… even the produce at the west end markets is stupid expensive…

Don’t get me wrong, I love west end but it’s just not economically sensible to expect that old 70’s split level hovels will remain the norm in what is essentially an inner city suburb that is serviced by arguably the most selective public high school in the state…

There are demographics that are being entirely ignored that are the genuine tradition of West End. I believe since “Boundary St” is such a prominent piece of the local scenery something should be provided that genuinely addresses who has a right to be where.

what a load of bullshit… I understand that there are a lot of renters in the area and that they are being forced out due to increases in the cost of living… but there is no ‘tradition’… other than maybe that created by Expo 88

Except for the local tribal use of traditional lands that seems to never get a fair redress in any fuckin manner. Like I said you don’t see what I see……..

diddly-squat said:

Postpocelipse said:

diddly-squat said:

west end’s vibe? you mean the hipster paradise cafe culture where it costs $22 for a plate of bacon and eggs or $8 for a pint in the evening… even the produce at the west end markets is stupid expensive…

Don’t get me wrong, I love west end but it’s just not economically sensible to expect that old 70’s split level hovels will remain the norm in what is essentially an inner city suburb that is serviced by arguably the most selective public high school in the state…

There are demographics that are being entirely ignored that are the genuine tradition of West End. I believe since “Boundary St” is such a prominent piece of the local scenery something should be provided that genuinely addresses who has a right to be where.

what a load of bullshit… I understand that there are a lot of renters in the area and that they are being forced out due to increases in the cost of living… but there is no ‘tradition’… other than maybe that created by Expo 88

I bet the area has “cool” comments on blackboards outside cafes about the virtues of coffee

Postpocelipse said:

diddly-squat said:

Postpocelipse said:

There are demographics that are being entirely ignored that are the genuine tradition of West End. I believe since “Boundary St” is such a prominent piece of the local scenery something should be provided that genuinely addresses who has a right to be where.

what a load of bullshit… I understand that there are a lot of renters in the area and that they are being forced out due to increases in the cost of living… but there is no ‘tradition’… other than maybe that created by Expo 88

Except for the local tribal use of traditional lands that seems to never get a fair redress in any fuckin manner. Like I said you don’t see what I see……..

rollseyes

I’ve been hanging out West End for as long as I’ve lived in Brisbane… There are no traditional tribal practices carried out there… If you think being asked not to drink in a public park is an example of being forced out, then I’m sorry but you are clearly mistaken.

Cymek said:

diddly-squat said:

Postpocelipse said:

There are demographics that are being entirely ignored that are the genuine tradition of West End. I believe since “Boundary St” is such a prominent piece of the local scenery something should be provided that genuinely addresses who has a right to be where.

what a load of bullshit… I understand that there are a lot of renters in the area and that they are being forced out due to increases in the cost of living… but there is no ‘tradition’… other than maybe that created by Expo 88

I bet the area has “cool” comments on blackboards outside cafes about the virtues of coffee

the only tradition there is paying $50 for a henna tattoo after browsing through a rack hemp and flax clothing.

diddly-squat said:

Postpocelipse said:

diddly-squat said:

what a load of bullshit… I understand that there are a lot of renters in the area and that they are being forced out due to increases in the cost of living… but there is no ‘tradition’… other than maybe that created by Expo 88

Except for the local tribal use of traditional lands that seems to never get a fair redress in any fuckin manner. Like I said you don’t see what I see……..

rollseyes

I’ve been hanging out West End for as long as I’ve lived in Brisbane… There are no traditional tribal practices carried out there… If you think being asked not to drink in a public park is an example of being forced out, then I’m sorry but you are clearly mistaken.

You seem to be deliberately missing the point. That spot used to be traditionally used before we came along. The only land or thought that is set aside to reparation is crap we don’t want. I say build a high school which they are set aside room to fill in and allow them to develop a curriculum for heritage cultures in the Australian education system. I’m not mistaken. Everyone with shutters on their eyes like you seem to enjoy is.

diddly-squat said:

Cymek said:

diddly-squat said:

what a load of bullshit… I understand that there are a lot of renters in the area and that they are being forced out due to increases in the cost of living… but there is no ‘tradition’… other than maybe that created by Expo 88

I bet the area has “cool” comments on blackboards outside cafes about the virtues of coffee

the only tradition there is paying $50 for a henna tattoo after browsing through a rack hemp and flax clothing.

Attention span of goldfish………..

Give them a serious option to keeping our jails in business you think they won’t take it?

Postpocelipse said:

Give them a serious option to keeping our jails in business you think they won’t take it?

Aboriginal people are highly represented in jail but I do have to say from the 15 1/2 years I’ve worked with corrective services the courts try not to lock them up, the ones in jail wouldn’t be nice people, their Aboriginality is irrelevant especially as they are usually violent to each other.

Cymek said:

Postpocelipse said:

Give them a serious option to keeping our jails in business you think they won’t take it?

Aboriginal people are highly represented in jail but I do have to say from the 15 1/2 years I’ve worked with corrective services the courts try not to lock them up, the ones in jail wouldn’t be nice people, their Aboriginality is irrelevant especially as they are usually violent to each other.

Why do people like to justify ignoring them by pointing out they can be as nasty as us when left with nothing?

Postpocelipse said:

Cymek said:

Postpocelipse said:

Give them a serious option to keeping our jails in business you think they won’t take it?

Aboriginal people are highly represented in jail but I do have to say from the 15 1/2 years I’ve worked with corrective services the courts try not to lock them up, the ones in jail wouldn’t be nice people, their Aboriginality is irrelevant especially as they are usually violent to each other.

Why do people like to justify ignoring them by pointing out they can be as nasty as us when left with nothing?

ooh me me! Because if we procrastinate long enough that problem will just gradually disappear?

Postpocelipse said:

Cymek said:

Postpocelipse said:

Give them a serious option to keeping our jails in business you think they won’t take it?

Aboriginal people are highly represented in jail but I do have to say from the 15 1/2 years I’ve worked with corrective services the courts try not to lock them up, the ones in jail wouldn’t be nice people, their Aboriginality is irrelevant especially as they are usually violent to each other.

Why do people like to justify ignoring them by pointing out they can be as nasty as us when left with nothing?

I suppose because at some point you become responsible for your own actions regardless of life situation.

Cymek said:

Postpocelipse said:

Cymek said:

Aboriginal people are highly represented in jail but I do have to say from the 15 1/2 years I’ve worked with corrective services the courts try not to lock them up, the ones in jail wouldn’t be nice people, their Aboriginality is irrelevant especially as they are usually violent to each other.

Why do people like to justify ignoring them by pointing out they can be as nasty as us when left with nothing?

I suppose because at some point you become responsible for your own actions regardless of life situation.

That is a conniving conceited argument. The only ‘property’ we left them with is parcels of land in the middle of nowhere deserts. They are an entirely demoralised, undermined and dis-empowered peoples and we made them that way.

Postpocelipse said:

Cymek said:

Postpocelipse said:

Why do people like to justify ignoring them by pointing out they can be as nasty as us when left with nothing?

I suppose because at some point you become responsible for your own actions regardless of life situation.

That is a conniving conceited argument. The only ‘property’ we left them with is parcels of land in the middle of nowhere deserts. They are an entirely demoralised, undermined and dis-empowered peoples and we made them that way.

So them attacking each other is OK because of the above, they can rob, attack and smash anyone and anything they like and expect no punish because of the sins of our forbearers. If you are at a trainstation and are asked for money and have none or refuse and they call you a white c and bash you that’s ok because they are Aboriginal.

Cymek said:

Postpocelipse said:

Cymek said:

I suppose because at some point you become responsible for your own actions regardless of life situation.

That is a conniving conceited argument. The only ‘property’ we left them with is parcels of land in the middle of nowhere deserts. They are an entirely demoralised, undermined and dis-empowered peoples and we made them that way.

So them attacking each other is OK because of the above, they can rob, attack and smash anyone and anything they like and expect no punish because of the sins of our forbearers. If you are at a trainstation and are asked for money and have none or refuse and they call you a white c and bash you that’s ok because they are Aboriginal.

You really don’t see the connection between their dispossession and these circumstances? Seems something wrong with that to me.

Train station solicitation is the modern version of highway robbery which is a practice of outlawed peoples.

Postpocelipse said:

Cymek said:

Postpocelipse said:

That is a conniving conceited argument. The only ‘property’ we left them with is parcels of land in the middle of nowhere deserts. They are an entirely demoralised, undermined and dis-empowered peoples and we made them that way.

So them attacking each other is OK because of the above, they can rob, attack and smash anyone and anything they like and expect no punish because of the sins of our forbearers. If you are at a trainstation and are asked for money and have none or refuse and they call you a white c and bash you that’s ok because they are Aboriginal.

You really don’t see the connection between their dispossession and these circumstances? Seems something wrong with that to me.

I do but when should someone take responsibility for their own actions, has anyone sat down with them and had an honest discussion and said “Is this really all you want from life, c’mon it fucking horrible for you and your family, what do you want that we can give you within reason”

I find the complete lack of gratitude for living on the world’s comfiest continent predatory. Inclusiveness is supposed to be the mother of mate-ship AFAIC.

Perhaps I am jaded as I see the negative aspect of it all through the courts, but sometimes you are doing them a disservice by not locking up the violent ones as you are almost saying “You aren’t worth protecting from violence”

Cymek said:

Postpocelipse said:

Cymek said:

So them attacking each other is OK because of the above, they can rob, attack and smash anyone and anything they like and expect no punish because of the sins of our forbearers. If you are at a trainstation and are asked for money and have none or refuse and they call you a white c and bash you that’s ok because they are Aboriginal.

You really don’t see the connection between their dispossession and these circumstances? Seems something wrong with that to me.

I do but when should someone take responsibility for their own actions, has anyone sat down with them and had an honest discussion and said “Is this really all you want from life, c’mon it fucking horrible for you and your family, what do you want that we can give you within reason”

When the people who have dis-empowered their ability to take responsibility for themselves undo the damage they have done. Pretty simple really.

Cymek said:

Perhaps I am jaded as I see the negative aspect of it all through the courts, but sometimes you are doing them a disservice by not locking up the violent ones as you are almost saying “You aren’t worth protecting from violence”

I never said don’t lock violent people up. I said create a functionally significant space for them in our education system that fosters future cohesion.

Postpocelipse said:

I never said don’t lock violent people up. I said create a functionally significant space for them in our education system that fosters future cohesion.

The indigine population in general not just the violent ones……….

Postpocelipse said:

Cymek said:

Postpocelipse said:

You really don’t see the connection between their dispossession and these circumstances? Seems something wrong with that to me.

I do but when should someone take responsibility for their own actions, has anyone sat down with them and had an honest discussion and said “Is this really all you want from life, c’mon it fucking horrible for you and your family, what do you want that we can give you within reason”

When the people who have dis-empowered their ability to take responsibility for themselves undo the damage they have done. Pretty simple really.

Perhaps tribal law needs to given back to them as means to discipline their own kind. The problem is I suppose is the old way of life is gone and if you don’t adapt you are doomed like all cultures before them seem to have ended up.

Postpocelipse said:

Cymek said:

Perhaps I am jaded as I see the negative aspect of it all through the courts, but sometimes you are doing them a disservice by not locking up the violent ones as you are almost saying “You aren’t worth protecting from violence”

I never said don’t lock violent people up. I said create a functionally significant space for them in our education system that fosters future cohesion.

For sure

Cymek said:

Postpocelipse said:

Cymek said:

I do but when should someone take responsibility for their own actions, has anyone sat down with them and had an honest discussion and said “Is this really all you want from life, c’mon it fucking horrible for you and your family, what do you want that we can give you within reason”

When the people who have dis-empowered their ability to take responsibility for themselves undo the damage they have done. Pretty simple really.

Perhaps tribal law needs to given back to them as means to discipline their own kind. The problem is I suppose is the old way of life is gone and if you don’t adapt you are doomed like all cultures before them seem to have ended up.

Were a cultural heritage dept instituted they could modernise their respective laws to work with what they have today. You have to start with education with any demographic group.

Cymek said:

Postpocelipse said:

Cymek said:

Perhaps I am jaded as I see the negative aspect of it all through the courts, but sometimes you are doing them a disservice by not locking up the violent ones as you are almost saying “You aren’t worth protecting from violence”

I never said don’t lock violent people up. I said create a functionally significant space for them in our education system that fosters future cohesion.

For sure

:)

I’ll consider that a vote for the dalek senior block atop Highgate Hill.

:P