Date: 15/10/2016 17:45:27
From: CrazyNeutrino
ID: 968551
Subject: The observable universe is 10 times bigger

The observable universe is 10 times bigger than we thought

AT LEAST two trillion galaxies — 10 times more than scientists thought — exist within the observable universe. And we can’t even see most of them, reports the New York Post.

A group of international astronomers compiled 20 years of images from the Hubble Space Telescope and other international observatories to create a 3D model of the 200 billion galaxies already estimated to exist.

More…

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Date: 15/10/2016 18:19:21
From: mollwollfumble
ID: 968566
Subject: re: The observable universe is 10 times bigger

CrazyNeutrino said:


The observable universe is 10 times bigger than we thought

AT LEAST two trillion galaxies — 10 times more than scientists thought — exist within the observable universe. And we can’t even see most of them, reports the New York Post.

A group of international astronomers compiled 20 years of images from the Hubble Space Telescope and other international observatories to create a 3D model of the 200 billion galaxies already estimated to exist.

More…

> It boggles the mind that over 90 per cent of the galaxies in the universe have yet to be studied. Since the scientists were observing deep space, they essentially gazed 13 billion light-years into the past and discovered that the early universe contained more galaxies than it does today. Many of those galaxies have since merged to form larger celestial objects.

Ah, I see. Ten times bigger by number if galaxies. I wonder if they’re taking into account that many faint dwarf galaxies are still being discovered in the near neighbourhood of the Milky Way?

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Date: 15/10/2016 18:32:49
From: Bubblecar
ID: 968572
Subject: re: The observable universe is 10 times bigger

So if there is one instance of intelligent life per one million galaxies, there are two million intelligent life forms in the observable universe.

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Date: 15/10/2016 18:35:11
From: Bubblecar
ID: 968576
Subject: re: The observable universe is 10 times bigger

AVG pop-up tells me: Your Antivirus just got beefed up against 6001 new threats!

That’s reassuring.

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Date: 15/10/2016 18:35:55
From: Bubblecar
ID: 968577
Subject: re: The observable universe is 10 times bigger

Bubblecar said:


AVG pop-up tells me: Your Antivirus just got beefed up against 6001 new threats!

That’s reassuring.

Um, wrong place.

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Date: 15/10/2016 19:05:31
From: The Rev Dodgson
ID: 968591
Subject: re: The observable universe is 10 times bigger

If the observable universe is at least 10 x more dense than we thought, how does this affect dark matter calculations?

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Date: 15/10/2016 19:15:02
From: ChrispenEvan
ID: 968592
Subject: re: The observable universe is 10 times bigger

The Rev Dodgson said:


If the observable universe is at least 10 x more dense than we thought, how does this affect dark matter calculations?

it won’t because there are more phenomena that point to DM. Rotation curves for one. Plus we know the baryonic count for the universe and there isn’t enough to get the result, wmap, we do. so we know there is missing mass and it isn’t baryonic.

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Date: 15/10/2016 19:31:00
From: mollwollfumble
ID: 968600
Subject: re: The observable universe is 10 times bigger

Bubblecar said:


So if there is one instance of intelligent life per one million galaxies, there are two million intelligent life forms in the observable universe.

Annoyingly, the Drake equation can’t give a probability in that number range. Life seems to be either everywhere or nowhere.

Keep in mind that all these new unseen galaxies are tiny.

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Date: 15/10/2016 19:31:21
From: ChrispenEvan
ID: 968601
Subject: re: The observable universe is 10 times bigger

The Dark Matter Rap

My name is Fritz Zwicky
I can be kind of prickly,
This song had better start
by giving me priority
Whatever anybody says,
I said in 1933
Observe the Coma cluster,
the redshift of the galaxies
imply some big velocities.
They’re moving so fast,
there must missing mass!
Dark matter.

For nearly forty years,
the matter problem sits.
Nobody gets worried ‘cause,
“It’s only crazy Fritz.”
The next step’s not ‘til
the early nineteen seventies,
Ostriker and Peebles,
dynamics of the galaxies,
cold disk instabilities.
They say: “If the mass
were sitting in the stars,
all those pretty spirals
ought to be bars!
Self-gravitating disks? Uh-uh, oh no.
What those spirals need is a massive halo.
And hey, look over here, check out these observations,
Vera Rubin’s optical curves of rotation,
they can provide our needed confirmation:
Those curves aren’t falling, they’re FLAT!
Dark matter’s where it’s AT!

And so the call goes out for the dark matter candidates:
black holes, snowballs, gas clouds, low mass stars, or planets.
But we quickly hit a snag because galaxy formation
requires too much structure in the background radiation
if there’s only baryons and adiabatic fluctuations.
The Russians have an answer: “We can solve the impasse.
Lyubimov has shown that the neutrino has mass.”
Zeldovich cries, “Pancakes! The dark matter’s HOT.”
Carlos Frenk, Simon White, Marc Davis say, “NOT!
Quasars are old, and the pancakes must be young.
Forming from the top down it can’t be done.”
So neutrinos hit the skids, and the picture’s looking black.
But California laid-back Blumenthal & Primack
say, “Don’t have a heart attack.
There’s lots of other particles
Just read the physics articles.”

Who’s right? It’s hard to know, ‘til observation or experiment
gives overwhelming evidence that relieves our predicament.
The search is getting popular as many realize
that the detector of dark matter may well win the Nobel Prize.

“The Dark Matter Rap”
-David Weinberg
Featured in Timothy Ferris’ The Whole Shebang’

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Date: 15/10/2016 20:50:10
From: The Rev Dodgson
ID: 968640
Subject: re: The observable universe is 10 times bigger

ChrispenEvan said:


The Rev Dodgson said:

If the observable universe is at least 10 x more dense than we thought, how does this affect dark matter calculations?

it won’t because there are more phenomena that point to DM. Rotation curves for one. Plus we know the baryonic count for the universe and there isn’t enough to get the result, wmap, we do. so we know there is missing mass and it isn’t baryonic.

What do you mean by the “baryonic count”?

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Date: 15/10/2016 20:51:59
From: The Rev Dodgson
ID: 968643
Subject: re: The observable universe is 10 times bigger

mollwollfumble said:


Bubblecar said:

So if there is one instance of intelligent life per one million galaxies, there are two million intelligent life forms in the observable universe.

Annoyingly, the Drake equation can’t give a probability in that number range. Life seems to be either everywhere or nowhere.

Keep in mind that all these new unseen galaxies are tiny.

Eh?

The Drake equation can give any answer you want.

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Date: 15/10/2016 20:54:05
From: ChrispenEvan
ID: 968644
Subject: re: The observable universe is 10 times bigger

baryons means massive particles. we know what the count is because if there wasn’t a certain number the universe would be different to what it is now. too few and the inflation event would not have allowed sufficient time for galaxies to form, it would have expanded too quickly. too many and the gravity would have halted the expansion sooner and the universe would have collapsed.

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Date: 15/10/2016 20:56:13
From: ChrispenEvan
ID: 968645
Subject: re: The observable universe is 10 times bigger

ChrispenEvan said:


baryons means massive particles. we know what the count is because if there wasn’t a certain number the universe would be different to what it is now. too few and the inflation event would not have allowed sufficient time for galaxies to form, it would have expanded too quickly. too many and the gravity would have halted the expansion sooner and the universe would have collapsed.

it is where we get the open, flat and closed universe from.

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Date: 15/10/2016 21:26:01
From: The Rev Dodgson
ID: 968656
Subject: re: The observable universe is 10 times bigger

ChrispenEvan said:


baryons means massive particles. we know what the count is because if there wasn’t a certain number the universe would be different to what it is now. too few and the inflation event would not have allowed sufficient time for galaxies to form, it would have expanded too quickly. too many and the gravity would have halted the expansion sooner and the universe would have collapsed.

OK, so let me rephrase the original question:

Assuming the dark matter hypothesis is correct, how does this increase in the density of non-dark matter affect the amount of dark matter required to fit our observations?

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Date: 15/10/2016 21:28:08
From: ChrispenEvan
ID: 968658
Subject: re: The observable universe is 10 times bigger

The Rev Dodgson said:


ChrispenEvan said:

baryons means massive particles. we know what the count is because if there wasn’t a certain number the universe would be different to what it is now. too few and the inflation event would not have allowed sufficient time for galaxies to form, it would have expanded too quickly. too many and the gravity would have halted the expansion sooner and the universe would have collapsed.

OK, so let me rephrase the original question:

Assuming the dark matter hypothesis is correct, how does this increase in the density of non-dark matter affect the amount of dark matter required to fit our observations?

i wouldn’t imagine it does. we knew the total mass of the universe we just hadn’t found where or what it consisted of. these new galaxy are part of that known mass.

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Date: 15/10/2016 21:38:08
From: The Rev Dodgson
ID: 968661
Subject: re: The observable universe is 10 times bigger

mollwollfumble said:


Bubblecar said:

So if there is one instance of intelligent life per one million galaxies, there are two million intelligent life forms in the observable universe.

Annoyingly, the Drake equation can’t give a probability in that number range. Life seems to be either everywhere or nowhere.

Keep in mind that all these new unseen galaxies are tiny.

Right, reading the article it seems that the 10 times bigger headline is completely misleading. It seems there were more galaxies in the past because they were smaller.

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Date: 15/10/2016 21:40:41
From: ChrispenEvan
ID: 968662
Subject: re: The observable universe is 10 times bigger

The Rev Dodgson said:


mollwollfumble said:

Bubblecar said:

So if there is one instance of intelligent life per one million galaxies, there are two million intelligent life forms in the observable universe.

Annoyingly, the Drake equation can’t give a probability in that number range. Life seems to be either everywhere or nowhere.

Keep in mind that all these new unseen galaxies are tiny.

Right, reading the article it seems that the 10 times bigger headline is completely misleading. It seems there were more galaxies in the past because they were smaller.

yes, those small galaxies have over time combined to form the big ones we see today.

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Date: 15/10/2016 22:16:25
From: mollwollfumble
ID: 968669
Subject: re: The observable universe is 10 times bigger

The Rev Dodgson said:


If the observable universe is at least 10 x more dense than we thought, how does this affect dark matter calculations?

No. The universe is the same density as thought before. It’s just that the average galaxy is ten times smaller than had been thought. That’s because all the really early galaxies were really really small.

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Date: 17/10/2016 12:08:57
From: Cymek
ID: 969179
Subject: re: The observable universe is 10 times bigger

ChrispenEvan said:


The Rev Dodgson said:

mollwollfumble said:

Annoyingly, the Drake equation can’t give a probability in that number range. Life seems to be either everywhere or nowhere.

Keep in mind that all these new unseen galaxies are tiny.

Right, reading the article it seems that the 10 times bigger headline is completely misleading. It seems there were more galaxies in the past because they were smaller.

yes, those small galaxies have over time combined to form the big ones we see today.

So you really couldn’t count their mass if most of them combined to form todays galaxies

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