It only occurred to me recently that psychology is not only subject to fads, but has been subject to fads since the time of Freud, if not before.

The fad before autism was neurosis. Back when I was young, it was said that up to 50% of people have a neurosis. Now with the rise of autism, everybody seems to have forgotten about the neurosis fad.

mollwollfumble said:

It only occurred to me recently that psychology is not only subject to fads, but has been subject to fads since the time of Freud, if not before.

The fad before autism was neurosis. Back when I was young, it was said that up to 50% of people have a neurosis. Now with the rise of autism, everybody seems to have forgotten about the neurosis fad.

When I was a kid women suffered with “glands” (Prolly hypothyroidism)

mollwollfumble said:

It only occurred to me recently that psychology is not only subject to fads, but has been subject to fads since the time of Freud, if not before.

The fad before autism was neurosis. Back when I was young, it was said that up to 50% of people have a neurosis. Now with the rise of autism, everybody seems to have forgotten about the neurosis fad.

Yes, there is a lot of autism being diagnosed but it is a very wide spectrum (including Aspergers). It’s a real thing (although subject to review.. soft science…).

Psychology biggest problem is not understanding the chemicals and makeup of the human brain.

Psychology needs to understand the relationship between behavior and chemicals in the body.

once that is done there should be no more fads

Tau.Neutrino said:

Psychology biggest problem is not understanding the chemicals and makeup of the human brain.

Psychology needs to understand the relationship between behavior and chemicals in the body.

once that is done there should be no more fads

You want to tell Freud that?

My understanding is the psychology looks at past behaviours and history to diagnose problems, medical, ie chemical imbalances sounds more like psychiatry. Psychologists don’t need to be doctors, but psychiatrists are doctors the specialise in the brain and behaviour.

Tau.Neutrino said:

Psychology biggest problem is not understanding the chemicals and makeup of the human brain.

Psychology needs to understand the relationship between behavior and chemicals in the body.

once that is done there should be no more fads

well they are not psychiatrists and even if they did understand they can only offer services within the scope of their qualifications and medications are a doctor thing

mollwollfumble said:

Tau.Neutrino said:

Psychology biggest problem is not understanding the chemicals and makeup of the human brain.

Psychology needs to understand the relationship between behavior and chemicals in the body.

once that is done there should be no more fads

You want to tell Freud that?

I wonder what he would think of Neuroscience?

How many psychologists study Neuroscience?

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Neuroscience

scroll down to see the expanding fields of Neuroscience

mollwollfumble said:

Tau.Neutrino said:

Psychology biggest problem is not understanding the chemicals and makeup of the human brain.

Psychology needs to understand the relationship between behavior and chemicals in the body.

once that is done there should be no more fads

You want to tell Freud that?

Isn’t that what psychiatrists do

AwesomeO said:

My understanding is the psychology looks at past behaviours and history to diagnose problems, medical, ie chemical imbalances sounds more like psychiatry. Psychologists don’t need to be doctors, but psychiatrists are doctors the specialise in the brain and behaviour.

past behaviour patterns but some problems are new in that there was sudden trauma causing the problem therefore some things are about the here and now.

Cant people see the relationship between chemicals in the body and behavior?

monkey skipper said:

AwesomeO said:

My understanding is the psychology looks at past behaviours and history to diagnose problems, medical, ie chemical imbalances sounds more like psychiatry. Psychologists don’t need to be doctors, but psychiatrists are doctors the specialise in the brain and behaviour.

past behaviour patterns but some problems are new in that there was sudden trauma causing the problem therefore some things are about the here and now.

That would be the history bit.

AwesomeO said:

My understanding is the psychology looks at past behaviours and history to diagnose problems, medical, ie chemical imbalances sounds more like psychiatry. Psychologists don’t need to be doctors, but psychiatrists are doctors the specialise in the brain and behaviour.

I could be wrong, but I think this is headed towards a comment about mental health and cannabis…

Tau.Neutrino said:

mollwollfumble said:

Tau.Neutrino said:

Psychology biggest problem is not understanding the chemicals and makeup of the human brain.

Psychology needs to understand the relationship between behavior and chemicals in the body.

once that is done there should be no more fads

You want to tell Freud that?

I wonder what he would think of Neuroscience?

How many psychologists study Neuroscience?

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Neuroscience

scroll down to see the expanding fields of Neuroscience

It’s an interesting field neuroscience, especially cognitive and computational neuroscience

monkey skipper said:

AwesomeO said:

My understanding is the psychology looks at past behaviours and history to diagnose problems, medical, ie chemical imbalances sounds more like psychiatry. Psychologists don’t need to be doctors, but psychiatrists are doctors the specialise in the brain and behaviour.

past behaviour patterns but some problems are new in that there was sudden trauma causing the problem therefore some things are about the here and now.

curve there are behavioural psychologists and they often support families and individuals where there might be a disability support need as a common example

monkey skipper said:

Tau.Neutrino said:

Psychology biggest problem is not understanding the chemicals and makeup of the human brain.

Psychology needs to understand the relationship between behavior and chemicals in the body.

once that is done there should be no more fads

well they are not psychiatrists and even if they did understand they can only offer services within the scope of their qualifications and medications are a doctor thing

Yes, diagnosis and treatment of conditions like autism are within the purview of psychiatrists.

Tau.Neutrino said:

Cant people see the relationship between chemicals in the body and behavior?

yes but it isn’t as simple as that

Renowned psychotherapist

Tau.Neutrino said:

Cant people see the relationship between chemicals in the body and behavior?

yes, but the point is that psychologists look to amend behaviors through (mostly) cognitive techniques… it’s psychiatrists that (mostly) utilize neurological treatments.

Tau.Neutrino said:

Cant people see the relationship between chemicals in the body and behavior?

Of course we can. We may have a better understanding of how complex it is if your past comments on the subject are any guide.

diddly-squat said:

Tau.Neutrino said:

Cant people see the relationship between chemicals in the body and behavior?

yes, but the point is that psychologists look to amend behaviors through (mostly) cognitive techniques… it’s psychiatrists that (mostly) utilize neurological treatments.

Yeah otherwise you could get a psychotherapist saying “Well Mr Smith, I feel talking it out isn’t helping, I’, gonna try some homemade electroshock treatment instead, where’s my wire strippers and that extension cord”

Courts will call upon psychiatric reports when they feel a psychological report is inadequate.

Cymek said:

Tau.Neutrino said:

mollwollfumble said:

You want to tell Freud that?

I wonder what he would think of Neuroscience?

How many psychologists study Neuroscience?

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Neuroscience

scroll down to see the expanding fields of Neuroscience

It’s an interesting field neuroscience, especially cognitive and computational neuroscience

I think psychologists needs to broaden their field of research to include neurosciences

Molecular neuroscience and Neuropsychology

there is a difference between psychologists and psychiatrists

psychologists study behavior, the scientific study of the human mind and its functions, especially those affecting behavior in a given context.

psychiatrists study and diagnose, prevention and treatment of mental disorders and can prescribe medicines

monkey skipper said:

Tau.Neutrino said:

Cant people see the relationship between chemicals in the body and behavior?

yes but it isn’t as simple as that

I realize that.

Tau.Neutrino said:

Cant people see the relationship between chemicals in the body and behavior?

people always have choices and generally react for a reward the reward in reflection may not be sufficient to sustain the person but in the moment it was.

for example having your needs met immediately is common for 2 year olds and sharing is a foreign developing concept but swapping might be possible. Biting another toddler may mean the two year old got the toy they wanted (their needs were met “the reward”) the consequences of being in trouble or isolated from friends is not pleasant (“not meeting needs”) this reaction doesn’t sustain the reward but the two year old is always interested in the needs only and always. developmentally this normal BUT not all two year olds bite to have their needs met , or continue to have their needs met by biting.

Just saying I am two years old and therefore I can continue to bite you to have my needs met is not going to cut it because socially there will be a rebellion from peers and more in some way.

There is scope for learning or redirecting or swapping one reaction with at least one other usually just saying the chemicals made me do it when new guidance support is introduced . Meaning there are often non chemical therapies to practise that will enhance better chemistry of the brain and the social successes increase and positive influences of congruent relationships would increase. if that makes sense to you.

Cymek said:

diddly-squat said:

Tau.Neutrino said:

Cant people see the relationship between chemicals in the body and behavior?

yes, but the point is that psychologists look to amend behaviors through (mostly) cognitive techniques… it’s psychiatrists that (mostly) utilize neurological treatments.

Yeah otherwise you could get a psychotherapist saying “Well Mr Smith, I feel talking it out isn’t helping, I’, gonna try some homemade electroshock treatment instead, where’s my wire strippers and that extension cord”

This reminds me of the Simpsons ep where by the family get to shock each other to curb behaviours but they keep the punishment going until start sending the poer grids down. Quite amusing indeed.

monkey skipper said:

Cymek said:

diddly-squat said:

yes, but the point is that psychologists look to amend behaviors through (mostly) cognitive techniques… it’s psychiatrists that (mostly) utilize neurological treatments.

Yeah otherwise you could get a psychotherapist saying “Well Mr Smith, I feel talking it out isn’t helping, I’, gonna try some homemade electroshock treatment instead, where’s my wire strippers and that extension cord”

This reminds me of the Simpsons ep where by the family get to shock each other to curb behaviours but they keep the punishment going until start sending the poer grids down. Quite amusing indeed.

That was a very early episode Dr Marvin Munroe I think

monkey skipper said:

Tau.Neutrino said:

Cant people see the relationship between chemicals in the body and behavior?

people always have choices and generally react for a reward the reward in reflection may not be sufficient to sustain the person but in the moment it was.

for example having your needs met immediately is common for 2 year olds and sharing is a foreign developing concept but swapping might be possible. Biting another toddler may mean the two year old got the toy they wanted (their needs were met “the reward”) the consequences of being in trouble or isolated from friends is not pleasant (“not meeting needs”) this reaction doesn’t sustain the reward but the two year old is always interested in the needs only and always. developmentally this normal BUT not all two year olds bite to have their needs met , or continue to have their needs met by biting.

Just saying I am two years old and therefore I can continue to bite you to have my needs met is not going to cut it because socially there will be a rebellion from peers and more in some way.

There is scope for learning or redirecting or swapping one reaction with at least one other usually just saying the chemicals made me do it when new guidance support is introduced . Meaning there are often non chemical therapies to practise that will enhance better chemistry of the brain and the social successes increase and positive influences of congruent relationships would increase. if that makes sense to you.

yes there are interactions between the environment and the human body

it goes something like Environment > Perceptions > Process > Reaction > Environment

the Environment is the external world, perceptions, seeing and hearing > Processes are the choices being made in the brain, reaction, in this case a decision to bite, and Environment the other person being bitten

and consequences then follow in the external world

Tau.Neutrino said:

monkey skipper said:

Tau.Neutrino said:

Cant people see the relationship between chemicals in the body and behavior?

people always have choices and generally react for a reward the reward in reflection may not be sufficient to sustain the person but in the moment it was.

for example having your needs met immediately is common for 2 year olds and sharing is a foreign developing concept but swapping might be possible. Biting another toddler may mean the two year old got the toy they wanted (their needs were met “the reward”) the consequences of being in trouble or isolated from friends is not pleasant (“not meeting needs”) this reaction doesn’t sustain the reward but the two year old is always interested in the needs only and always. developmentally this normal BUT not all two year olds bite to have their needs met , or continue to have their needs met by biting.

Just saying I am two years old and therefore I can continue to bite you to have my needs met is not going to cut it because socially there will be a rebellion from peers and more in some way.

There is scope for learning or redirecting or swapping one reaction with at least one other usually just saying the chemicals made me do it when new guidance support is introduced . Meaning there are often non chemical therapies to practise that will enhance better chemistry of the brain and the social successes increase and positive influences of congruent relationships would increase. if that makes sense to you.

yes there are interactions between the environment and the human body

it goes something like Environment > Perceptions > Process > Reaction > Environment

the Environment is the external world, perceptions, seeing and hearing > Processes are the choices being made in the brain, reaction, in this case a decision to bite, and Environment the other person being bitten

and consequences then follow in the external world

id , ego and super ego

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Id,_ego_and_super-ego

Cymek said:

diddly-squat said:

Tau.Neutrino said:

Cant people see the relationship between chemicals in the body and behavior?

yes, but the point is that psychologists look to amend behaviors through (mostly) cognitive techniques… it’s psychiatrists that (mostly) utilize neurological treatments.

Yeah otherwise you could get a psychotherapist saying “Well Mr Smith, I feel talking it out isn’t helping, I’, gonna try some homemade electroshock treatment instead, where’s my wire strippers and that extension cord”

Once the behavior to emotions has been understood, and which trace chemicals have been found to activate those emotions,

It would be more like a psychologist recommending certain medications to a psychologist,

for example someone being treated who has anger problems,

It cannot be done at present because the human brain is not fully understood.

Tau.Neutrino said:

Cymek said:

diddly-squat said:

yes, but the point is that psychologists look to amend behaviors through (mostly) cognitive techniques… it’s psychiatrists that (mostly) utilize neurological treatments.

Yeah otherwise you could get a psychotherapist saying “Well Mr Smith, I feel talking it out isn’t helping, I’, gonna try some homemade electroshock treatment instead, where’s my wire strippers and that extension cord”

Once the behavior to emotions has been understood, and which trace chemicals have been found to activate those emotions,

It would be more like a psychologist recommending certain medications to a psychologist,

for example someone being treated who has anger problems,

It cannot be done at present because the human brain is not fully understood.

opps

It would be more like a psychologist recommending certain medications to a psychiatrist

I wonder what Freud would think of Trump?

monkey skipper said:

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Id,_ego_and_super-ego

Interesting, thanks.

Not all psychologists would have to study specific branches of neuroscience.

Think of it as another branch of psychology.

Ill be happy once that gap is closed.

mollwollfumble said:

Tau.Neutrino said:

Psychology biggest problem is not understanding the chemicals and makeup of the human brain.

Psychology needs to understand the relationship between behavior and chemicals in the body.

once that is done there should be no more fads

You want to tell Freud that?

Freud had a liking for cocaine.

Tau.Neutrino said:

I wonder what Freud would think of Trump?

He’d probably say he’s got an affliction for young snatch. Meaning he’d rather sleep with the daughterboard than the motherboard.

monkey skipper said:

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Id,_ego_and_super-ego

All that would come under process reaction

Environment > Perception > Process > Reaction > Perception > Environment

Consciousness / Soul / Psyche can be very complex depending on the person

I can see the headline

outbreak of psychological mindedness finds autism