The twins and both doing Othello for their Yr12 English Shakespearean analysis… I really have no idea about the play other then a high level understanding of who the characters are…

What I really need to understand is the following

• what is the core message of the play
• what is a real life example that could be used to demonstrate themes of jealousy in the play

Of course we could google this and sift through the multitude of results, but you know… Everyone Loves Iago

Also, any other good Othello references would be welcome…

Soz, I did Macbeth.

In my view there is no “message” in the play. It isn’t one of Jesus’s parables or Aesop’s fables. It tells a story and was written to entertain people and raise revenue.

Readers can imbue what messages they will to it. Some of the lessons people have drawn from it in different times are:
Affable people can’t be trusted
Black people can’t ever really be civilised, or that mixed raced relationships don’t work
Good people are susceptible to manipulation by bad people

For me, if there is any message in Othello it is “Don’t believe the first thing you are told. Seek confirmation from multiple sources, especially in crucial matters.”

dv said:

In my view there is no “message” in the play. It isn’t one of Jesus’s parables or Aesop’s fables. It tells a story and was written to entertain people and raise revenue.

Readers can imbue what messages they will to it. Some of the lessons people have drawn from it in different times are:
Affable people can’t be trusted
Black people can’t ever really be civilised, or that mixed raced relationships don’t work
Good people are susceptible to manipulation by bad people

For me, if there is any message in Othello it is “Don’t believe the first thing you are told. Seek confirmation from multiple sources, especially in crucial matters.”

That seems like a pretty good message.

dv said:

In my view there is no “message” in the play. It isn’t one of Jesus’s parables or Aesop’s fables. It tells a story and was written to entertain people and raise revenue.

Readers can imbue what messages they will to it. Some of the lessons people have drawn from it in different times are:
Affable people can’t be trusted
Black people can’t ever really be civilised, or that mixed raced relationships don’t work
Good people are susceptible to manipulation by bad people

For me, if there is any message in Othello it is “Don’t believe the first thing you are told. Seek confirmation from multiple sources, especially in crucial matters.”

perfect, thanks…

the task asks to discuss the contemporary relevance of Shakespeare using evidence from Othello – can you think of good examples to illustrate themes of jealousy in the play?

dv said:

In my view there is no “message” in the play. It isn’t one of Jesus’s parables or Aesop’s fables. It tells a story and was written to entertain people and raise revenue.

It sounds as though you are suggesting that any popular entertainment can’t have any deeper meaning?

Maybe Papa dudley needs to read Othello again?

Witty Rejoinder said:

dv said:

In my view there is no “message” in the play. It isn’t one of Jesus’s parables or Aesop’s fables. It tells a story and was written to entertain people and raise revenue.

It sounds as though you are suggesting that any popular entertainment can’t have any deeper meaning?

I’m not saying that, and there are some examples that have clearly been written with a single “message”. But I don’t think Othello is one of them, particularly.

kii said:

Maybe Papa dudley needs to read Othello again?

Begone witch!

Double, double toil and trouble;
Fire burn and caldron bubble.
Fillet of a fenny snake,
In the caldron boil and bake;
Eye of newt and toe of frog,
Wool of bat and tongue of dog,
Adder’s fork and blind-worm’s sting,
Lizard’s leg and howlet’s wing,
For a charm of powerful trouble,
Like a hell-broth boil and bubble.

Double, double toil and trouble;
Fire burn and caldron bubble.
Cool it with a baboon’s blood,
Then the charm is firm and good.

kii said:

Maybe Papa dudley needs to read Othello again?

My job is not to do the work for them, but to help guide them toward resources they can use so that they can do it for themselves…

Getting assistance assistance from people I know are well versed in the play seems a good place to start…

Witty Rejoinder said:

kii said:

Maybe Papa dudley needs to read Othello again?

Begone witch!

Double, double toil and trouble;
Fire burn and caldron bubble.
Fillet of a fenny snake,
In the caldron boil and bake;
Eye of newt and toe of frog,
Wool of bat and tongue of dog,
Adder’s fork and blind-worm’s sting,
Lizard’s leg and howlet’s wing,
For a charm of powerful trouble,
Like a hell-broth boil and bubble.

Double, double toil and trouble;
Fire burn and caldron bubble.
Cool it with a baboon’s blood,
Then the charm is firm and good.

what the dickens???

diddly-squat said:

kii said:

Maybe Papa dudley needs to read Othello again?

My job is not to do the work for them, but to help guide them toward resources they can use so that they can do it for themselves…

Getting assistance assistance from people I know are well versed in the play seems a good place to start…

Did I say to read it and do the work for them?

No, have intelligent discussions with them and get them to do the thinking. Original thinking.

If I were to find contemporary examples from real life that reflect the themes of Othello, I’d probably look to fake news. Iago is the Daily Mail, Othello is the UK’s voting public, Desdemona is the EU.

diddly-squat said:

dv said:

In my view there is no “message” in the play. It isn’t one of Jesus’s parables or Aesop’s fables. It tells a story and was written to entertain people and raise revenue.

Readers can imbue what messages they will to it. Some of the lessons people have drawn from it in different times are:
Affable people can’t be trusted
Black people can’t ever really be civilised, or that mixed raced relationships don’t work
Good people are susceptible to manipulation by bad people

For me, if there is any message in Othello it is “Don’t believe the first thing you are told. Seek confirmation from multiple sources, especially in crucial matters.”

perfect, thanks…

the task asks to discuss the contemporary relevance of Shakespeare using evidence from Othello – can you think of good examples to illustrate themes of jealousy in the play?

I mean it is somewhat trite to point to cases where people have killed their spouses out of jealousy and they aren’t rare, Tammy Lynn Talford being a recent one. I can’t think of any prominent cases that reflect Othello in a deeper sense, in that the infidelity was completely imaginary or the person was egged on by some trouble maker.

>In my view there is no “message” in the play.

dv is correct..

“It is a tale
Told by an idiot, full of sound and fury
Signifying nothing.”

Much like the Bible except it’s well written.

Ian said:

>In my view there is no “message” in the play.

dv is correct..

“It is a tale
Told by an idiot, full of sound and fury
Signifying nothing.”

Much like the Bible except it’s well written.

For a crappy first draft its sold a lot of copies, no accounting for taste

sounds good

>>I can’t think of any prominent cases that reflect Othello in a deeper sense, in that the infidelity was completely imaginary or the person was egged on by some trouble maker.<<

Sounds like Facebook.

diddly-squat said:

The twins and both doing Othello for their Yr12 English Shakespearean analysis… I really have no idea about the play other then a high level understanding of who the characters are…

What I really need to understand is the following

• what is the core message of the play
• what is a real life example that could be used to demonstrate themes of jealousy in the play

Of course we could google this and sift through the multitude of results, but you know… Everyone Loves Iago

Also, any other good Othello references would be welcome…

I did Macbeth, too. It’s said that in Hamlet, Shakespeare put as much into the play as he could. Whereas in Othello, Shakespeare left everything out that was not totally essential.

As a result, the plot of Othello is easy to follow.

It only just occurred to me that a modern saying could be considered a core of Othello. The saying is “Old age and deviousness will always defeat youth and enthusiasm”.

It’s well known that Othello has a racist aspect, the black man being defeated by the white.

The devious Iago has made himself trusted by Othello. An opportunity for destruction occurs when Iago’s wife comes into possession of the handkerchief that Othello gave Desdemona. Iago uses that to make Othello suspect Desdemona of impropriety, leading to the downfall of both Desdemona and Othello.

Although “jealousy” is usually quoted as the reason for Othello’s downfall, it would be fairer to say that his downfall is trusting the wrong person.

Why doesn’t Othello trust Desdemona? Is it low self esteem? Or is it Iago’s poisonous words from before the play began?

Real life example?

Well, for Othello read Charles. For Desdemona read Lady Di. And for Iago read James Hewitt.

Or. For Othello read Andrew. For Desdemona read Fergie. And for Iago read John Bryan.

>what is the core message of the play

Never go full blackface, unless it’s Shakespeare.

Bubblecar said:

>what is the core message of the play

Never go full blackface, unless it’s Shakespeare.

Omg… the Car just made reference to a popular Naughties fillum.

Witty Rejoinder said:

Bubblecar said:

>what is the core message of the play

Never go full blackface, unless it’s Shakespeare.

Omg… the Car just made reference to a popular Naughties fillum.

And it was quite a tidy meta-reference too.

Bubblecar said:

>what is the core message of the play

Never go full blackface, unless it’s Shakespeare.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PHvX0u-KWgo