http://www.abc.net.au/news/2017-06-24/hobart-shipwrights-arms-hotel-has-fire-started-by-oily-towels/8649084

Mr Terry said the fire service recommended people use photo-electric type smoke alarms, which were able to pick up smouldering types of fires and issue an alert.

The Shipwright’s Arms is fitted out with ionisation smoke alarms, which did not pick up the fire.

Once our dishwasher malfunctioned in the middle of the night. We were woken up by the sound of the baby monitor in our room, which screeched after the power had cut out. As soon as I got out of bed, I noticed the house was full of smoke up high near the ceilings. There is a smoke alarm there, but it still wasn’t doing anything.

Why did the smoke alarm fail to work?

Is smoke from smouldering really different from normal smoke?

Is this story from Hobart really a case of spontaneous combustion?

Photoelectric Smoke Alarms
Photoelectric smoke alarms are designed to ‘see’ the smoke before it bursts into flames. They are able to detect slow burning smouldering fires significantly earlier than ionisation smoke alarms. As a result of early detection, occupants are able to escape the property safely while the level of smoke is low and the air is breathable.

Ionisation Smoke Alarms
Ionisation smoke alarms are designed to ‘smell’ the smoke that comes from the flames of a fire. They are able to detect fast flaming fires. Because ionisation smoke alarms take longer to respond to smouldering fires, breathing and visibility problems may occur, making escape more difficult for occupants.

http://www.smokealarmsaustralia.com.au/types-of-smoke-alarms

appears to be the right info judging by other sites. so the alarm didn’t fail, it would have gone off sooner or later.

Speedy said:

Is this story from Hobart really a case of spontaneous combustion?

Yeah, oily towels (vegetable oils, as used for massage) are a common cause of spontaneous combustion.

Rule 303 said:

Speedy said:

Is this story from Hobart really a case of spontaneous combustion?

Yeah, oily towels (vegetable oils, as used for massage) are a common cause of spontaneous combustion.

yeah, i got real hot after an oily massage as well.

Rule 303 said:

Speedy said:

Is this story from Hobart really a case of spontaneous combustion?

Yeah, oily towels (vegetable oils, as used for massage) are a common cause of spontaneous combustion.

wow – really?
How does that work?

party_pants said:

Rule 303 said:

Speedy said:

Is this story from Hobart really a case of spontaneous combustion?

Yeah, oily towels (vegetable oils, as used for massage) are a common cause of spontaneous combustion.

wow – really?
How does that work?

Yep. Dunno, but it’s common in some timber finishes (Danish Oil, Tung oil), too.

party_pants said:

Rule 303 said:

Speedy said:

Is this story from Hobart really a case of spontaneous combustion?

Yeah, oily towels (vegetable oils, as used for massage) are a common cause of spontaneous combustion.

wow – really?
How does that work?

aerobic bacteria. oxidation. either resiuls in a heat build up. usually in low ignition point materials.

Speedy said:

http://www.abc.net.au/news/2017-06-24/hobart-shipwrights-arms-hotel-has-fire-started-by-oily-towels/8649084

Mr Terry said the fire service recommended people use photo-electric type smoke alarms, which were able to pick up smouldering types of fires and issue an alert.

The Shipwright’s Arms is fitted out with ionisation smoke alarms, which did not pick up the fire.

Once our dishwasher malfunctioned in the middle of the night. We were woken up by the sound of the baby monitor in our room, which screeched after the power had cut out. As soon as I got out of bed, I noticed the house was full of smoke up high near the ceilings. There is a smoke alarm there, but it still wasn’t doing anything.

Why did the smoke alarm fail to work?

Is smoke from smouldering really different from normal smoke?

Is this story from Hobart really a case of spontaneous combustion?

(Shudder)

Danger – do not take this advice!

1. Photoelectric smoke alarms are not as sensitive, so would go off too late.

2. Ionising smoke alarms do not “smell” smoke. That’s ridiculous. They work on same basic principle as a photoelectric smoke alarm – opacity of smoke. But in this case opacity to alpha rays rather than light.

> Is smoke from smouldering really different from normal smoke?

No.

> Why did the smoke alarm fail to work?

Installation in the wrong location would be my guess. Like inside a room with the door shut. But it could just be flat battery. If there’s a power failure then of course the baby alarm would go off first.

mollwollfumble said:

Speedy said:

http://www.abc.net.au/news/2017-06-24/hobart-shipwrights-arms-hotel-has-fire-started-by-oily-towels/8649084

Mr Terry said the fire service recommended people use photo-electric type smoke alarms, which were able to pick up smouldering types of fires and issue an alert.

The Shipwright’s Arms is fitted out with ionisation smoke alarms, which did not pick up the fire.

Once our dishwasher malfunctioned in the middle of the night. We were woken up by the sound of the baby monitor in our room, which screeched after the power had cut out. As soon as I got out of bed, I noticed the house was full of smoke up high near the ceilings. There is a smoke alarm there, but it still wasn’t doing anything.

Why did the smoke alarm fail to work?

Is smoke from smouldering really different from normal smoke?

Is this story from Hobart really a case of spontaneous combustion?

(Shudder)

Danger – do not take this advice!

1. Photoelectric smoke alarms are not as sensitive, so would go off too late.

2. Ionising smoke alarms do not “smell” smoke. That’s ridiculous. They work on same basic principle as a photoelectric smoke alarm – opacity of smoke. But in this case opacity to alpha rays rather than light.

> Is smoke from smouldering really different from normal smoke?

No.

> Why did the smoke alarm fail to work?

Installation in the wrong location would be my guess. Like inside a room with the door shut. But it could just be flat battery. If there’s a power failure then of course the baby alarm would go off first.

My smoke alarms are placed at 6 foot on the wall. They won’t even let me make darker toast. Smoke alarms on the ceiling can’t see the smoke as well or at all.

roughbarked said:

mollwollfumble said:

Speedy said:

http://www.abc.net.au/news/2017-06-24/hobart-shipwrights-arms-hotel-has-fire-started-by-oily-towels/8649084

Mr Terry said the fire service recommended people use photo-electric type smoke alarms, which were able to pick up smouldering types of fires and issue an alert.

The Shipwright’s Arms is fitted out with ionisation smoke alarms, which did not pick up the fire.

Once our dishwasher malfunctioned in the middle of the night. We were woken up by the sound of the baby monitor in our room, which screeched after the power had cut out. As soon as I got out of bed, I noticed the house was full of smoke up high near the ceilings. There is a smoke alarm there, but it still wasn’t doing anything.

Why did the smoke alarm fail to work?

Is smoke from smouldering really different from normal smoke?

Is this story from Hobart really a case of spontaneous combustion?

(Shudder)

Danger – do not take this advice!

1. Photoelectric smoke alarms are not as sensitive, so would go off too late.

2. Ionising smoke alarms do not “smell” smoke. That’s ridiculous. They work on same basic principle as a photoelectric smoke alarm – opacity of smoke. But in this case opacity to alpha rays rather than light.

> Is smoke from smouldering really different from normal smoke?

No.

> Why did the smoke alarm fail to work?

Installation in the wrong location would be my guess. Like inside a room with the door shut. But it could just be flat battery. If there’s a power failure then of course the baby alarm would go off first.

My smoke alarms are placed at 6 foot on the wall. They won’t even let me make darker toast. Smoke alarms on the ceiling can’t see the smoke as well or at all.

I have a man coming on Wednesday to give me a new alarm. The present one sounds if there is a battery in it regardless of conditions. The battery voltage is 8.84V so it must be some internal problem.

Tamb said:

roughbarked said:

mollwollfumble said:

(Shudder)

Danger – do not take this advice!

1. Photoelectric smoke alarms are not as sensitive, so would go off too late.

2. Ionising smoke alarms do not “smell” smoke. That’s ridiculous. They work on same basic principle as a photoelectric smoke alarm – opacity of smoke. But in this case opacity to alpha rays rather than light.

> Is smoke from smouldering really different from normal smoke?

No.

> Why did the smoke alarm fail to work?

Installation in the wrong location would be my guess. Like inside a room with the door shut. But it could just be flat battery. If there’s a power failure then of course the baby alarm would go off first.

My smoke alarms are placed at 6 foot on the wall. They won’t even let me make darker toast. Smoke alarms on the ceiling can’t see the smoke as well or at all.

I have a man coming on Wednesday to give me a new alarm. The present one sounds if there is a battery in it regardless of conditions. The battery voltage is 8.84V so it must be some internal problem.

Maybe the contacts. It isn’t about the battery voltage but wheter it is delivering the right current.

roughbarked said:

Tamb said:

roughbarked said:

My smoke alarms are placed at 6 foot on the wall. They won’t even let me make darker toast. Smoke alarms on the ceiling can’t see the smoke as well or at all.

I have a man coming on Wednesday to give me a new alarm. The present one sounds if there is a battery in it regardless of conditions. The battery voltage is 8.84V so it must be some internal problem.

Maybe the contacts. It isn’t about the battery voltage but wheter it is delivering the right current.

Contacts looked OK but I squirted them with contact cleaner. Still squarking.

Tamb said:

roughbarked said:

Tamb said:

I have a man coming on Wednesday to give me a new alarm. The present one sounds if there is a battery in it regardless of conditions. The battery voltage is 8.84V so it must be some internal problem.

Maybe the contacts. It isn’t about the battery voltage but wheter it is delivering the right current.

Contacts looked OK but I squirted them with contact cleaner. Still squarking.

A big problem about batteries is how long they have been on the shelf before you use them. Anyway, I bought cheap Chinese smoke alarms from Bunnings and they haven’t faltered. Cost me less than five dollars for two. Hang on the screws on the wall, two seconds.

roughbarked said:

Tamb said:

roughbarked said:

Maybe the contacts. It isn’t about the battery voltage but wheter it is delivering the right current.

Contacts looked OK but I squirted them with contact cleaner. Still squarking.

A big problem about batteries is how long they have been on the shelf before you use them. Anyway, I bought cheap Chinese smoke alarms from Bunnings and they haven’t faltered. Cost me less than five dollars for two. Hang on the screws on the wall, two seconds.

The gummint gives me free batteries every year & when I show the bloke how this one won’t stop squarking I’ll prolly get a new alarm for nix.

Tamb said:

The gummint gives me free batteries every year & when I show the bloke how this one won’t stop squarking I’ll prolly get a new alarm for nix.

Goldurn gummint…

mcgoon said:

Tamb said:

The gummint gives me free batteries every year & when I show the bloke how this one won’t stop squarking I’ll prolly get a new alarm for nix.

Goldurn gummint…

Gotta say they were very supportive during mz Tamb’s illness.

Tamb said:

mcgoon said:

Tamb said:

The gummint gives me free batteries every year & when I show the bloke how this one won’t stop squarking I’ll prolly get a new alarm for nix.

Goldurn gummint…

Gotta say they were very supportive during mz Tamb’s illness.

“I’m from the government, and i’m here to help you’?. And they meant it?

Tamb said:

roughbarked said:

Tamb said:

Contacts looked OK but I squirted them with contact cleaner. Still squarking.

A big problem about batteries is how long they have been on the shelf before you use them. Anyway, I bought cheap Chinese smoke alarms from Bunnings and they haven’t faltered. Cost me less than five dollars for two. Hang on the screws on the wall, two seconds.

The gummint gives me free batteries every year & when I show the bloke how this one won’t stop squarking I’ll prolly get a new alarm for nix.

Lucky duck. My gubbmint is always looking for more ways to get more money out of me.

roughbarked said:

Tamb said:

roughbarked said:

A big problem about batteries is how long they have been on the shelf before you use them. Anyway, I bought cheap Chinese smoke alarms from Bunnings and they haven’t faltered. Cost me less than five dollars for two. Hang on the screws on the wall, two seconds.

The gummint gives me free batteries every year & when I show the bloke how this one won’t stop squarking I’ll prolly get a new alarm for nix.

Lucky duck. My gubbmint is always looking for more ways to get more money out of me.

Yes, Tamb, just what is this munificent ‘gubmint’ of which you speak so highly? It’s not of type that rest of us seem to have encountered.

mcgoon said:

Tamb said:

mcgoon said:

Goldurn gummint…

Gotta say they were very supportive during mz Tamb’s illness.

“I’m from the government, and i’m here to help you’?. And they meant it?

Yes. Both sides of politics. The agencies which they set up provided everything we needed ( except a cure)

‘The brig Cyprus: How an English surfer solved the mystery of an Australian pirate ship in Japan’ – ABC News

Cap’n Bill Swallow, at your service. Yarrr…

mcgoon said:

roughbarked said:

Tamb said:

The gummint gives me free batteries every year & when I show the bloke how this one won’t stop squarking I’ll prolly get a new alarm for nix.

Lucky duck. My gubbmint is always looking for more ways to get more money out of me.

Yes, Tamb, just what is this munificent ‘gubmint’ of which you speak so highly? It’s not of type that rest of us seem to have encountered.

Federal & State gummint agencies for us pensioners. Free docs, specialists, flights, subsidised accommodation & travel.

‘Woman trapped under Melbourne house rescued after neighbour calls for help’ – ABC News

““It was a strange situation. We’re unsure of why the female was under the house and that’ll be part of the investigations later on,” (MFB Commander Roger Chitty) said.

“We did try to get underneath the house but the confined space made that impossible.”

Police said it was not the woman’s house.”

For all it’s pretension at sophistication, Melbourne contains much weirdness under its facade.

Tamb said:

Federal & State gummint agencies for us pensioners. Free docs, specialists, flights, subsidised accommodation & travel.

When were you an MP?

‘Woman under house’ item should have been in Chat. sorry.

mcgoon said:

‘Woman trapped under Melbourne house rescued after neighbour calls for help’ – ABC News

““It was a strange situation. We’re unsure of why the female was under the house and that’ll be part of the investigations later on,” (MFB Commander Roger Chitty) said.

“We did try to get underneath the house but the confined space made that impossible.”

Police said it was not the woman’s house.”

For all it’s pretension at sophistication, Melbourne contains much weirdness under its facade.

And also under it’s houses.

Tamb said:

And also under it’s houses.

:)

mcgoon said:

Tamb said:

Federal & State gummint agencies for us pensioners. Free docs, specialists, flights, subsidised accommodation & travel.

When were you an MP?

You should be able to tell from my posts that I’m too honest to ever have been one.

Tamb said:

mcgoon said:

Tamb said:

Federal & State gummint agencies for us pensioners. Free docs, specialists, flights, subsidised accommodation & travel.

When were you an MP?

You should be able to tell from my posts that I’m too honest to ever have been one.

I regret that i’ll be unable to take advantage of such boons, as i won’t be able to afford to retire.

mcgoon said:

Tamb said:

mcgoon said:

When were you an MP?

You should be able to tell from my posts that I’m too honest to ever have been one.

I regret that i’ll be unable to take advantage of such boons, as i won’t be able to afford to retire.

I worked for 45 years & mz Tamb worked for 40 so we managed to retire debt free.

mcgoon said:

Tamb said:

mcgoon said:

When were you an MP?

You should be able to tell from my posts that I’m too honest to ever have been one.

I regret that i’ll be unable to take advantage of such boons, as i won’t be able to afford to retire.

To much avo on toast?

Tamb said:

mcgoon said:

Tamb said:

You should be able to tell from my posts that I’m too honest to ever have been one.

I regret that i’ll be unable to take advantage of such boons, as i won’t be able to afford to retire.

I worked for 45 years & mz Tamb worked for 40 so we managed to retire debt free.

I’m coming up for 42 years in harness. Mrs S was a Reg Nurse for over 45 yrs.

It’s not the avo on toast that’s keeping me at work – it’s rates, electricity, gas, rego, insurance, vet bills, med fund membership, food, clothing, etc. etc.

mollwollfumble said:

1. Photoelectric smoke alarms are not as sensitive, so would go off too late.

2. Ionising smoke alarms do not “smell” smoke. That’s ridiculous. They work on same basic principle as a photoelectric smoke alarm – opacity of smoke. But in this case opacity to alpha rays rather than light.

> Is smoke from smouldering really different from normal smoke?

No.

> Why did the smoke alarm fail to work?

Installation in the wrong location would be my guess. Like inside a room with the door shut. But it could just be flat battery. If there’s a power failure then of course the baby alarm would go off first.

Thanks moll.

I think now we have one of each type at home. The new style one has never gone off, but the old one will pick up burnt toast with no visible sign of smoke.

Batteries were good on that occasion. Location still the same.

mcgoon said:

For all it’s pretension at sophistication, Melbourne contains much weirdness under its facade.

Floor. Under its floor.

The facade is at the front.

I wonder if you can get a Smoke Alert, I don’t want to be alarmed.

Peak Warming Man said:

I wonder if you can get a Smoke Alert, I don’t want to be alarmed.

All jokes aside, yes.

Speedy said:

mollwollfumble said:

1. Photoelectric smoke alarms are not as sensitive, so would go off too late.

2. Ionising smoke alarms do not “smell” smoke. That’s ridiculous. They work on same basic principle as a photoelectric smoke alarm – opacity of smoke. But in this case opacity to alpha rays rather than light.

> Is smoke from smouldering really different from normal smoke?

No.

> Why did the smoke alarm fail to work?

Installation in the wrong location would be my guess. Like inside a room with the door shut. But it could just be flat battery. If there’s a power failure then of course the baby alarm would go off first.

Thanks moll.

I think now we have one of each type at home. The new style one has never gone off, but the old one will pick up burnt toast with no visible sign of smoke.

Batteries were good on that occasion. Location still the same.

personally i would go with what the majority of the web says. “smell” was in quotes so what that means is, i take, thinner density and smaller particles. and “see” would be the opposite.

ChrispenEvan said:

Speedy said:

mollwollfumble said:

1. Photoelectric smoke alarms are not as sensitive, so would go off too late.

2. Ionising smoke alarms do not “smell” smoke. That’s ridiculous. They work on same basic principle as a photoelectric smoke alarm – opacity of smoke. But in this case opacity to alpha rays rather than light.

> Is smoke from smouldering really different from normal smoke?

No.

> Why did the smoke alarm fail to work?

Installation in the wrong location would be my guess. Like inside a room with the door shut. But it could just be flat battery. If there’s a power failure then of course the baby alarm would go off first.

Thanks moll.

I think now we have one of each type at home. The new style one has never gone off, but the old one will pick up burnt toast with no visible sign of smoke.

Batteries were good on that occasion. Location still the same.

personally i would go with what the majority of the web says. “smell” was in quotes so what that means is, i take, thinner density and smaller particles. and “see” would be the opposite.

Yep, I think that’s it.

ChrispenEvan said:

Speedy said:

mollwollfumble said:

1. Photoelectric smoke alarms are not as sensitive, so would go off too late.

2. Ionising smoke alarms do not “smell” smoke. That’s ridiculous. They work on same basic principle as a photoelectric smoke alarm – opacity of smoke. But in this case opacity to alpha rays rather than light.

> Is smoke from smouldering really different from normal smoke?

No.

> Why did the smoke alarm fail to work?

Installation in the wrong location would be my guess. Like inside a room with the door shut. But it could just be flat battery. If there’s a power failure then of course the baby alarm would go off first.

Thanks moll.

I think now we have one of each type at home. The new style one has never gone off, but the old one will pick up burnt toast with no visible sign of smoke.

Batteries were good on that occasion. Location still the same.

personally i would go with what the majority of the web says. “smell” was in quotes so what that means is, i take, thinner density and smaller particles. and “see” would be the opposite.

http://blog.sdfirealarms.co.uk/ionisation-smoke-alarms-optical-smoke-alarms/

basically says what i did.

ChrispenEvan said:

ChrispenEvan said:

Speedy said:

Thanks moll.

I think now we have one of each type at home. The new style one has never gone off, but the old one will pick up burnt toast with no visible sign of smoke.

Batteries were good on that occasion. Location still the same.

personally i would go with what the majority of the web says. “smell” was in quotes so what that means is, i take, thinner density and smaller particles. and “see” would be the opposite.

http://blog.sdfirealarms.co.uk/ionisation-smoke-alarms-optical-smoke-alarms/

basically says what i did.

Where should you install them?

_Ionisation smoke alarms are more suitable for bedrooms and optical smoke alarms are more recommended for hallways, landings, stairs and living rooms, but not for kitchens.

So all in all, the basic difference between both types are that Ionisation smoke alarms are generally more effective at detecting flaming fires whilst photoelectric smoke alarms are a better option to protect your property from smouldering fires. You should really take into consideration acquiring both of them for maximum protection, but for your information, combination alarms that include both technologies are managing to fill a gap in the fire detection market._

I guess one can never have a smoke alarm in the kitchen.

When we first tried cooking in our caravan the smoke alarm went off. The entire caravan is smaller than a kitchen. Fire alarm was removed and replaced 3 months later when we returned home :/

Speedy said:

ChrispenEvan said:

ChrispenEvan said:

personally i would go with what the majority of the web says. “smell” was in quotes so what that means is, i take, thinner density and smaller particles. and “see” would be the opposite.

http://blog.sdfirealarms.co.uk/ionisation-smoke-alarms-optical-smoke-alarms/

basically says what i did.

Where should you install them?

_Ionisation smoke alarms are more suitable for bedrooms and optical smoke alarms are more recommended for hallways, landings, stairs and living rooms, but not for kitchens.

So all in all, the basic difference between both types are that Ionisation smoke alarms are generally more effective at detecting flaming fires whilst photoelectric smoke alarms are a better option to protect your property from smouldering fires. You should really take into consideration acquiring both of them for maximum protection, but for your information, combination alarms that include both technologies are managing to fill a gap in the fire detection market._

I guess one can never have a smoke alarm in the kitchen.

When we first tried cooking in our caravan the smoke alarm went off. The entire caravan is smaller than a kitchen. Fire alarm was removed and replaced 3 months later when we returned home :/

They need to develop alarms suitable for kitchen. maybe study the size or burnt toast particles and put a filter on the alarm to ignore them.

There were a couple of times that the printmaking dept caught on fire while I was there. The department went through a lot of rags. There was a bin for clean rag, one for rags that could be used again and a bin for ones that were thoroughly used. You might use a clean one to work upon a plate or clean up for registration. You might use a partly used one for cleaning up an inky mess with white spirit and oil. We all knew it wasn’t good to load the dirty rag to overfull and it was important to keep the lid closed.

I have been a bit paranoid since starting to print at home. I don’t really have a system set up yet.

sarahs mum said:

There were a couple of times that the printmaking dept caught on fire while I was there. The department went through a lot of rags. There was a bin for clean rag, one for rags that could be used again and a bin for ones that were thoroughly used. You might use a clean one to work upon a plate or clean up for registration. You might use a partly used one for cleaning up an inky mess with white spirit and oil. We all knew it wasn’t good to load the dirty rag to overfull and it was important to keep the lid closed.

I have been a bit paranoid since starting to print at home. I don’t really have a system set up yet.

just put the really soiled ones outside and not in a heap. and any inside spread them out. Working as a printer we had lots, far more than you would ever use, and never had a problem.

on subject fires

dad bought a small, cheap fan heater the other day, plugged it in and it smoked a lot and caught fire

he rang the people he bought it off and informed them promptly, not long after they plugged one in and same, smoked and caught fire, and rang dad to let him know.

so looks like that product will be getting recalled.

ChrispenEvan said:

sarahs mum said:

There were a couple of times that the printmaking dept caught on fire while I was there. The department went through a lot of rags. There was a bin for clean rag, one for rags that could be used again and a bin for ones that were thoroughly used. You might use a clean one to work upon a plate or clean up for registration. You might use a partly used one for cleaning up an inky mess with white spirit and oil. We all knew it wasn’t good to load the dirty rag to overfull and it was important to keep the lid closed.

I have been a bit paranoid since starting to print at home. I don’t really have a system set up yet.

just put the really soiled ones outside and not in a heap. and any inside spread them out. Working as a printer we had lots, far more than you would ever use, and never had a problem.

okay. spreading them out, and throwing then out in small quantities is what I have been doing.

sarahs mum said:

ChrispenEvan said:

sarahs mum said:

There were a couple of times that the printmaking dept caught on fire while I was there. The department went through a lot of rags. There was a bin for clean rag, one for rags that could be used again and a bin for ones that were thoroughly used. You might use a clean one to work upon a plate or clean up for registration. You might use a partly used one for cleaning up an inky mess with white spirit and oil. We all knew it wasn’t good to load the dirty rag to overfull and it was important to keep the lid closed.

I have been a bit paranoid since starting to print at home. I don’t really have a system set up yet.

just put the really soiled ones outside and not in a heap. and any inside spread them out. Working as a printer we had lots, far more than you would ever use, and never had a problem.

okay. spreading them out, and throwing then out in small quantities is what I have been doing.

sounds good.